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ABA opposes 2 bills requiring states to recognize concealed-carry permits

color of law

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ABA opposes 2 bills requiring states to recognize concealed-carry permits issued by other states

http://www.abajournal.com/news/arti...tro&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=daily_email

The ABA is opposing two federal bills that would require states to allow individuals to carry concealed weapons within their borders if they have permits to carry concealed weapons in another state.

The bills pending in the U.S. Senate and House of Representatives mandate national reciprocity for concealed carry permits issued under state law. ABA President Linda A. Klein calls the legislation “a dangerous proposal” that would tie states’ hands in setting concealed-carry standards.

Here we go again.......
 

Grapeshot

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"If the proposal were to become law, “a state’s ability to consider safety factors—such as age, evidence of dangerousness, live firearm training, or criminal records—would give way to other states’ less stringent requirements,” Klein said. “Unlike some efforts of Congress to create minimum safety standards, this bill could lead to no safety standards as more states enact laws to allow persons to carry concealed firearms without a permit.”

http://www.abajournal.com/news/arti...tro&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=daily_email
 

JTHunter2

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Planet Earth
Are the standards for obtaining a driver's license the same from state to state? :confused:
Of course not! :exclaim:
And yet, all driver's licenses are honored nationwide. Actually, make that "continent wide" as both Canada and Mexico accept U.S. driver's licenses in their countries just as we accept theirs. And ask yourselves? Just how much training do Mexicans get compared to the U.S. drivers?? :uhoh:
And look at how many people are killed or injured by bad drivers every day. More than by people that "legally" carry!

Maybe they should accept CC permits and not driver's licenses. Hhmm??
 
B

Bikenut

Guest
"If the proposal were to become law, “a state’s ability to consider safety factors—such as age, evidence of dangerousness, live firearm training, or criminal records—would give way to other states’ less stringent requirements,” Klein said. “Unlike some efforts of Congress to create minimum safety standards, this bill could lead to no safety standards as more states enact laws to allow persons to carry concealed firearms without a permit.”

http://www.abajournal.com/news/arti...tro&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=daily_email
Once Daddy Fed has the power to regulate carry permits .. and requiring all states to recognize any state's permits IS regulating! and sets the precedent for more regulating... the "less stringent requirements" between states is the argument that will be used by the most restrictive states to demand Daddy Fed institute a countrywide.. fair and uniform... system of permit requirements/criteria that must be met in order to receive a carry permit from any state.

To all those in favor of a national reciprocity scheme... be careful what you are asking for because we all just might get it.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Thundar

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Once Daddy Fed has the power to regulate carry permits .. and requiring all states to recognize any state's permits IS regulating! and sets the precedent for more regulating... the "less stringent requirements" between states is the argument that will be used by the most restrictive states to demand Daddy Fed institute a countrywide.. fair and uniform... system of permit requirements/criteria that must be met in order to receive a carry permit from any state.

To all those in favor of a national reciprocity scheme... be careful what you are asking for because we all just might get it.

Yup. You nailed it. The1968 Gun Control Act was enacted to help states regulate firearms.
 

utbagpiper

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Once Daddy Fed has the power to regulate carry permits .. and requiring all states to recognize any state's permits IS regulating! and sets the precedent for more regulating... the "less stringent requirements" between states is the argument that will be used by the most restrictive states to demand Daddy Fed institute a countrywide.. fair and uniform... system of permit requirements/criteria that must be met in order to receive a carry permit from any state.

To all those in favor of a national reciprocity scheme... be careful what you are asking for because we all just might get it.

Yup. You nailed it. The1968 Gun Control Act was enacted to help states regulate firearms.

Apparently some folks have not bothered to familiarize themselves with the Federal Gun Free School Zone Law, 18 U.S.C. § 921(a)(25). It is based entirely on the commerce clause and regulates firearms possession and carry permits.

It is illegal under federal law to carry any gun that has moved in interstate commerce within 1000 feet (as the crow flies) of any K-12 school. An exception is granted to those persons who possess a permit to carry issued by the State in which the school is located, if the permit requires a criminal background check before issuance.

The "precedence" (a word grossly misused in this type of statutory discussion) is already well established.

The "precedence" is also well established that the feds can ban guns for any reasons including purely cosmetic. So why is it that we don't have a federal, scary looking gun ban? Or a federal ban on normal sized magazines today? The 1994 bans expired in 2004 under George W Bush. Why haven't they been renewed?

Hint: The Democrats controlled the White House, The US Senate, and The US House of Representatives from 2009 through 2011 with sufficient majorities to push through Obamacare, a massive power grab. Why didn't those gun-hating, tree-hugging, rock-licking, pinko commie liberal Democrats pass a new gun ban?

It has nothing to do with lacking any "precedence" to do so and everything to do with the precedence of too many democrat Congressmen who voted for the 1994 having their hats handed to them and forced into retirement.

It is foolish to ever let your enemies set your agenda for you. So the fact that the ABA opposes this bill is not a reason to automatically support it. But anyone who opposes this bill (or even worse, opposes national recognition generally, on principle as opposed to some specific concern with how this specific bill is written) ought to at least pause and consider what wonderful anti-RKBA company they are now keeping with the ABA.
 

countryclubjoe

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Joined
Mar 3, 2013
Messages
2,505
Location
nj
Are the standards for obtaining a driver's license the same from state to state? :confused:
Of course not! :exclaim:
And yet, all driver's licenses are honored nationwide. Actually, make that "continent wide" as both Canada and Mexico accept U.S. driver's licenses in their countries just as we accept theirs. And ask yourselves? Just how much training do Mexicans get compared to the U.S. drivers?? :uhoh:
And look at how many people are killed or injured by bad drivers every day. More than by people that "legally" carry!

Maybe they should accept CC permits and not driver's licenses. Hhmm??

Is there a federal law requiring citizens to possess a drivers license to travel? If yes, please cite said law.

CCJ
 

wabbit

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Jan 19, 2011
Messages
153
Location
briar patch, NM
REAL -ID

The law prohibits any federal agency from accepting a person's state-issued driver's license or identification card for any official purpose unless the state meets the requirements of the new law. The prohibition on federal acceptance of non-complying licenses and identification cards begins three years after the law's enactment.

Since it cleared Congress on May 10 and was signed into law by the President on May 11, this essentially means that the prohibition probably begins sometime around mid-May of 2008. The law defines an “official purpose” as including accessing federal facilities, boarding federally regulated commercial aircraft, and entering nuclear power plants, but it could include other things as well.

The law was written so that it does not direct states to comply but the implication of not complying is that its licenses and identification cards will not be accepted for identification purposes by any federal authority anymore. Thus, states will almost certainly have to comply with the standards.

https://www.dhs.gov/real-id
 
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hammer6

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 11, 2008
Messages
1,461
Location
Florida
Once Daddy Fed has the power to regulate carry permits .. and requiring all states to recognize any state's permits IS regulating! and sets the precedent for more regulating... the "less stringent requirements" between states is the argument that will be used by the most restrictive states to demand Daddy Fed institute a countrywide.. fair and uniform... system of permit requirements/criteria that must be met in order to receive a carry permit from any state.

To all those in favor of a national reciprocity scheme... be careful what you are asking for because we all just might get it.

yup
 

color of law

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Joined
Oct 7, 2007
Messages
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Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
The law prohibits any federal agency from accepting a person's state-issued driver's license or identification card for any official purpose unless the state meets the requirements of the new law. The prohibition on federal acceptance of non-complying licenses and identification cards begins three years after the law's enactment.

Since it cleared Congress on May 10 and was signed into law by the President on May 11, this essentially means that the prohibition probably begins sometime around mid-May of 2008. The law defines an “official purpose” as including accessing federal facilities, boarding federally regulated commercial aircraft, and entering nuclear power plants, but it could include other things as well.

The law was written so that it does not direct states to comply but the implication of not complying is that its licenses and identification cards will not be accepted for identification purposes by any federal authority anymore. Thus, states will almost certainly have to comply with the standards.

https://www.dhs.gov/real-id
Great propaganda.
By invitation I have entered a federal facility without showing any ID and open carrying no less. The person who invited me in didn't personally know me, but only by email.

Also, do ICE agents never take arrested undocumented individuals into federal facilities?
 

color of law

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Joined
Oct 7, 2007
Messages
5,950
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
Are the standards for obtaining a driver's license the same from state to state? :confused:
Of course not! :exclaim:
And yet, all driver's licenses are honored nationwide. Actually, make that "continent wide" as both Canada and Mexico accept U.S. driver's licenses in their countries just as we accept theirs. And ask yourselves? Just how much training do Mexicans get compared to the U.S. drivers?? :uhoh:
And look at how many people are killed or injured by bad drivers every day. More than by people that "legally" carry!

Maybe they should accept CC permits and not driver's licenses. Hhmm??
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driver_License_Compact
Article 1 Section 10 U.S. Constitution:
"No State shall, without the Consent of Congress, lay any Duty of Tonnage, keep Troops, or Ships of War in time of Peace, enter into any Agreement or Compact with another State, or with a foreign Power, or engage in War, unless actually invaded, or in such imminent Danger as will not admit of delay."
 
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