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Thread: Carry Ammo?

  1. #1
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    Ok, we've had discussions about gun, caliber, holster, etc., but I haven't seen any discussions about what Ammo load folks are carrying.

    Do carry hollow points? Do you carry a more powerful load?

    Honestly, this is one of the areas I've been wanting to do some research and experimenting with, but haven't yet. Right now, I carry the standard target/range ball ammo. However, I want to switch to hollow points because I've read about too many incidents where shots have gone through intended targets and hit non-intended targets as well.

    Also, do you practice with what you carry?

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    The bonded JHP bullet, manufactured by CCI/Speer as the Gold-Dot, is the best conventional handgun bullet design out there (IMHO).

    I carry:

    Speer Gold-Dot 200gr, or Double-Tap 185gr.45 G.A.P - Springfield XD-45LE Tactical

    Pro-Load 200gr +p, or Double-Tap 230gr .45 ACP- Springfield 1911A1

    Double-Tap 115gr, or Speer GD 125gr.357 SIG - Sig P239 Bi-Tone

    All of these loads use Speer Gold-Dot bullets.

    I used to run Federal HS 135gr through my 9mms, occasionally, but they are quite anemic unless used with a long barrel (my Beretta CX-4 loved them). And I still use Federal Shotgun & Rifle ammo. My bedside gun is loaded with Wal-Mart special Remington/UMC .38 Special 125gr +p SJHP (they were the most accurate cartridges through the little gun, that I could find). I don't carry it, though.

    molonlabetn



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    GlockEm wrote:
    Right now, I carry the standard target/range ball ammo. However, I want to switch to hollow points because I've read about too many incidents where shots have gone through intended targets and hit non-intended targets as well.

    Also, do you practice with what you carry?
    Shot placement is critical. If you hit skull with FMJ, it will not come out the other side, and even if it does, it should stop the target.

    And on that note, I've been experimenting with several different HP types, because I don't know what would happen to my shooting in a stressful situation. Tomorrow I get my C9, so I will be able to put some rounds through it as well.

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    khatores wrote:
    GlockEm wrote:
    Shot placement is critical. If you hit skull with FMJ, it will not come out the other side, and even if it does, it should stop the target.

    And on that note, I've been experimenting with several different HP types, because I don't know what would happen to my shooting in a stressful situation. Tomorrow I get my C9, so I will be able to put some rounds through it as well.
    Good point on the skull shot! LOL. However, I agree that introducing stress into the situation is an unknown on how it would affect my accuracy.

    Let us know what you determine with your HP experiments.

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    While I am an advocate of using good hollow point ammunition and reccomend its use to those that carry a firearm for self defense, I do think the mantra that over penetration to include hitting an unintended target is over blown.

    I am not avering that it doesn't, hasn't or won't happen, I am implying the concept is not as critical as we may be led to believe.

    Consider the majority of situations where you would be called upon to impliment your self defense tool;

    The party or parties that seek to accost you will do so in a time and place of THEIR choosing. Hence they will be the only ones, except you around. They will generally insure that they have plenty of privacy to accomplish their dirty deeds. The chances of an innocent person be in the line of fire are pretty much slim to none.

    In that eviroment what would be the unintended targets that you would be worried about? A tree? A few automobiles? Another of the miscreants that seek to do you harm?

    In truth your going to be hitting those things anyway. Even trained Peace Ofiicers seldom hit their intended target more than 1 in 4 times.

    Understand that the occassion when you are called upon to use your firearm will likely be something like a the darkened parking lot of the restaurant you have just left with yourspouse and children. There will be few if any other people around.

    You will be set upon in a quick and violent matter. If you do not respond in a quick and violent manner you loose.

    You will not have time to consider ANY of the following;

    1. Am I going to sweep my weapon across something I don't want to if I draw

    2. Am I worried about over penetration

    3. What did my instructor tell me I was leglly able to do in this case

    4. The list goes on and on with all of the crap I have oft seen repeated on gun boards all over the net.

    The fact of the matter is that if you attempt to consider any one of these or a myriad of other things you have read about over the years you will probably be dead or mortally wounded before you can complete the thought process.

    When it comes to a violent encounter you either know or you don't. You either react imediately or you loose.

    The key to winning a violent encounter is shot placement with a caliber adaquate for circumstances.

    In a potential gunfight there is no room for a politically correct thought process.

  6. #6
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    gunscribe wrote:
    You will be set upon in a quick and violent matter. If you do not respond in a quick and violent manner you loose.

    You will not have time to consider ANY of the following;

    1. Am I going to sweep my weapon across something I don't want to if I draw

    2. Am I worried about over penetration

    3. What did my instructor tell me I was leglly able to do in this case

    4. The list goes on and on with all of the crap I have oft seen repeated on gun boards all over the net.

    The fact of the matter is that if you attempt to consider any one of these or a myriad of other things you have read about over the years you will probably be dead or mortally wounded before you can complete the thought process.

    When it comes to a violent encounter you either know or you don't. You either react imediately or you loose.

    The key to winning a violent encounter is shot placement with a caliber adaquate for circumstances.

    In a potential gunfight there is no room for a politically correct thought process.
    Who's talking about politically correct thought process (or any thought process)at the time of the encounter?? I'm talking about the load to carry. This thought process happens before I even load my gun which is well before any encounter (hopefully). I don't want to have to think about over penetration or what is behind my intended target in a situation, this is precisely why I started the thread. If you address this issue before you carry, then you won'tbe temptedtothink aboutwhen the s*** hits the fan. The fact that the miscreants pick the time and the place is even more reason for me to want to be adequately prepared (i.e., I can't be sure if there are innocents behind them, etc.).

    I'll agree that shot placement and stopping power of your ammo are the most important, but it doesn't hurt to insure againstoverpenetrate. I'llalways remember that once I pull that trigger the flying projectile is my responsibility!

    P.S.I don't know about anyone else, but I remember the news media all crying about how horrible hollow point bulletsarefrom wayback in the 80s...since when did their usebecome politically correct??

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    GlockEm wrote:
    P.S.I don't know about anyone else, but I remember the news media all crying about how horrible hollow point bulletsarefrom wayback in the 80s...since when did their usebecome politically correct??
    I'm guessing that happened as police forces began to see the advantage of expanding ammo over FMJ. They justified it to theirshooting boards and Mas Ayoob suggested in his writings that for civilians it was a good idea to use the same load as local LEOs, as a defense if it came up in a trial.

    Personally I like Federal Hydrashock loads, but now am leaning toward the HST load.

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    Speer Gold-Dot 155gr 40 S&W - Glock 27

    Does that seem like to light a round? Ihave never had a jam or failure

    I do practice with it, unless I go to Dominion Range, due to having to shoot their expensive ammo.

  9. #9
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    GlockEm,

    Take a look at this post, over at the Smith and Wesson Forum:

    http://smith-wessonforum.com/eve/for...5471026821/p/1

    You may need to register for an account but believe me, it's well worth it. This post should give you some insight into the ballistic information your looking for. This is one of the best written / most informative posts I think I've ever read. It's rather long at 11 pages but you won't be bored or disappointed. Please let me know what you guys think.

    Cheers,

    Jason
    San Antonio, TX.

  10. #10
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    That is one long thread. Lots of info, and opinions. I am partial to 40 S&W after carrying a 9mm Beretta for a year in Iraq (I hated that pistol). But saying that, my wife hates the way my Glock 27 shoots (small size but big boom ) but is fine with a 9mm, which she will have soon. I think it is better to find something you can be comfortable shooting then carrying something that scares you like a DE 50 cal (Hand Howitzer:P).

  11. #11
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    i carry hydrashocks

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    Very interesting - this guy seems sold on the .45; however, I'm not giving up on the 9mm just yet. I might get a .45 soon and compare, though.

  13. #13
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    I carry Speer Gold Dots for both my XD45 , and G23 / G27.

    .45ACP 180gr
    .40 155gr

    Jason

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    I've been reading alot about the Cor-Bon DPX ammo. I've heard nothing but good things about it. I haven't been able to find any locally, so I may pick up a box off of the net.

    Anyone tried this ammo? Did you like it?

    Jason

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    A few years back, I carried Hydrashocks, and I still admire the theory behind the bullet design. However, research and experience has enlightened me to the anemic loads that Federal uses. For example, their .44 magnum load has approximately 30% less muzzle energy than the same caliber and weight Speer Gold Dot as offered by Speer. I now carry Speer GD or Hornady XTP. Loads using either of these bullets are available both from the original manufacturer, and to the reloading market. As a result, other manufacturers, Buffalo Bore and Double Tap to name two, have developed their own loads using these proven bullet designs. If Federal were to offer hotter loads, or the Hydrashock bullet to the reloading market, I may reconsider. For now, I'm happy with Hornady and Speer, and the research I've done for the calibers I carry speak highly of the performance characteristics. In my 454 Casull (Ruger Alaskan) I carry the Hornady 300 gr XTP rounds loaded by Hornady. In my 10mm (G20), I carry the Speer 180 gr GD loaded by Buffalo Bore. In my BUGs I carry Speer 158 gr GD .357 Buffalo Bore (S&W 340PD) and Hornady TAP .45 ACP (G36). My $0.02.

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    Thats interesting about the Hydrashocks being weaker loadings. I could understand .44 magnum being loaded weaker than the average hunting load. However I have seen +P and +P+ loading for the Hydrashock as well. That said I think Federal is moving away from hydrashock to the HST as it is more effective at expanding.

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    still using hydrashocks at the moment. looking to swith to golden sabers or gold dots.

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    Only carry Winchester Ranger for me. With that said:

    .45 ACP (Glock 30): Winchester Ranger 230 grain

    9mm (Glock 26): Winchester Ranger 127 grain +p+

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    For my Glock 23 I carry Federal Hydra-Shok 155grn

    For my Glock 30 I carry Golden Sabre 230grn.

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    I carry Cor-Bon 9mm 125gr +P JHPs in my Beretta 92FS

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    Double-Tap now loads .45 G.A.P! So, I'll be shooting up the rest of my stock of Speer GD once my order arrives.

    http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/catalog/index.php?cPath=21_41

    I just ordered mine... 185gr (1150fps - 543 ft-lb, according to them), and that's rated through a G37, which has a shorter barrel than my XD.

    I'll try the 165gr (1275fps - 596 ft-lb) next time.


    molonlabetn


  22. #22
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    Glock 27, 23 and 35 all have either Hornady 180 gr. TAP or Winchester 155 gr Silvertip.

    In the .45 I carry Speer Gold Dot 200 gr. +P

    My .44 Mags have Winchester 210 gr. Silvertip

    In 9mm I use Corbon 125 gr. +P

    In my Ruger SP101 I use either Winchester Silvertip125 gr. .38 +P or Federal .357 Mag.




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    The free man is a warrior. - Nietzsche "Twilight of the Idols"

  23. #23
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    I just switched from Hydrashocks to Gold Dots for both my USP and G23. I have the 180 grain .40 cartridges.

    I read an article somewhere that said bigger, slower bullets will make bigger permanent wound channels than smaller, faster bullets. So that's the thinking behind my pick.

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    147 grain Federal HST (9mm). Everything that I have read indicates this bullet gets great expansion, even in the lower-velocity rounds like the 147 grain. And I like the penetration the 147 grain round gets.

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    I like the Gold Dots; I'm still trying to decide whether I like the .40 or the .357 better in my Sig 229. The .357 seems to have less recoil (for me) but I think I may be a bit more accurate with the .40 for some reason.

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