New Gun, Finish Ruined By Salesman.

Hello to all.. I'm here looking for advise..again.

long story short..

i was at my local gun shop on Friday looking for a new gun as a birthday gift for my self.. i finally decided to go with a new HK45, salesman grabbed the gun and brought it over to the register machine.. as he was typing all his information in the computer i picked up the gun to do a final inspection on it.. i noticed a minuscule scratch on the slide, right behind the chamber breach.. so i tell the salesman about it and he says "let me try to get it off" he walked away with the gun and came back with it after a couple minutes saying "i couldn't get it off, but ill take 3% off the price for the small ding" so i said, OK.. i then noticed the gun had a large amount of a "grease" looking like substance exactly were the small ding was, my son also noticed this "substance" and asked the salesman (before i could) what that substance was? the salesman replied.. its "polish" i thought nothing of it and started doing my paperwork.. the salesman put the gun away in its box and i didn't see it again.. i was delayed.. and was told i would get a call when i could come and pick up the gun.. next day in the morning i get a call saying i could go ahead and pickup my gun.. about an hour later i was at the shop.. an hour later i was at the range.. when i was two mags in to shooting my new gun i noticed a large POLISHED "stain" behind the chamber.. i immediately remembered the salesman telling my son "its polish".. i stopped shooting and brought the gun home for further inspection... well, indeed.. the salesman ruined the beautiful Nitron (hostile environment) finish on my brand new HK 45..

i feel really bad.. its not everyday that i get to buy a 1k gun, specially as a birthday gift for myself. i thought of having it refinished (cerakote) but although this may sound weird, the finish on HK handguns is one of the things that mostly attracts me to them..
what do you guys think i should do? or say? how should i handle it? i know a gun is a tool and it will eventually get it's fair share of scratches and dings, but its literally two days old.. i have a 3 year old P30 in mint condition, i like taking good care of my things.

any advise would be greatly appreciated.

Send it to HK, they probably will refinish the slide under warranty.

WalkingWolf said:

Send it to HK, they probably will refinish the slide under warranty.

Click to expand...

Hi doesn't refinish guns. Sadly.

crackersillo said:

Hi doesn't refinish guns. Sadly.

Click to expand...

Have you contacted them? They may just switch out the slide, you should at least try.

Nightmare said:

I poured perspiration out of my H&K daily for ten years in the process of bicycling for 40,000 miles armed. At some point I noticed red rust coming through the slide lock/takedown lever finish. It was replaced promptly without question and is still perfect today - right now beside me.

Click to expand...

OOOPS I posted just after you, with competing no questions asked warranties even Glock has taken a more supportive approach.

crackersillo said:

Hello to all.. I'm here looking for advise..again.

long story short..

Click to expand...

I took the liberty of parsing your text into more meaningful paragraphs.

i was at my local gun shop on Friday looking for a new gun as a birthday gift for my self.. i finally decided to go with a new HK45, salesman grabbed the gun and brought it over to the register machine.. as he was typing all his information in the computer i picked up the gun to do a final inspection on it.. i noticed a minuscule scratch on the slide, right behind the chamber breach.. so i tell the salesman about it and he says "let me try to get it off" he walked away with the gun and came back with it after a couple minutes saying "i couldn't get it off, but ill take 3% off the price for the small ding" so i said, OK..

i then noticed the gun had a large amount of a "grease" looking like substance exactly were the small ding was, my son also noticed this "substance" and asked the salesman (before i could) what that substance was? the salesman replied.. its "polish" i thought nothing of it and started doing my paperwork.. the salesman put the gun away in its box and i didn't see it again..

i was delayed.. and was told i would get a call when i could come and pick up the gun.. next day in the morning i get a call saying i could go ahead and pickup my gun.. about an hour later i was at the shop.. an hour later i was at the range.. when i was two mags in to shooting my new gun i noticed a large POLISHED "stain" behind the chamber.. i immediately remembered the salesman telling my son "its polish".. i stopped shooting and brought the gun home for further inspection... well, indeed.. the salesman ruined the beautiful Nitron (hostile environment) finish on my brand new HK 45..

i feel really bad.. its not everyday that i get to buy a 1k gun, specially as a birthday gift for myself. i thought of having it refinished (cerakote) but although this may sound weird, the finish on HK handguns is one of the things that mostly attracts me to them..

what do you guys think i should do? or say? how should i handle it? i know a gun is a tool and it will eventually get it's fair share of scratches and dings, but its literally two days old.. i have a 3 year old P30 in mint condition, i like taking good care of my things.

any advise would be greatly appreciated.

Click to expand...

One of the better texts used to teach Business Law in graduate school is by Henry Cheeseman. He covers the basic nature of what constitutes an enforceable contract:

1. Parties to a Contract: The offerrer (usually the buyer) makes an offer to the offerree (usually the seller). The offeree either accepts or rejects the offer.

2. Elements of a Contract:
a. Agreement: Consists of mutual assent by the parties
b. Consideration: Legally sufficient value for the exchange. In your case, it was money exchanged for the firearm
c. Contractual Capacity: Both parties must have the legal capacity to make the exchange, including age and agency
d. Lawful Object: The object of the contract must be legal.

3. Defenses to the Enforcement of a Contract
a. Genuineness of assent: Both parties must be genuine (without duress, undue influence, or fraud)
b. Writing and form: The law requires that certain contracts be in writing or in a certain form.

In your case, crackersillo, you could file suit in a court of law to have the contract nullified on the grounds of a combination of Agreement and Genuiness of Assent:
A. Agreement: You agreed to purchase a new weapon in mint condition, but when a scratch was brought to the attention of both parties, you accepted the counteroffer of a 3% price reduction.
B. Genuiness of Assent: When you accepted a 3% price reduction, you did so with the understanding that it was for the scratch and nothing more. You would never have agreed to the sale if you had any reasonable belief that the seller's attempt to hide the scratch or defect with "polish" was going to permanently mar the protective finish of the firearm.

I believe that if your presentation before the court was clear, concise, and reasonable, the judge would side with you that while the seller's use of polish may or may not have been fraud (difficult to prove in your case), it nevertheless lead to marred finish on your firearm.

If so, the question then becomes what would be a reasonable compensation?

First, attempt to negotiate with the seller! This is very important, for several reasons:

First, it establishes that you attempted to work out the problem with the other party to the contract.

Second, if the seller recognizes the value of goodwill, they may very well suck it up as a business expense (damaged goods returned to supplier), and hand you a new firearm. If so, make certain you obtain a receipt for that, along with the old firearm's serial number recorded on the return so you won't be held liable for that firearm should it ever be used illegally.

Third, if the seller attempts to "stand on the contract," it demonstrates their lack of willingness to comply with the law, one aspect of which they violated by trying to hide the scratch with polish.

Fourth, write down what you want and stick to your guns. I would recommend you go for your best option, you return the firearm and they return your money. I wouldn't be willing to negotiate with them much, except what you've already written down (also, see below for additional considerations).

Fifth, you might present then with a (very) short list of options (again, see below). If they refuse all options, then that may indicate to the judge that they aren't willing to operate within the law.

If they refuse to negotiate a deal to your satisfaction, you can take them to court, and you have several options you may request from the court:

1. Nullification of the contract and return of the firearm in exchange for what you paid for it. However, the defendant is likely to argue that it was you who caused the marring and argue for a return only a portion of the purchase price. If he does, you might ask the judge only reduce the price returned to you by the cost for the seller to get it refinished. Since the seller undoubtedly holds an FFL, and may actually having bluing/refinishing services on-site, that would be at cost to him, not retail, and in your favor.

2. A return of a portion of the price to you. If so, you might ask the judge for at least as much cost, including insurance, shipping, FFL fees, etc. to get it professionally refinished. In almost all cases, however, you will have to present the judge with a receipt of this after the fact. In other words, it's initially out of your own pocket and it's a risk because there's no guarantee that the judge will side with you.

3. Court and legal costs: You can ask for them, but unless you can prove fraud on the part of the seller, you're unlikely to be reimbursed for court costs.

CAVEAT: This is not legal advice and I am not a lawyer. I am merely reviewing what you have stated in light of what's printed in a legal text. I suggest you do your own research. Also, WALK IN to your local BBB and see what they have to say.

ETA: Or, you could follow WalkingWolf's advice, contact HK, and if the marring is relegated to the slide, they may indeed swap that out without much fuss.

so glad you took the time to parsing...:banghead:

meaningful is up for debate...

geez ...

ipse

so tacitus42, you never took basic business law 101 at TCC, shame!!

i can then appreciate your obvious appreciation of since9's detailed epistolary to expand your contract knowledge.

ipse