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Thread: Residency in VA

  1. #1
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    How does one become a residentor at what point is one considered a sresident of Virginia? I am asking so that I know whether I need to apply for a CCW or a non resident CCW.

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    You do not need to be a legal resident of VA to apply for a resident CHP - just be a bonefide physical resident when you make your application. Just move here, establish a residence and "make a home" in it, and apply. Several years ago the VA Code was clarified that no period of residency was required to apply for CHPs.

    Try to choose a locality like FFX County which does NOT fingerprint - once you have your CHP, you can move wherever you want, no need (yet) to even change your address. But you must carry either Commonwealth or DOD photo ID, or DOD ID with the CHP.

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    Mike wrote:
    You do not need to be a legal resident of VA to apply for a resident CHP - just be a bonefide physical resident when you make your application.* Just move here, establish a residence and "make a home" in it, and apply.* Several years ago the VA Code was clarified that no period of residency was required to apply for CHPs.

    Try to choose a locality like FFX County which does NOT fingerprint - once you have your CHP, you can move wherever you want, no need (yet) to even change your address.* But you must carry either Commonwealth or DOD photo ID, or DOD ID with the CHP.
    mind clearing up some of those acronyms for me?

    Do you know if Arlington County requires fingerprining?

    Does open carry in VA require a concealed permit?

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    Please join the free VCDL.org alert list ASAP - weekly alerts on the latest VA gun rights news, legislation, and more (click on "VA-ALERT" on right side of www.VCDL.org).

    VCDL - Virginia Citizens Defense League

    VA - Virginia

    CHP - concealed handgun permit

    FFX - Fairfax

    DOD - Department of Defense

    ID - identification card

    LEO - law enforcement officer

    Yes, Arlington fingerprints, as does Alexandria, and presumably Falls Church also.

    No, CHP is NOT needed to open carry in VA, although a **VA** CHP is certainly handy to avoid running afoul of the federal GFSZA (that's Gun Free School Zone Act) if you are carrying concealed in a vehicle on school grounds (legal under VA law) or open carry within 1,000 feet of any K-12 school (federal GFSZA provision). A CHP is also handy for those times when you might be perceived as conceal carrying by an LEO, especially inside a vehicle if youir shirt or seatbelt obscures the gun such that it cannot be readily observed to be a gun.

    Move to FFX County, or another non-fingerprinting jurisdiction (i.e., Loudoun County, PW County) ASAP.

    If you do submit to fingerprinting in Arlington, or anywhere else, remember, SSN not required on either the CHP application nor the FBI fingerprint card or machine scanner.



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    And one more thing - many homes in Fairfax County have misleading addresses - Alexandria, Falls Church, etc.

    Do not trust the post office - your house might be in FFX County even with an Alexandria or Falls Chruch address.

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    Here's the Link to the Virginia State Police (VSP) site, whichwill help to answer some questions on CHP and some other firearms questions, too.

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    It can be very problematic to apply for a "resident" CHP when you are in fact a legal resident of another state. There are a few exceptions which don't appear to be at issue in this case. While no minimum period of residence is required, I don't think that means that a non-resident can apply for a resident CHP. There are a few benefits of a resident CHP but those pale in comparison to the difficulty of trying to play both sides of the street. If you are a bona fide (legal) resident -apply for a resident CHP. If not, apply for a non-resident, which can be done by mail. Trying to be too clever by half usually ends up biting youin the posterior.

    Mike wrote:
    You do not need to be a legal resident of VA to apply for a resident CHP - just be a bonefide physical resident when you make your application. Just move here, establish a residence and "make a home" in it, and apply. Several years ago the VA Code was clarified that no period of residency was required to apply for CHPs.

    Try to choose a locality like FFX County which does NOT fingerprint - once you have your CHP, you can move wherever you want, no need (yet) to even change your address. But you must carry either Commonwealth or DOD photo ID, or DOD ID with the CHP.

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    No, you are incorrect.

    If you are a legal resident of another state, but physicaly reside in VA, the VSP will NOT, I say again, NOT issue you a CHP. You must apply to your circuit court.

    Please do not confuse this issue in VA - 18.2-308 is very clear - legal residence is NOT required.

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    City of Falls Church does or did require fingerprints but you actually have to file with the clerk in Arlington:?. As for misleading addresses, I live in the Falls Church area but not the in the City and my current address is in Fairfax County.

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    Yeah, I'm in Fairfax County (Landmark Area), born and raised in Fairfax County in the Ft. Hunt area and still have an Alexandria Post Mark. It really confuses so many folks. Alexandria (the City) still fingerprints.

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    Mike wrote:
    No, you are incorrect.

    If you are a legal resident of another state, but physicaly reside in VA, the VSP will NOT, I say again, NOT issue you a CHP. You must apply to your circuit court.

    Please do not confuse this issue in VA - 18.2-308 is very clear - legal residence is NOT required.

    Of course, I may be incorrect. If so, VSP is using a very unique definition of resident. However 18.2-308 is not as clear as you indicate. True, no minimum period of residence is required, however it does not state what is meant by "resident" and its derivative forms. Nor is there any indication that VSP will refuse to process a nonresident application solely because someone happens to be sleeping in Virginia for a indefinite period. Unfortunately, no definition is provided. Of course, a call to VSP would give a good indication (have you actually done this?) but this would not be dispositive of the law because a judge would not be bound by that determination.

    If I were a nonresident of Virginia who happened to be present in Virginia without an intent to become a legal resident (out of state student, military, other temporary purpose), I would at least attempt to submit a nonresident application and get refusal to accept in writing. Otherwise, such a submission might be used as evidence of intent to become a (legal) Virginia resident either by Virginia or my home state, which may or may not be desirable. Your interpretation could lead to ridiculous results where a person would be a "resident" for the shortest of sojourns even if he planned to depart immediately after submitting an application. I can't imagine this is what the legislature had intended nor what a judge would find but you never know....


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    There is no reason to sew confusion - forget the VSP - they have nothing to do with circuit court CHP applications.

    18.2-308(D) is very clear and has been in effect for almost a decade before the VSP was even authorized to issue non-residents CHPs: "Any person 21 years of age or older may apply in writing to the clerk of the circuit court of the county or city in which he resides, or if he is a member of the United States Armed Forces, the county or city in which he is domiciled, for a five-year permit to carry a concealed handgun. There shall be no requirement regarding the length of time an applicant has been a resident or domiciliary of the county or city."

    A primary rule of statutory construction is that the mentioning of one thing implies the exclusion of the other - in this case, the statute provides that any person may apply to the circuit court of the locality in which he resides. The mentioning of the military domiciliary exception clarifies that "residents" need not necessarily be domiciliaries, and that domiciliaries are generally excluded from applying unless they are also residents.

    Only military persons have an exception to apply to the circuit court in the locality in which they are domiciled. A civilian domiciled in Fairfax County but residing in Pennsylvania may not apply for a CHP in Fairfax County, but since 2004, may apply for a CHP from the VSP. But a military person domiciled in Fairfax County but residing at Fort Lee, VA or Baghdad could apply for a CHP in Fairfax County.

    A civilian residing in Fairfax County but domiciled in Pennsylvania cannot apply for a CHP from the VSP – he must apply to the Fairfax County Circuit Court. Interestingly, most Sheriffs in PA will expect that a PA domiciliary residing in VA have a VA CHP to obtain a PA LTCF!

    If VA law required folks to be domiciled in VA to obtain a CHP from their circuit court, the statute would say so. Thousands upon thousands of non-VA domiciled residents of VA have been getting CHPs from circuit courts for many years. The new authority for the VSP to issue CHPs is a new add on gimmick and has nothing to do with circuit court jurisdiction to issue CHPs to residents of the locality in which the circuit court operates. Even if the VSP were to entertain CHP applications from persons residing in VA (which they do not), circuit courts still have the authority and mandate to issue to these same persons - and most localities don't fingerprint, but the VSP always does, and charges double ($100), so why apply to the VSP if you don't have to?

    Folks living in VA seeking 1st time CHPs ought to move to localities which do not fingerprint; once you have the CHP, move wherever you want – you will no longer ever be fingerprinted on renewals, even if you move to a fingerprinting locality.



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    Mike wrote:
    There is no reason to sew confusion - forget the VSP - they have nothing to do with circuit court CHP applications.
    The confusion (ambiguity) is already there. I will concede your superior knowledge of VA law but your contention is not correct ipse dixit
    18.2-308(D) is very clear and has been in effect for almost a decade before the VSP was even authorized to issue non-residents CHPs: "Any person 21 years of age or older may apply in writing to the clerk of the circuit court of the county or city in which he resides, or if he is a member of the United States Armed Forces, the county or city in which he is domiciled, for a five-year permit to carry a concealed handgun. There shall be no requirement regarding the length of time an applicant has been a resident or domiciliary of the county or city."
    You beg the question. What is a resident? There is a difference between resident and domiciliary but what is it? Could not resident imply domicilary plus physical presence? Such a construction would be consistent with the law.
    A primary rule of statutory construction is that the mentioning of one thing implies the exclusion of the other - in this case, the statute provides that any person may apply to the circuit court of the locality in which he resides. The mentioning of the military domiciliary exception clarifies that "residents" need not necessarily be domiciliaries, and that domiciliaries are generally excluded from applying unless they are also residents.
    As indicated above - not necessarily.
    Only military persons have an exception to apply to the circuit court in the locality in which they are domiciled. A civilian domiciled in Fairfax County but residing in Pennsylvania may not apply for a CHP in Fairfax County, but since 2004, may apply for a CHP from the VSP. But a military person domiciled in Fairfax County but residing at Fort Lee, VA or Baghdad could apply for a CHP in Fairfax County.
    What you are saying is that a long term Virginia resident who happens to be in Pennsylvania for a two-week conference must apply as a non-resident to VSP. This is nonsensical. No, physical presence (or lack thereof) is a necessary but not sufficient determinant.
    A civilian residing in Fairfax County but domiciled in Pennsylvania cannot apply for a CHP from the VSP – he must apply to the Fairfax County Circuit Court. Interestingly, most Sheriffs in PA will expect that a PA domiciliary residing in VA have a VA CHP to obtain a PA LTCF!
    This is even more silly. A bona fide legal PA resident would not be required to show any other license. Now a lot of this could be avoided by using a permanent home address rather than a temporary, albeit, current one. I think doing so would be more in keeping with the law.
    If VA law required folks to be domiciled in VA to obtain a CHP from their circuit court, the statute would say so. Thousands upon thousands of non-VA domiciled residents of VA have been getting CHPs from circuit courts for many years.
    For many years interracial marriage was unlawful in Virginia, until the Lovings came along. The fact that some procedure is being conducted in a certain manner simply shows that nobody cares enough to challenge it. Your position was stronger prior to the introduction of nonresident permits. Now everybody has a pathway to a CHP.
    The new authority for the VSP to issue CHPs is a new add on gimmick and has nothing to do with circuit court jurisdiction to issue CHPs to residents of the locality in which the circuit court operates. Even if the VSP were to entertain CHP applications from persons residing in VA (which they do not),
    You keep asserting this. Do you have an actual example where a non-resident (legally speaking) of Virginia was refused by VSP (after have been given the complete fact pattern)?
    Circuit courts still have the authority and mandate to issue to these same persons - and most localities don't fingerprint, but the VSP always does, and charges double ($100), so why apply to the VSP if you don't have to?
    The court probably assumes legal residency based upon the address provided. The VSP advantage is as I outlined it in my prior post.
    Folks living in VA seeking 1st time CHPs ought to move to localities which do not fingerprint; once you have the CHP, move wherever you want – you will no longer ever be fingerprinted on renewals, even if you move to a fingerprinting locality.
    Explain this one. Is fingerprinting required/allowed by the statute? Are the rules for renewal different? Perhaps Virginia is just a queer place.


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    apjonas wrote:
    Explain this one. Is fingerprinting required/allowed by the statute? Are the rules for renewal different? Perhaps Virginia is just a queer place.

    I'm not going to comment on your continued attempt to muddy the waters here in VA by insisting that a resident of a locality must be a VA domiciliary.

    As for your last question, to which you would know the answer had you read 18.2-308, the VSP has authority to fingerprint all applicants, and does do so. Localities have the option; only 27% do fingerprint. However, effective 1 July 2006, no locality may require fingerprinting of a renewal applicant - the code does not define "renewal" but presumably all persons who have ever held a VA CHP are now exempt from fingerprinting, even if expired, and even if the CHP was issued by the VSP or another locality - I hope that some circuit courts take a narrow view and screw around with applicants - then we can use this controversey toget the General Assembly to fully repeal optional locality fingerprintingauthority (last minute tricks on the VA Senate floor changed the full repeal to a partial repeal).

    Further, the General Assembly has tentatively established 1 July 2007 as the date at which time all CHPs remain in force for life (contingent on funding for periodic background checks); if funding is found, the statue will require CHP holders to report changes of address, however no per se penalty is specified for failing to report your change of address.

    The point is that if you want to avoid biometric registration with the FBI when you apply for a VA CHP, move to a VA locality which does not fingerprint - you are probably set for life then to carry in VA and about 18 other states or so, even if you later move out of VA.

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