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Thread: Daniel Howell, Va. professor: ‘Arm as many good people as possible’

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    Daniel Howell, Va. professor: ‘Arm as many good people as possible’

    “Good people with guns don’t create crime, they stop it,” Mr. Howell wrote. “And no one is more law-abiding than the average concealed-carry person. A 2010 study published in the Police Quarterly found that gun owners with concealed carry permits are even more law abiding than police officers. According to another study, those with concealed carry licenses are four times less likely to commit murder than the general population.”

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...y-good-people/

    Counterpoint: No Campus Should Be Deemed Weapons Free

    http://www.liberty.edu/news/index.cf...495&MID=198317

    http://www.insidesources.com/counter...-weapons-free/

    Good people ought to be armed as they will, with wits and guns and the truth.
    Last edited by Nightmare; 06-20-2016 at 12:31 PM.
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

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    The Orlando shooter was legally "good" up until the instant that he wasn't. Lots of warning signs, but "good" enough to buy an AR.

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    That is always the case. One is well behaved until one is not. Thank GOoDness evil thoughts are not criminal yet.
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

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    An open carrier is just "a guy with a gun" to most folks. Can't tell if they are "good" or are just "good at that moment".

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    Again, yes, the way it should be for all, except the wannabe-precogs of The Minority Report.
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by beebobby View Post
    The Orlando shooter was legally "good" up until the instant that he wasn't. Lots of warning signs, but "good" enough to buy an AR.
    The 9/11 hijackers were all good enough to remain in our nation, buy airline tickets, and get past airport security.

    In the eyes of the criminal justice system, OJ Simpson is not guilty of murdering 2 people.

    And even small minded bigots whose only purpose is to stir up crap enjoy their rights to freedom of speech. We only punish them after they falsely yell fire in the crowded theater.

    There are certain costs to be paid for living in a free society.

    Let me guess, you want to give foreign terrorists, spies, saboteurs, and/or pirates captured on the field of battle not wearing uniforms access to US criminal courts even as you want to infringe on my rights to buy, own, and carry firearms for self defense.

    Charles
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
    --Marxist.org

    "Communism and Anarchy [are], a necessary complement to one another. "
    --PETER KROPOTKIN, "Anarchism: its philosophy and ideal." 1898.

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    Quote Originally Posted by beebobby View Post
    An open carrier is just "a guy with a gun" to most folks. Can't tell if they are "good" or are just "good at that moment".
    Kind of like cops? Never quite sure when one might go off the deep end and abuse someone's rights.

    Got any solutions that don't rely on unicorns puking up rainbows and farting out gold?
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
    --Marxist.org

    "Communism and Anarchy [are], a necessary complement to one another. "
    --PETER KROPOTKIN, "Anarchism: its philosophy and ideal." 1898.

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    Quote Originally Posted by utbagpiper View Post
    Kind of like cops? Never quite sure when one might go off the deep end and abuse someone's rights.

    Got any solutions that don't rely on unicorns puking up rainbows and farting out gold?
    Have the cops check out folks walking around with ARs. Something obviously wrong with their thought process.

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    Quote Originally Posted by beebobby View Post
    Have the cops check out folks walking around with ARs. Something obviously wrong with their thought process.
    Because they don't think the way you do?

    Funny...you seem to have no problem with government use of force, or show of force.
    Sic semper evello mortem tyrannis.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stealthyeliminator
    So in actuality you have no evidence that anything wrong took place, you only believe that it could be spun to appear wrong. But it hasn't been. The truth has a funny way of coming out with persistence, even if it was spun negatively the truth would find its way because these people will not accept less.
    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    The truth causes some people so much pain they can only respond with impotent laughable insults. Life must be rough for those people.

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    Quote Originally Posted by utbagpiper View Post
    The 9/11 hijackers were all good enough to remain in our nation, buy airline tickets, and get past airport security.

    In the eyes of the criminal justice system, OJ Simpson is not guilty of murdering 2 people.

    And even small minded bigots whose only purpose is to stir up crap enjoy their rights to freedom of speech. We only punish them after they falsely yell fire in the crowded theater.

    There are certain costs to be paid for living in a free society.

    Let me guess, you want to give foreign terrorists, spies, saboteurs, and/or pirates captured on the field of battle not wearing uniforms access to US criminal courts even as you want to infringe on my rights to buy, own, and carry firearms for self defense.

    Charles
    Oh, puuuleez.

    The whole NSA/FBI turf-war thing was recognized long ago. It was recognized long ago that bureaucratic turf-war was a big part of the 9/11 terrorists being successful. Heck, even without that, one of the flight schools contacted the FBI about students who wanted to only learn to fly the plane, not land it; and, were ignored by the FBI.

    Within the last few years, one of the NSA employees at the time was interviewed.* He comes right out and says what was well established at the time--9/11 was preventable.

    That was one of the big reasons Americans got saddled with the Department of Homeland Security--one over-arching bureau to cancel out the petty infighting and bureaucratic power struggles. One over-arching bureau to break down "the wall" between the bureaucracies.

    *http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/...xcuse-911.html

    Here is an article with a bunch of links: https://www.lewrockwell.com/2016/06/...-cow-15-years/
    Last edited by Citizen; 06-20-2016 at 09:41 PM.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    citizen, et al., the infighting within the intelligent community AROUND the world, except Mossad, is frightening!! especially as evidenced by Paris' & Belgium's attacks.

    preventable...probably...will they ever be preventable ~ not likely with the current ego systems working in the different political climates and agencies.

    DHS has done nothing except bloat our economic with wasted effort(s)

    ipse
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    Please do not get confused between my personality & my attitude. My personality is who I am ~ my attitude depends on who you are and how you act.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    Oh, puuuleez.
    I don't see any disagreement between us.

    Beebobby wants to attack RKBA on the basis that government can't predict who might go nuts with a gun. I simply point out that government can't predict well enough who might engage in massive terrorism to preempt them.

    I didn't bother to elaborate on the reasons government isn't able to preempt terrorism. Incompetence and petty infighting is certainly one major problem.

    Any degree of respect for freedom of speech, freedom of religion, and privacy (being secure in our papers, persons, and effects) is another major problem even in the absence of incompetence. We all know OJ brutally murdered two innocent people. But we don't get to put in jail for that because the prosecutor failed to make his case the one and only time he gets to try to do so. OJ being legally innocent of murder is part of the price we pay for living in a free society. It is part of what we pay to (in theory at least) keep Citizen from being wrongly convicted when he is unjustly accused of a crime he didn't commit.

    So no real disagreement. I just didn't elaborate on the whys (which might be argued especially by Progs who think the government is the answer to all human failings), only on the outcomes (which are well known matters of historic record, much less subject to any arguing).

    Charles
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
    --Marxist.org

    "Communism and Anarchy [are], a necessary complement to one another. "
    --PETER KROPOTKIN, "Anarchism: its philosophy and ideal." 1898.

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    Quote Originally Posted by beebobby View Post
    Have the cops check out folks walking around with ARs. Something obviously wrong with their thought process.
    And thank you for revealing the Progs real intent.

    "The mentally ill cannot be trusted with a gun. Anyone who wants a gun must be mentally ill."

    OCDO generally prohibits discussion of long gun carrying in public places. I personally think long gun carry is not the best way to advance acceptance of RKBA in most cases.

    But how many of these folks that you want the cops to "check out" have ever actually committed a crime? Any crime anywhere close to being worthy of removing fundamental, individual, constitutionally enumerated rights? Hint: You get to read about virtually everyone of them in the paper who commits a serious crime, and almost none of those read about were out OCing their long guns prior to engaging in mass murders.

    As is common with Progs, it is YOUR thought process that is severely lacking: it lacks all rational, logical ability to see actual cause and effect. And you obviously obtain some joy from hanging out stirring up crap among those who believe differently than you do. That would seem to indicate some level of mental issue, don't you think?

    Charles
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
    --Marxist.org

    "Communism and Anarchy [are], a necessary complement to one another. "
    --PETER KROPOTKIN, "Anarchism: its philosophy and ideal." 1898.

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    Quote Originally Posted by beebobby View Post
    Have the cops check out folks walking around with ARs. Something obviously wrong with their thought process.
    99% of those folks carrying ARs are cops .... so I mostly agree. Explain to me the need for cops to have ARs? They are expressly prohibited from defending the land from foreign invaders...per our constitution.

    I foresaw the explosion of the AR sales beginning in the 80's & 90's. Once local PDs started getting them then other people obtained them as well. Nothing wrong with people getting ARs but they simply were not that popular. Also, the stigma of the weapon system's initial poor performance in Vietnam was still fresh.
    Last edited by davidmcbeth; 06-21-2016 at 01:45 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    99% of those folks carrying ARs are cops .... so I mostly agree. Explain to me the need for cops to have ARs? They are expressly prohibited from defending the land from foreign invaders...per our constitution.

    .
    And where in the constitution does it prohibit LEO's form defending against foreign invaders.

    LEO's in the rural areas have been carrying "patrol rifles" for ever I carried every thing from a bolt scout rifle to a M1 Garand that was issued to me. The sheriff was a WWII vet and thought the M1 was the bees knee. One of my favorite one was a scoped Ruger ranch rifle.

    Just because big city Law Enforcement went away from rifles doesn't mean they were not use in the rest of the country.

    When confronting armed suspects a good rifle is one of the better tools a LEO or any body else can have.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firearms Iinstuctor View Post
    And where in the constitution does it prohibit LEO's form defending against foreign invaders.

    LEO's in the rural areas have been carrying "patrol rifles" for ever I carried every thing from a bolt scout rifle to a M1 Garand that was issued to me. The sheriff was a WWII vet and thought the M1 was the bees knee. One of my favorite one was a scoped Ruger ranch rifle.

    Just because big city Law Enforcement went away from rifles doesn't mean they were not use in the rest of the country.

    When confronting armed suspects a good rifle is one of the better tools a LEO or any body else can have.
    got to love the nice LEs defending against foreign invaders:



    just saying...

    ipse
    I'm only human; I do what I can; I'm just a man; I do what I can; Don't put the blame on me; Don't put your blame on me ~ Rag'n'Bone Man.

    Please do not get confused between my personality & my attitude. My personality is who I am ~ my attitude depends on who you are and how you act.

    Remember always, do not judge someone because they sin differently than you do!

    Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain

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    Quote Originally Posted by gutshot View Post

    What about drivers of powerful vehicles capable of high speed and mass destruction? Should they be "checked out", too? Are they "good guys" or just "good at the moment"? What about earth movers on construction sights alongside a rodeway? Shouldn't cops "check" them, to make sure that they won't "just snap" and run over a bunch of people? What about people that work on highrise construction sites? They could throw down tons of materials on the heads of innocent people, better "check' them, too. What about all the cooks in every restaurant, they have access to knives. Better "check" them, too. Shouldn't we have cops to "check out" other cops to see that they haven't already "snapped"? And just because you "checked" them an hour ago, can you be sure that your "checking" didn't cause them to "snap"? Better "check" them again,.... and again,... and again,.. and again. What do you expect to be found in this endless "checking", a spontaneous confession of the desire to murder people and the request to lock them up to prevent them from committing mass murder? Who will "check out" the checkers? And who will check those people?
    Was the car designed for the military with the expressed design specs to "penetrate any enemy soldiers helmet at 500 yards"?
    http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/...ks-out-n593356

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