How big can you carry open?

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cREbralFIX wrote:

I saw a S&W Model 57 Mountain Gun 4" barrel in 41 Magnum the other day. It is blued and has really nice grips. I'm seriously considering getting it for carry

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Yeah, but pay attention to how heavy it is. I am considering my big Ruger foroc only because I don't have a good holster for my XD yet. My Ruger is much too heavy for constant carry. You may find the Model 57 a poor choice for a gun that can be carried both oc and cc.

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I own a model 57 4" -- Bought if from a LEO who carried it for seven years and decided to sell it when he found out he would have to pay for all his own ammo for qualification. I opened the cylinder and noticed four burn marks on the six charge holes!! He had carried it for seven years and fired it four times! My gain! that is the sweetest gun I own. I OC with it in Northern WI. You would not be disappointed with the model 57.

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What is the recoil like on defensive JHP rounds? I shoot 9mm, 45 ACP, and 38 Special regularly and had a 44 magnum (Smith mountain gun with 4" barrel). How does 41 magnum feel of the M57 as compared to the above?

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I wonder if this would be too big to carry. Here it is with some of the optional accessories:

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The 57's percieved recoil using full loads is milder than the 44 by about 1/4. My Glock 21 seems to bite almost as much as the .41, but I beleive this is a matter of perception. The Glock has a much sharper ( energy expended in a shorter time) as opposed to the .41 which seems to spread out the force over a longer period. I hope I put that in terms that gets my point across.

As for to heavy to carry OC, by itself, not at all.

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presbyreformed wrote:

cREbralFIX wrote:

I saw a S&W Model 57 Mountain Gun 4" barrel in 41 Magnum the other day. It is blued and has really nice grips. I'm seriously considering getting it for carry

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Yeah, but pay attention to how heavy it is. I am considering my big Ruger foroc only because I don't have a good holster for my XD yet. My Ruger is much too heavy for constant carry. You may find the Model 57 a poor choice for a gun that can be carried both oc and cc.

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Rugers are good guns, but yes. They are large and a bit weighty.

ProguninTN

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OC-Glock19 wrote:

I wonder if this would be too big to carry. Here it is with some of the optional accessories:

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Funny :lol:

I wonder if you could find a good cc holster for it!

Can you imagine what the sheep at someplace like a library would say when you walked in with that thing hanging on your side! You could clear a room faster than a midwest tornado!:shock:

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Heh...that's one way to clear a room.

I plan on making my own kydex holster.

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Well, I finally found a picture of a carry rig for the Kel-Tec AR-15 pistol. It doesn't look that comfortable though. I think I'll stick with my Glock 19. :?

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Well, I finally found a picture of a carry rig for the Kel-Tec AR-15 pistol. It doesn't look that comfortable though. I think I'll stick with my Glock 19. :?

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OC-Glock19 wrote:

Well, I finally found a picture of a carry rig for the Kel-Tec AR-15 pistol. It doesn't look that comfortable though. I think I'll stick with my Glock 19. :?

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Good grief! Even in the shoulder rig with it all the way up to your armpit the thing hangs down below where my Ruger belt holster hangs my big revolver!

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Definitely too large...and difficult to shoot.

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How about a 12 Gauge?

The following is taken from http://www.csindy.com/csindy/2005-02-24/news3.html

Two years ago the City Council banned openly carrying guns at City Hall after

Colorado Springs resident Don Ortega began carrying a shotgun to their meetings. The resulting mayhem scared people off from attending council meetings. :what:

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reefteach wrote:

How about a 12 Gauge?

The following is taken from http://www.csindy.com/csindy/2005-02-24/news3.html

Two years ago the City Council banned openly carrying guns at City Hall after

Colorado Springs resident Don Ortega began carrying a shotgun to their meetings. The resulting mayhem scared people off from attending council meetings. :what:

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Hmmm... It didn't say if Mr. Ortega was threatening anyone with the shotgun, so I assume he was not. Some (stupid) people get too fixated on demonizing inanimate objects which they have been indoctrinated by liberal propaganda to fear... When, in reality, if Mr. Ortega is indeed a conscientious & responsible man, the council meeting attendees were actually SAFER with him there packing his 12ga!

If the consequences for committing violent crimes using firearms were actually harsh enough to deter the criminals themselves, our society would not have problems with irresponsible degenerates using any means to prey upon the weak. On top of that, there would be fewer criminals left alive or freeto do so repeatedly... But, the waythe criminal 'justice' systemis now, everyone indirectly shares equally in the consequences for the irresponsible actions of a few, in an attempt to keep everyone pacified and subdued (thus consequently, easily manipulated).

And so, it has come to this... When the general public fears crime, they are now brain-washed to automatically believe that the only logical solution is to reduce the number of guns (regardless of who has them, unless they have a 'badge')... when, in reality, anyone with a halfway-liberal-unadulterated brain could see that to prevent oneself from being a helpless victim of violent crime, they should carry a gun themselves!

But personal responsibility for one's morals, success, and safety is a rare commodity these days...

Carry on!

molonlabetn

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He was perfectly safe. He kept the break open, to show it was unloaded. He also painted the stock yellow, with a big smiley face on it. I agree they overreacted.

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I carried my big Ruger in the oc holster last evening to a Bloom store. No problems.

I'll continue trying it to see if it draws any more reaction than my XD.

Of course, as I've thought about it lately, to me, seeing a black high cap autopistol is just as "intimidating" as a physically larger revolver..

I'll report on what results I get.

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longwatch wrote:

Longs guns are kinda tricky, because they may be covered by locally enacted hunting statutes. http://www.dgif.virginia.gov/hunting/regulations/localordinances.asp. Then there is also the urban area loaded "assault weapon" ban, but if you have a permit you are exempt from that one.

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what permit would that be?

also, Where does one find locally enacted gun laws? Do local laws supercede gun laws of the state in Virginia?

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A Concealed handgun permit allows one to carry "assault weapons" in cities with over 160000, or an urban county with an executive board type of government. Check the link for local hunting ordinances that may apply to long guns. There used to be a better chart listing the laws but the DGIF did away with that this year. Some of the laws need to cleaned up to clearly allow for defensive carry of firearms. 15.2-1209.1 was but Gov. Kaine vetoed it this year.
§ 15.2-915.2. Regulation of transportation of a loaded rifle or shotgun.
The governing body of any county or city may by ordinance make it unlawful for any person to transport, possess or carry a loaded shotgun or loaded rifle in any vehicle on any public street, road, or highway within such locality. Any violation of such ordinance shall be punishable by a fine of not more than $100. Game wardens, sheriffs and all other law-enforcement officers shall enforce the provisions of this section. No ordinance adopted pursuant to this section shall be enforceable unless the governing body adopting such ordinance so notifies the Director of the Department of Game and Inland Fisheries by registered mail prior to May 1 of the year in which such ordinance is to take effect.
The provisions of this section shall not apply to duly authorized law-enforcement officers or military personnel in the performance of their lawful duties, nor to any person who reasonably believes that a loaded rifle or shotgun is necessary for his personal safety in the course of his employment or business.
§ 18.2-287.4. Carrying loaded firearms in public areas prohibited; penalty.
It shall be unlawful for any person to carry a loaded (a) semi-automatic center-fire rifle or pistol that expels single or multiple projectiles by action of an explosion of a combustible material and is equipped at the time of the offense with a magazine that will hold more than 20 rounds of ammunition or designed by the manufacturer to accommodate a silencer or equipped with a folding stock or (b) shotgun with a magazine that will hold more than seven rounds of the longest ammunition for which it is chambered on or about his person on any public street, road, alley, sidewalk, public right-of-way, or in any public park or any other place of whatever nature that is open to the public (i) in any city with a population of 160,000 or more or (ii) in any county having an urban county executive form of government or any county or city surrounded thereby or adjacent thereto or in any county having a county manager form of government.
The provisions of this section shall not apply to law-enforcement officers, licensed security guards, military personnel in the performance of their lawful duties, or any person having a valid concealed handgun permit or to any person actually engaged in lawful hunting or lawful recreational shooting activities at an established shooting range or shooting contest. Any person violating the provisions of this section shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor.


§ 29.1-527. Counties, cities or towns may prohibit hunting near public schools and county, city, town or regional parks.
The governing body of any county, city or town may prohibit by ordinance, shooting or hunting with a firearm, or prohibit hunters from traversing an area while in possession of a loaded firearm, within 100 yards of any property line of a public school or a county, city, town or regional park. The governing body may, in such ordinance, provide that any violation thereof shall be a Class 4 misdemeanor. Nothing in this section shall give any county, city or town the authority to enforce such an ordinance on lands within a national or state park or forest, or wildlife management area.
§ 15.2-1209.1. Counties may regulate carrying of loaded firearms on public highways.
The governing body of any county is hereby empowered to adopt ordinances making it unlawful for any person to carry or have in his possession while on any part of a public highway within such county a loaded firearm when such person is not authorized to hunt on the private property on both sides of the highway along which he is standing or walking; and to provide a penalty for violation of such ordinance not to exceed a fine of $100. The provisions of this section shall not apply to persons carrying loaded firearms in moving vehicles, or to persons acting at the time in defense of persons or property.

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longwatch wrote:

A Concealed handgun permit allows one to carry "assault weapons" in cities with over 160000, or an urban county with an executive board type of government. Check the link for local hunting ordinances that may apply to long guns. There used to be a better chart listing the laws but the DGIF did away with that this year. Some of the laws need to cleaned up to clearly allow for defensive carry of firearms. 15.2-1209.1 was but Gov. Kaine vetoed it this year.
§ 15.2-915.2. Regulation of transportation of a loaded rifle or shotgun.
The governing body of any county or city may by ordinance make it unlawful for any person to transport, possess or carry a loaded shotgun or loaded rifle in any vehicle on any public street, road, or highway within such locality. Any violation of such ordinance shall be punishable by a fine of not more than $100. Game wardens, sheriffs and all other law-enforcement officers shall enforce the provisions of this section. No ordinance adopted pursuant to this section shall be enforceable unless the governing body adopting such ordinance so notifies the Director of the Department of Game and Inland Fisheries by registered mail prior to May 1 of the year in which such ordinance is to take effect.
The provisions of this section shall not apply to duly authorized law-enforcement officers or military personnel in the performance of their lawful duties, nor to any person who reasonably believes that a loaded rifle or shotgun is necessary for his personal safety in the course of his employment or business.
§ 18.2-287.4. Carrying loaded firearms in public areas prohibited; penalty.
It shall be unlawful for any person to carry a loaded (a) semi-automatic center-fire rifle or pistol that expels single or multiple projectiles by action of an explosion of a combustible material and is equipped at the time of the offense with a magazine that will hold more than 20 rounds of ammunition or designed by the manufacturer to accommodate a silencer or equipped with a folding stock or (b) shotgun with a magazine that will hold more than seven rounds of the longest ammunition for which it is chambered on or about his person on any public street, road, alley, sidewalk, public right-of-way, or in any public park or any other place of whatever nature that is open to the public (i) in any city with a population of 160,000 or more or (ii) in any county having an urban county executive form of government or any county or city surrounded thereby or adjacent thereto or in any county having a county manager form of government.
The provisions of this section shall not apply to law-enforcement officers, licensed security guards, military personnel in the performance of their lawful duties, or any person having a valid concealed handgun permit or to any person actually engaged in lawful hunting or lawful recreational shooting activities at an established shooting range or shooting contest. Any person violating the provisions of this section shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor.


§ 29.1-527. Counties, cities or towns may prohibit hunting near public schools and county, city, town or regional parks.
The governing body of any county, city or town may prohibit by ordinance, shooting or hunting with a firearm, or prohibit hunters from traversing an area while in possession of a loaded firearm, within 100 yards of any property line of a public school or a county, city, town or regional park. The governing body may, in such ordinance, provide that any violation thereof shall be a Class 4 misdemeanor. Nothing in this section shall give any county, city or town the authority to enforce such an ordinance on lands within a national or state park or forest, or wildlife management area.
§ 15.2-1209.1. Counties may regulate carrying of loaded firearms on public highways.
The governing body of any county is hereby empowered to adopt ordinances making it unlawful for any person to carry or have in his possession while on any part of a public highway within such county a loaded firearm when such person is not authorized to hunt on the private property on both sides of the highway along which he is standing or walking; and to provide a penalty for violation of such ordinance not to exceed a fine of $100. The provisions of this section shall not apply to persons carrying loaded firearms in moving vehicles, or to persons acting at the time in defense of persons or property.

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So in summation: If I get a concealed licence I can carry a "assault rifle" like a M1A around? as I understand....?

Even if that understanding I hold is correct its still a crock of crap. "You cant defend yourself or carry arms unless we approve of it"


Know of any good links to sites where I can find out the Laws for different counties and cities in Virginia? I tried to look myself but it appears I am using the wrong keywords or something... I dont get much of anything other than activist articles and sites.

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Another problem with this is; how do you carry around an assault rifle without brandishing it? Here is § 18.2-282 on brandishing:

A. It shall be unlawful for any person to point, hold or brandish any firearm or any air or gas operated weapon or any object similar in appearance, whether capable of being fired or not, in such manner as to reasonably induce fear in the mind of another or hold a firearm or any air or gas operated weapon in a public place in such a manner as to reasonably induce fear in the mind of another of being shot or injured. However, this section shall not apply to any person engaged in excusable or justifiable self-defense. Persons violating the provisions of this section shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor or, if the violation occurs upon any public, private or religious elementary, middle or high school, including buildings and grounds or upon public property within 1,000 feet of such school property, he shall be guilty of a Class 6 felony.

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This is why open carry is legal, because if a handgun is in a holster you are not brandishing it. I think you would run into a lot of problems with an assault rifle and this section.