Cops shoot another innocent senior citizen

VAopencarry · Jan 29, 2007

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Undercover LEO shoot and kill an old man (armed) trying to chase them from dealing drugs in front of his house.
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Edwards says the Undercover Narcotics Unit was using the area near Singletary's yard to bust drug operations in the neighborhood. He says words were exchanged between the undercover officers and Singletary.

What exactly was said is under investigation. Edwards says JSO is also investigating whether police identified themselves to Singletary before the shooting.

"The policy is that if you have the opportunity to identify yourself, we will identify ourselves," said Edwards.

Some who say they saw the shooting have a very different story. Neighbors there refer to Singletary as 'Pops.'

"That's the first thing he did. He came outside and asked, 'Will you please get off my property? You have no business on my property. You know you're wrong, get off my property.' The next thing you know, he said, 'He's got a gun.' So he ran around the tree and he shot Pops. Pops fell right here. Pops fired some shots, but all his shots hit the tree because the dude was behind the tree. That's exactly how it went," said Price Benton III, a neighbor.

Reporter: "Do you think he knew they were officers?"

"How? They didn't have nothing on that said, POLICE. After the man told them to get out of his yard, they didn't say, 'We're holding a police investigation out here, or we're officers.' They didn't say none of that," said Shafonda Boyeoten, a neighbor.

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/local/news-article.aspx?storyid=74585

adamwa · Jan 29, 2007

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Sounds to me like murder

markand · Jan 29, 2007

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It takes time for all of the facts to come out. If it went down as described so far, it will probably never be prosecuted as a crime.

Tomahawk · Jan 29, 2007

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"If you've got an individual that's got a firearm, then you have to do what you have to do based on your training to protect your life or protect the lives of others," said the Jacksonville Sheriff's Office Director of Homeland Security and Investigations, Micheal Edwards.

So the cops can dress and act like drug dealers and citizens who arm themselves to protect against drug dealers are expected to know they are cops? My head hurts.

Also, get a load of Mr. Edwards' title. "Jacksonville Sheriff's Office Director of Homeland Security and Investigations." Am I the only person that finds that disturbing?

lostone1413 · Feb 4, 2007

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Read www.keepandbeararms.net things like this happen evry often. Trouble is you won't see it make the news. Funny they kick in your door and you think it is a burglar and shoot one of them you go to jail for murder. They shoot someone who is innocent they get a promotion.

ProtectMd · Feb 4, 2007

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I would seriously question that departments protocol as far as that whole incident goes, not to mention look into the actions of those 2 LEO's. Not to mention the whole common sense type thing. First off, if the man lives in a high crime area, and he's 81 years old, and in his front yard with a firearm he has a right to be there. The castle doctrine says in florida that you have the right to stand your ground. I don't understand how they perceived him as a threat, but I can seriously understand how he can percieve them as a threat (their undercover gang/drug dealer business attire) not to mention the fact that it is his property and they don't have a warrant or probable cause to be there then they need to leave. By the sounding of it, it sounds like that man has had problems in the past, but there is also good reason why the drug dealers don't go on his property, I would imagine they were met with a firearm as well and decided that it wasn't worth the trouble. This sounds like a basic case of common sense though, and I can't say that I would have done any differently in that situation.

Based on what i've read and gathered, I think their intelligence sucks as far as dealing with the whole problem in the area, and you would think that part of their plan of prevention against these kinds of activities would to be notify people in the neighborhood that there will be a police presence undercover, and that will definately curb drug activity. I will bet that the drug dealers will take it elsewhere or stop all together. I don't understand why the citizens aren't apart of their whole crime prevention strategy, and involve the community in cleaning itself up, instead of making the police to be outsiders.

I still don't understand why they were in his yard, I hope they have a good explanation for it. Just because they are LEO's doesn't give them the right to go whereever they see fit just because, they ahve to have probable cause, and warrants and things like that, they just can't hang out in your front yard, or conduct their investigations using your property without your permission. And if you let them slide on 1 thing, then its another until before you know it, your door is getting kicked in because "they can".

One more thing. Out of those 5 people arrested, how many of them will actually serve jailtime for their activities? How many will be on the street the next day conducting the same business? This whole strategy they are using sounds like quantity arrests, not quality. Poor policework overall.

UTOC-45-44 · Feb 26, 2007

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ProtectMd wrote:

I would seriously question that departments protocol as far as that whole incident goes, not to mention look into the actions of those 2 LEO's. Not to mention the whole common sense type thing. First off, if the man lives in a high crime area, and he's 81 years old, and in his front yard with a firearm he has a right to be there. The castle doctrine says in florida that you have the right to stand your ground. I don't understand how they perceived him as a threat, but I can seriously understand how he can percieve them as a threat (their undercover gang/drug dealer business attire) not to mention the fact that it is his property and they don't have a warrant or probable cause to be there then they need to leave. By the sounding of it, it sounds like that man has had problems in the past, but there is also good reason why the drug dealers don't go on his property, I would imagine they were met with a firearm as well and decided that it wasn't worth the trouble. This sounds like a basic case of common sense though, and I can't say that I would have done any differently in that situation.

Based on what i've read and gathered, I think their intelligence sucks as far as dealing with the whole problem in the area, and you would think that part of their plan of prevention against these kinds of activities would to be notify people in the neighborhood that there will be a police presence undercover, and that will definately curb drug activity. I will bet that the drug dealers will take it elsewhere or stop all together. I don't understand why the citizens aren't apart of their whole crime prevention strategy, and involve the community in cleaning itself up, instead of making the police to be outsiders.

I still don't understand why they were in his yard, I hope they have a good explanation for it. Just because they are LEO's doesn't give them the right to go whereever they see fit just because, they ahve to have probable cause, and warrants and things like that, they just can't hang out in your front yard, or conduct their investigations using your property without your permission. And if you let them slide on 1 thing, then its another until before you know it, your door is getting kicked in because "they can".

One more thing. Out of those 5 people arrested, how many of them will actually serve jailtime for their activities? How many will be on the street the next day conducting the same business? This whole strategy they are using sounds like quantity arrests, not quality. Poor policework overall.

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"that part of their plan of prevention against these kinds of activities would to be notify people in the neighborhood that there will be a police presence undercover"

This can't be done cuz they can risk several months of investigation if the wrong person got hold this info and could jeapordize the OP. The least People that know the better they feel.

UTOC-45-44 · Feb 26, 2007

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ProtectMd wrote:

I would seriously question that departments protocol as far as that whole incident goes, not to mention look into the actions of those 2 LEO's. Not to mention the whole common sense type thing. First off, if the man lives in a high crime area, and he's 81 years old, and in his front yard with a firearm he has a right to be there. The castle doctrine says in florida that you have the right to stand your ground. I don't understand how they perceived him as a threat, but I can seriously understand how he can percieve them as a threat (their undercover gang/drug dealer business attire) not to mention the fact that it is his property and they don't have a warrant or probable cause to be there then they need to leave. By the sounding of it, it sounds like that man has had problems in the past, but there is also good reason why the drug dealers don't go on his property, I would imagine they were met with a firearm as well and decided that it wasn't worth the trouble. This sounds like a basic case of common sense though, and I can't say that I would have done any differently in that situation.

Based on what i've read and gathered, I think their intelligence sucks as far as dealing with the whole problem in the area, and you would think that part of their plan of prevention against these kinds of activities would to be notify people in the neighborhood that there will be a police presence undercover, and that will definately curb drug activity. I will bet that the drug dealers will take it elsewhere or stop all together. I don't understand why the citizens aren't apart of their whole crime prevention strategy, and involve the community in cleaning itself up, instead of making the police to be outsiders.

I still don't understand why they were in his yard, I hope they have a good explanation for it. Just because they are LEO's doesn't give them the right to go whereever they see fit just because, they ahve to have probable cause, and warrants and things like that, they just can't hang out in your front yard, or conduct their investigations using your property without your permission. And if you let them slide on 1 thing, then its another until before you know it, your door is getting kicked in because "they can".

One more thing. Out of those 5 people arrested, how many of them will actually serve jailtime for their activities? How many will be on the street the next day conducting the same business? This whole strategy they are using sounds like quantity arrests, not quality. Poor policework overall.

..."notify people in the neighborhood that there will be a police presence undercover"...

They can't do that due to not jeapardized the OP due to several months of investigations

ProtectMd · Feb 26, 2007

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Well alot of things are wrong with this situation. I can understand that it may conflict with an ongoing investigation, but at the same time, if they are raiding a potentially dangerous house across the street it would be nice for me to be told to keep my doors locked and let me know that something is about to happen.

Also, about suspicious activity. If that street is crime ridden to the point of where its an open air drug market, that guy could have called the cops on those people. Me personally, i would call the copsuntil they did send someoneout, or make the problem stop. Its going to take a community to clean up a community. The cops need to realize that they cannot do it alone, and that they will need the good citizens help and efforts to combat the problem. Perhaps thats what im trying to get at. Don't treat all of the neighborhood citizens and homeowners like criminals, send cops house to house, involving the people in a neighborhood watch, getting involved in the community, etc... and if you are going to do some sort of investigation, it wouldn't hurt to alert the people that there will be a police presence in the area whether its undercover or marked at all times, and that things are going to improve.

I would like to relate to an incident where I live, they were chasing a convicted felon who had just committed a home invasion and were chasing him across peoples property lines. An unmarked police car was sitting at the bottom of my driveway out of view of the general public area. I was leaving my house and as I came around the corner, I almost hit the police car in my driveway. I think we scared the hell out of him, as much as he scared us. He told us why he was there. We asked him why he didn't come to our residence to inform us that he would be hanging out on our property and he told us he thought that we weren't home. I dunno. I didn't mind the fact that he was there but its common courtesy I think in these sorts of situations to inform the people about a danger to the public don't you think? Thats why I listen to my police scanner...

ProtectMd · Feb 26, 2007

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One more thing. If you inform the residents that there will be a police presence it might deter drug dealers enough to take it somewhere else, or stop their activities in that location altogether?

Cops shoot another innocent senior citizen

VAopencarry

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adamwa

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markand

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Tomahawk

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lostone1413

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ProtectMd

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UTOC-45-44

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UTOC-45-44

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ProtectMd

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ProtectMd

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