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Thread: Legal or NOT Legal

  1. #1
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    Hey Gang -- I have included aphoto of my dash and my 9MM. I am curious if thislocation in a vehicle is OK by the law and considered "in plain view". I do not have a concealed carry permit (yet). And have no desire to get arrested and lose my guns. I just have a problem laying a loaded 9MM on the dash board (top) in front of me. Seems too big to be up there and will definitely draw attention. I like the cup holder position. What do you think?







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    DeadCenter
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  2. #2
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    Or this one.



    Sorry I could not figure out how to do two pics in one msg.



    DeadCenter
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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    I think between the 2 I would go with the cupholder option. Is the holster secured to the console? It would be bad if it popped out and when you needed it it wasn't there. Your other option is to close to your hands and might not be good when dealing with the police.

  4. #4
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    Longwatch - You believe the instrument panel option is bad and too close to my hands???? If so, I believe the same thing. The cupholder is pretty secure. I can secure it better in the cup holder if this is the best place for it.




    Anybody else have any input?



    Thanks



    DeadCenter

  5. #5
    Regular Member VAopencarry's Avatar
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    Plain view, true nature not disguised, looks Open to me. I'd go with option 1 too.
    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." - Thomas Jefferson

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    DeadCenter:

    If your willing to do some drilling there are a few "vehicle mounting" options on the market. Fobus makes a vehicle mount for their roto-holster line (I wouldn't carry a fobus holster but would make for decent in-vehicle use) and there is another company called Sure Set (http://www.sshmi.com/index.html).

    If you want ot stay away from permanent modifications, I'd buy one of the cup holder pda/ipod/cell phone mounts and modify it to hold a holster or your choice.

  7. #7
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    I think I would go with the cupholder option too.



    Goliath

  8. #8
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    I think both your options are on the good side of grey area concealment in vehicles - in both photos, anyone at or near your car can see that there is a gun there. But if you have a concealed handgun permit accepted in VA, who cares?

    Carrying in a hip holster with seatbelt on, like I do, might be viewed as concealed if the belt coverd the gun such that it cannot be seen under common observation.

    I hope your cup holder rig allows you to draw one handed while driving

  9. #9
    Founder's Club Member Tess's Avatar
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    Dead Center - I like the cup holder option.



    I have a CCP, so I don't worry in my car. But I think your option #1 is perfect until/unless you get your permit.


    Tess
    Laws alone can not secure freedom of expression; in order that every man present his views without penalty there must be spirit of tolerance in the entire population. -Albert Einstein

  10. #10
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    I say to close to hands because for my own safety I would try to keep my hands in plain sight during a stop and the steering wheel is a good place to keep them.

    What you should do is take pictures from outside of your vehicle. We would have a better perspective on how a LEO would see your pistol.

    Since you don't have a permit I've been thinking about if you might want to inform a LEO that you have a pistol. It would help prove that you had no intent to conceal your pistol, but I'm conflicted because I don't think you should have to inform in general.



  11. #11
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    I think we agree option 1 (Cup Holder) is best. Let me get a picture from outside the vehicle with the window down. I will post it and we can take it from there. I can put it on the passenger seat. But, not if someone is with me.



    Thanks



  12. #12
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    Just for your information take a look at the case law for car carry and what is considered concealed. http://www.virginia1774.org/Page1.html#ConcealedWeapon
    Look in particular at Weatherford v. Commonwealth.

  13. #13
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    Just for your information take a look at the case law for car carry and what is considered concealed. http://www.virginia1774.org/Page1.html#ConcealedWeapon
    Look in particular at Weatherford v. Commonwealth.
    So plain view means plain view. -- Cupholder, seat or dash. All seem to be in plain view.

    DeadCenter

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    I usually just keep mine in the holster on my hip when i drive. How is that concealed? My windows are tinted enough and my car rides high enough that noone will be able to see it until they are standing right next to me. Should i just hold it in my hand with my hand out the window? That could be a form of OC in a car i guess, hell everyone would definately know you had one, youd just have to keep it in the holster as you held it out the window i guess...lol So am i concealing when i keep it on my hip? its a .45USP and does not get covered up by the seatbelt. But it is on my left side...

  15. #15
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    Ok -- I posted some photos shot from outside the vehicle.



    http://new.photos.yahoo.com/deadcnt



    Thanks



    DeadCenter

  16. #16
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    Awesome pics...great idea..I have just the holster that should do the same in my Mustang

  17. #17
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    I don't see why that wouldn't be in plain sight. I would think about the security of the weapon if you were ever in an accident or had to make hard evasive manuvers. you might want to consider something like the fobus mount mentioned earlier Home /Vehicle mount for the rotoholster or you could look at something like grassburs. The real advantage to the grassbur system is that you can use the same holster in multiple locations by just bying extra mounts points. The system is very simple and would seem effective. I haven't tried them yet, because the .45 is always on my side.

  18. #18
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    I almost suggested the Grassburs but DeadCenter does not yet have a concealed permit. It would take some searching to find a suitable location for one of the Grassbur hoslters that would be in the open.

  19. #19
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    Coltcarrier -- Thanks. Both of those mounts are nice. I see how the Grassburs would hide the gun too much.



    DC

  20. #20
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    on grassburs:
    I was thinking a right hand mount, on the side of panel that has the cup holder. It would still keep it fairly close to the cup holder, but it would still be easily visible. The pictures they have show it mounted under the dash, but there is nothing that says it can't be vertically mounted.

  21. #21
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    on the side of panel that has the cup holder



    Meaning on the passenger side of the compartment?



    DC

  22. #22
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    Look at this photo and picture the holster about 12ish inches higher, just below the a/c controls next to the power outlets.... that is kinda what I was referring to. Does that make it clearer? I'd hack a visual, but I'm not on my pc...

  23. #23
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    ColtCarrier -- Got it. Good photo. I will look at this option a little closer once Christmas has passed and I have a little breathing room.



    Thanks



    DC

  24. #24
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    I just keep mine hanging out on the passenger seat. But that would be a problem if you frequently have passengers.

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