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A new carry method for CCP-- May save your Life.

countryclubjoe

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2013
Messages
2,505
Location
nj
Hi Folks

For you folks here that sometimes conceal carry, in light of the recent killing of a licensed weapon carrier and just plain to many trigger LEO out on the streets, I suggest another way of carrying your CCP or CWP, take it out of the wallet, and find a way to wear it around your neck and tucked under your shirt... This method may save your life... Reaching behind yourself to retrieve your credentials to show said credential to a LEO could create a major incident similar to the one in Minnesota. Wearing it around your neck is a much easier way to show the credentials to LEO while keeping your hands in plain view to the trigger happy LEO... " Hands in plain view" will help keep you alive... Stay safe!

My .02
Regards
CCJ
 
Last edited:

rickyray9

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2009
Messages
109
Location
Northern Nevada
Hi Folks

For you folks here that sometimes conceal carry, in light of the recent killing of a licensed weapon carrier and just plain to many trigger LEO out on the streets, I suggest another way of carrying your CCP or CWP, take it out of the wallet, and find a way to wear it around your neck and tucked under your shirt... This method may save your life... Reaching behind yourself to retrieve your credentials to show said credential to a LEO could create a major incident similar to the one in Minnesota. Wearing it around your neck is a much easier way to show the credentials to LEO while keeping your hands in plain view to the trigger happy LEO... " Hands in plain view" will help keep you alive... Stay safe!

My .02
Regards
CCJ
What happened to Philando Castile was tragic, but it doesn't really change protocol. If you haven't already produced the permit from your wallet before contact with the LEO, the proper method is to announce verbally that you are a permit holder and ask the officer how he would like for you to proceed. From there, just follow instruction. Where you retrieve your permit from isn't as important as getting authorization to retrieve it.
 

WalkingWolf

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
11,930
Location
North Carolina
What happened to Philando Castile was tragic, but it doesn't really change protocol. If you haven't already produced the permit from your wallet before contact with the LEO, the proper method is to announce verbally that you are a permit holder and ask the officer how he would like for you to proceed. From there, just follow instruction. Where you retrieve your permit from isn't as important as getting authorization to retrieve it.

He did announce, and that is when he was shot, the officer is making claims he reached for something, but his attorney says he was shot because of the presence of a gun. If he would have been reaching he would have been shot right away. Unless state law demands it, KYBMS!
 

HPmatt

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 18, 2013
Messages
1,467
Location
Dallas
I have not seen any proof that he had a CHL.
Have seen no reports from any MN government that he did. Newspaper said 'a source' said he had one but I have seen no official confirmation.


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solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
9,315
Location
here nc
I have not seen any proof that he had a CHL.
Have seen no reports from any MN government that he did. Newspaper said 'a source' said he had one but I have seen no official confirmation.
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uh, er, gee HP...do you truly believe the nice MN officials would give credence to that fact which corroborates the dead man's legal standing?

you must be thinking there is transparency in the situation...

ipse
 

HPmatt

Regular Member
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Aug 18, 2013
Messages
1,467
Location
Dallas
sounds like it might have been granted some time back when he lived somewhere else in MN - like a former life. OTOH authorities might wait till winter when town w/b harder to burn down w 10' of snow.


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WalkingWolf

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Jul 31, 2011
Messages
11,930
Location
North Carolina
uh, er, gee HP...do you truly believe the nice MN officials would give credence to that fact which corroborates the dead man's legal standing?

you must be thinking there is transparency in the situation...

ipse

If he did not the nice people who run the PD would be screaming it from the rooftop. It was reported he had one, and informed, the police have not denied it.
 

solus

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Aug 22, 2013
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here nc
sounds like it might have been granted some time back when he lived somewhere else in MN - like a former life. OTOH authorities might wait till winter when town w/b harder to burn down w 10' of snow.

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must be a lite winter then...only 10 feet...lol

ipse
 

utbagpiper

Banned
Joined
Jul 5, 2006
Messages
4,061
Location
Utah
It seems clear that SA needs to include reading the demeanor of other armed individuals including police officers. If an officer is nervous, keep your hands visible and not moving and avoid doing anything to give him any reason at all to over-react.

Doing my best to reserve judgment until more facts are available. I've never had a dangerous encounter with the police. But it seems prudent to try to learn from others' experiences so as to minimize risk.

Charles
 

HPmatt

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 18, 2013
Messages
1,467
Location
Dallas
When I got pulled over by motorcycle cop first of this year - 'possibly' exceeding posted speed limit one afternoon - was OC in belt holster.

Officer approached was relaxed, p'haps no PC other than speed, and maybe small NRA and 9/11 bumper stickers. Later found out from prosecutor he was wearing a video cam, which opened door for my deferred adjudication...


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since9

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jan 14, 2010
Messages
6,964
Location
Colorado Springs, Colorado, USA
and, well, pretty much everything...

Impact:
chair
water bottle
computer keyboard
computer monitor
computer
chair
chest of drawers
stereo speaker
speaker stand
television
mirror
mirror shards
door
hammer
frying pan
cook pot
plate
glass
guitar
drumstick
brick
anvil
pry bar
tire iron
bolt cutters
etc...

Strangulation:
coat sleeve
bed sheet
guitar string
baking twine
550 cord
tie-down strap
tow strap
chain
shoe string
electrical cord
drapery cord
vacuum cleaner hose
luggage strap
long sock
stocking
etc.

Poison:
Well, I'm not going to go here, as I don't want to give anyone out there in cyberspace any ideas.

Explosives:
Ibid.

The point is clear: Unless each and every person in the U.S. is relocated to straight jackets and rubber rooms, pretty much EVERYTHING ON THE PLANET can be used for "arms" i.e. an armament.

pen
pencil
paper (with eggs and spit, it can be molded into a shank)
large splinter of wood
wooden or metal shish kebob skewer
spoon...
etc...
 
Last edited:

redhawk44

Member
Joined
Feb 17, 2009
Messages
53
Location
Wheatland, MO
I did see an open carrier in MN that had his permit clip onto his holster.

In Missouri we no longer have the photo CCP, and we are required to show/produce a picture ID if the situation requires proof or presentation of a permit. So, I got a Non-Driver Id to go with my CCP. They reside back-to-back in a heavy duty ID lanyard/holder, that has a heavy, positive release to detach the holder from the lanyard. This allows me to carry around the neck, in the leg pocket of cargo pants/shorts, or in the vest pocket of a leather vest. I do usually just slip it over my head and beneath my shirt. It takes little effort to reveal the permit with hands in plain sight at the neck/head level.

I am familiar and comfortable with this system as I wore one for years to display my service ID/CAC.
 

utbagpiper

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Joined
Jul 5, 2006
Messages
4,061
Location
Utah
The critical flaw in the system is the obscene notion of 'crime prevention'.
If you are not stopping an actual crime in progress, then any police act to 'prevent crime' is an improper excess of authority exercised against those who are not engaged in criminal acts.
It's a guaranteed death-spiral into totalitarianism. The only way to genuinely prevent all crime is to prevent all unsupervised activity.
It sounds like such a great idea -- who doesn't want to 'prevent crime'?
But in practice, it becomes crimes by the state against non-criminal individuals. A license to dominate, to improperly exercise improper 'authority'.

Cutting and pasting the same emphatic assertion, across 10 different threads starts to look like spamming.

And using slippery slope arguments and reducto ad absurdum are both bad logic.

There are many things police and other officials can do to "prevent crime" that are not anywhere close to an improper excess of authority.

Imposing proper penalties on convicted criminals to reduce their desire or ability to re-offend is obvious.

Police assisting neighbors to form and operate effective Neighborhood Watch Programs is not an excess of authority.

Police providing home security audits and education people on how to make their property less appealing to criminals, when requested by the individual, is not an excess of authority.

A police officer doing paperwork in the parking lot of an all night convenience store, a school, or other location is not an excess of authority (so long as the property owner has invited them to do that). But it can help prevent crime.

A proper show of police force can be the difference between protests remaining peaceful and getting way out of hand.

A police officer in his cruiser with his lights flashing can provide enhanced safety to road crews working in construction zones, while also increasing the safety of the driving public.

Yes, a lot of injustice can occur under the guise of "crime prevention." A lot of injustice and harm can also occur if cops are entirely reactive, rather than doing what can properly be done in a proactive manner.

Enough with the emphatic assertion of bumper sticker logic demanding all-or-nothing solutions.

Charles
 

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
9,315
Location
here nc
snippp...

Imposing proper penalties on convicted criminals to reduce their desire or ability to re-offend is obvious. showed over and over to be ineffective in prevention especially since incarcination in this country is a $63.8B/year.

Police assisting neighbors to form and operate effective Neighborhood Watch Programs is not an excess of authority. turning neighbours into snitches sounds like it works good...put up lights

Police providing home security audits and education people on how to make their property less appealing to criminals, when requested by the individual, is not an excess of authority hire someone else whom you can hold accountable if your property 'is vandalized' after said security audit.

A police officer doing paperwork in the parking lot of an all night convenience store, a school, or other location is not an excess of authority (so long as the property owner has invited them to do that). But it can help prevent crime. will be accused of bashing if i comment about this activity

A proper show of police force can be the difference between protests remaining peaceful and getting way out of hand. worked very well in dallas eh?

A police officer in his cruiser with his lights flashing can provide enhanced safety to road crews working in construction zones, while also increasing the safety of the driving public. the nice LEs and their agency love this duty as it is normally at least time and a half pay for the officer but the contractor is billed double time.

Yes, a lot of injustice can occur under the guise of "crime prevention." A lot of injustice and harm can also occur if cops are entirely reactive, rather than doing what can properly be done in a proactive manner.

Enough with the emphatic assertion of bumper sticker logic demanding all-or-nothing solutions.

Charles

quote: The police of a state, in a comprehensive sense, embraces its whole system of internal regulation, by which the state seeks not only to preserve the public order and to prevent offenses against the state, unquote Law Dictionary: What is POLICE? definition of POLICE (Black's Law Dictionary)
guess i missed the statement the nice LEs have to prevent anything for the citizen's of the state.

supreme court has ruled the nice LEs do not have to respond...and i believe any prevention activities is strictly accidental

ipse
 
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Maverick9

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
1,404
Location
Mid-atlantic
You either have a smart cop, or you don't. There's not a whole lot you can do to protect yourself from the latter.

I agree with MAC.

Having only been stopped once or twice in several decades, it's not met the threshold of getting all the papers together in one place, like above the visor so you can just make one movement. But it make sense.

I carry my wallet in a chest pocket with a snap closure. But if a real BG wanted to be able to 'get the drop on' a LEO stopping him there are so many ways to do it.

IMO, LEOs are either too scared to be a traffic stop cop or they're not scared enough. I think there must be a majority who are 'thrill-seeker' personalities, though watching 'COPS' you don't really see that (is it scripted?).

I have no idea how female cops feel OK driving around ALONE stopping guys in cars, doing fishing. Of course a bullet knows no gender. Even with good SA, patience, good procedure and a vest it's got to be pulse-pounding to do that job.
 

davidmcbeth

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Jan 14, 2012
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16,167
Location
earth's crust
[video=youtube;8N-xtB5LQCA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8N-xtB5LQCA[/video]

The law is supposed to be unconcerned with trivial matters.

Speeding, no seat belts, etc...of individuals who cause no injury to anyone is trivial. No one should not be sitting on the side of the road waiting steroids to kick in.
 
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