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Thread: There's a new Sheriff in town...

  1. #1
    State Pioneer ConditionThree's Avatar
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    Posted on Monday, April 10, 2006 - 7:29 pm:




    Shasta county sheriff Jim Pope stepped down late last year and his successor will be elected soon. I e-mailed one of the contenders to ask him his position on the open carry option in CA law, and as yet, Ive not received a response. I'll be calling them each individually next week, and post results as soon as I have definitive answers


    Posted on Saturday, April 15, 2006 - 12:14 am:




    Heres the letter I sent toone contender for Shasta County sheriff.


    Dear Sir;


    I wrote about a week ago requesting the postition Mr. Mcdannold on the subject of existing concealed carry and whether he would consider exercising the population cause for open carry.

    Its my belief, with the staffing shortages that the Shasta county Sheriffs Department is experiencing, that open carry would be a visiable and compelling deterent for violent crime. With 3,300 CCW holders in Shasta county, the effect of even a small percentage of these law-abiding citizens (who already have had background checks processed to obtain a permit.)exercising open carry, would send a message to those with the criminal mentality that Shasta county does not welcome them.

    Im anxious to hear Mr Mcdannolds views.


    ***** ********


    12050. (a)(1)(A) The sheriff of a county, upon proof that the person applying is of good moral character, that good cause exists for the issuance, and that the person applying satisfies any one of the conditions specified in subparagraph (D) and has completed a course of training as described in subparagraph (E), may issue to that person a license to carry a pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person in either one of the following formats:
    (i) A license to carry concealed a pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person.
    (ii) Where the population of the county is less than 200,000 persons according to the most recent federal decennial census, a license to carry loaded and exposed in that county a pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person.


    Posted on Tuesday, April 18, 2006 - 9:30 pm:


    Well, Ive emailed McDannold twice with no response, and just emailed Bosenko for the first time a moment ago.

    I think the topic is, as far as they are concerned, a dead issue. With 3,300 CCW holders in the county, the population may be placated enough never to care about open carry.

    But what then, is the point of having the law on the books in California?

    Will check back in if either contender responds.



    Posted on Wednesday, April 19, 2006 - 11:38 am:




    Ive received a response from Bosenko. Like most correspondance with politicians, its clear when they want it to be. Quoted below.

    ______________________________________________
    Mr. ********,

    Thank you for visiting my web site and your interest in my candidacy for Sheriff. I have been an NRA member for over 25 years. I belive in supporting the Second Amendment. I support Sheriff Pope's (retired) and Acting Sheriff Larry Schaller's position on CCWs. I have written letters as a citizen/individual, in my position at the Sheriff's Office and for Sheriff Pope's signiture opposing gun control laws or legislation.

    There are about 4000 CCW permit holders in Shasta County. I support CCW permit holders and the CCW permit process. There will be no change in the process or approval for CCW permits if I am elected Sheriff.

    I believe if a criminal has a gun, the criminal needs to be in jail or prision. Leave the law abiding citizen alone. Our legislators should make laws that hold the criminal accountable, add prison time to their sentence for having or using a gun, don't let it be plea bargined away.

    I am endorsed by Larry Schaller, Acting Sheriff, I am endorsed by the Shasta Sportsmen's Club.

    Thank you again for you interest. I hope to have your vote on June 6, 2006

    VOTE BOSENKO FOR SHERIFF!
    ________________________________________________

    I've sent a follow up e-mail to pin him down on open carry. We'll see. His response time is certainly better than his rival's though.

    Well, I pinned down Bosenko as a 'no' to open carry permits. His correspondance follows;
    _________________________________________________


    Mr. ********,

    I apologize for overlooking the open carry part of your email in my answer. I am not aware of any county in the state issuing open carry permits. You are the first person to ask about it. I would not take action on open carry permits. I would need to review the law to be sure, but open carry is allow in the unicorporated [sic] area of the county all ready [sic]. You cannot open carry in incorporporated areas like the cities of Redding, Anderson, and City of Shasta Lake.

    The CCW is a much better way to go. You can carry concealed on your person, in your vehicle, in incorporated cities, and throughout the state without drawing attention to you. While legal with an open carry permit, imagine the amount of calls people would make to law enforcement on you, how many times you would be contacted, only to find out you are legally carrying you [sic]firearm.

    I fully support the CCW permit process and our Second Amendment Rights. I am the only candidate to publically state I am an NRA member and have been for over 25 years.

    Your rights and CCW permits are safe with me.

    Thank you,
    Tom
    _______________________________________________

    Yes, I can imagine law enforcement being called. And yes, I can imagine being contacted by law enforcement only to find that Im carrying legally. Ive read stories like that here already, and that is the price to be paid in order to change public and police perception that guns and people who carry them are not evil or 'perps'.

    Anyone care to contribute an argument to this letter? Im open to suggestion.


    Posted on Saturday, April 22, 2006 - 10:19 am:





    (I wrote him later, apologizing for taking up his time. He responded...)


    *****, Not a bother. I am not opposed to the idea. In certain circumstances I can see a need [for]open carry.

    Tom
    ________________________________________________

    So, I broke my promise not to be a pest...

    ________________________________________________

    Tom,

    Now you've piqued my curiosity. What circumstances would precipitate a need for open carry in your view?

    You've also spurred my interest in the statute detailing open carry in non-incorporated areas of the county. It seems there is much conflicting information about the legality of certain firearms issues of this nature, as I had been led to believe that no open carry was legal California. It begs the question for me, of what difference it makes that the open carry occurs in non-incorporated area versus incorporated 'city' areas, other than population, because people in unincorporated, sparsely populated areas are just as apt to call law enforcement with a report of 'a man with a gun' as those in the incorporated areas.

    Forgive my indulgences here, as I find the subject of 2nd Amendment liberties a stimulating and worthwhile discussion.

    Much Appreciation,
    *****

    (To my recollection, there wasnt further correspondance- though there might have been... it never appeared on the forum.)
    __________________________________________________ ________________


    Well, its May 26th, and since this exchange transpired Mr. McDannold finally responded with a cryptically incoherent note, saying he'd have to review the law before rendering his view on the subject. I do not expect him to respond any further. He's made it alot easier for me to vote for Tom Bosenko, since Mr McDannold made it clear by ignoring my first three inquiries, that he was not concerned with any of the issues I raised- And once he did respond, it wasnt the kind of coorespondance that you would expect from an educated professional. I would have posted it here, but it has since been purged from my e-mail history.
    New to OPEN CARRY in California? Click and read this first...

    NA MALE SUBJ ON FOOT, LS NB 3 AGO HAD A HOLSTERED HANDGUN ON HIS RIGHT HIP. WAS NOT BRANDISHING THE WEAPON, BUT RP FOUND SUSPICIOUS.
    CL SUBJ IN COMPLIANCE WITH LAW


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  2. #2
    Regular Member VAopencarry's Avatar
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    I applaud you for staying on top of them with this issue. keep up the good work.
    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." - Thomas Jefferson

  3. #3
    State Pioneer ConditionThree's Avatar
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    Bosenko edged out McDannold by just more than 1,300 votes- While he's not completely on board with open carry (such as issuing permits for open carry), this certainly is better than having a sheriff unwilling or unable to address issues such as 2nd Amendment rights, and State firearms laws.


    Hopefully the dialogue will continue to remain open.
    New to OPEN CARRY in California? Click and read this first...

    NA MALE SUBJ ON FOOT, LS NB 3 AGO HAD A HOLSTERED HANDGUN ON HIS RIGHT HIP. WAS NOT BRANDISHING THE WEAPON, BUT RP FOUND SUSPICIOUS.
    CL SUBJ IN COMPLIANCE WITH LAW


    Support the 2A in California - Shop Amazon for any item and up to 15% of all purchases go back to the Calguns Foundation. Enter through either of the following links
    www.calgunsfoundation.org/amazon
    www.shop42a.com

  4. #4
    State Pioneer ConditionThree's Avatar
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    The following is the letter I hand delivered to the Sheriff's office September 12th after being told- "I dont think Shasta county has open carry permits." and was refused such an amendment to my existing CCW permit.
    Sheriff Tom Bosenko

    1525 Court Street

    Redding, CA 96001-1667

    September 11, 2006



    Dear Sheriff Bosenko



    You may recall previous to your election, we exchanged e-mail regarding the subject of the lawfulness of open carry in Shasta County and the provisions in California law for issuance of not only concealed carry permits, but also permits to carry concealable firearms loaded and exposed. It is this same subject of which I am writing to you today.



    When I was in the Sheriff’s office this last winter renewing my CCW permit I asked some questions for which, I received some surprising and perplexing answers. I asked, “What was the definition of ‘incorporated’?” The staff felt I was beating around the bush and asked under what context was this definition needed. I explained I had been doing research about laws governing carrying firearms openly and about 12031PC specifically. No sooner was this off my lips before I encountered resistance. I was told that ‘incorporated areas’ meant ‘populated’ areas and that open carry was only acceptable in my home, on my property, or in my place of business. I was told also, that open carry of any firearm in any area of the county would certainly result in an arrest, on charges that would necessitate a very good lawyer- and the defense against these charges would be very difficult.



    Ironically, they were trying to tell me this citing a difference between the laws on the books and how they are applied- effectively making ‘color of law’ the standard by which your office is expected to apply it.



    Indulge me, if I don’t get directly to my point.



    It is my firm belief that the application and issuance of CCW permits is super-Constitutional, infringing on my second, forth, fifth, and ninth amendment rights. Effectively, I asked the State permission to arm myself (as it is ‘unlawful’ to do so under most circumstances.), I have been asked by the State to justify my need to be armed, I have been subjected to a search of my history, I was required to answer for any past crimes, I endured the States molestation, while my fingerprints were taken, to subject my person to yet another search- all without having committed a crime.



    Why did I submit to this?



    I did it to comply with codified law, regardless of the anathema it represents to the liberties enshrined in our Constitution. This additional encroachment of liberty, offered as a legal opinion by staff from your service department has no such codification. Nowhere is their opinion expressed in a binding form of legal doctrine- because of this, I intend to draw the line by exercising every liberty in spite of those who would subvert them by forwarding their personal agenda.



    I will be making a regular practice of open carry in unincorporated Shasta county, in all those places not circumscribed with incorporated city limits, conducting my normal daily business as any person would, driving, shopping, banking, and eating at restaurants. I intend to both educate and recruit others by passing out the information pamphlet enclosed. They likewise will be encouraged to open carry in the unincorporated areas of the county and petition you as the elected Sheriff for the issuance of open carry permits as detailed in 12050PC.



    CL

    Director

    Shasta County Open Carry Association.

    New to OPEN CARRY in California? Click and read this first...

    NA MALE SUBJ ON FOOT, LS NB 3 AGO HAD A HOLSTERED HANDGUN ON HIS RIGHT HIP. WAS NOT BRANDISHING THE WEAPON, BUT RP FOUND SUSPICIOUS.
    CL SUBJ IN COMPLIANCE WITH LAW


    Support the 2A in California - Shop Amazon for any item and up to 15% of all purchases go back to the Calguns Foundation. Enter through either of the following links
    www.calgunsfoundation.org/amazon
    www.shop42a.com

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