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Thread: Open Carry during a HOA meeting on church property

  1. #1
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    All, I wanted to get an opinion from teh forum. Our Home Owners Association will be holding a meeting open to all home owners at a church classroom on church property. Am I authorized to carry? Does this but up against the no carry at perochial schoolrule? Your thoughts?

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    § 18.2-308.1. Possession of firearm, stun weapon, or other weapon on school property prohibited

    The above statute would be of particular interest because you indicate the meeting is being held within the school. It indicates that it is unlawful to carry on school property.

    Otherwise, the following statute would apply if it were not being held in the school...

    § 18.2-283. Carrying dangerous weapon to place of religious worship states:

    If any person carry any gun, pistol, bowie knife, dagger or other dangerous weapon, without good and sufficient reason, to a place of worship while a meeting for religious purposes is being held at such place he shall be guilty of a Class 4 misdemeanor.
    Your HOA meeting does not qualify as a "meeting for religious purposes". So, technically, it is legal as best I can tell. There seems to be some gray area here as well, though. One question that comes to mind is if it is lawful to carry to the church for a meeting not of a religious nature while meetings of a religious nature are occurring at the same time.

    Are churches also considered private property? I assume so, because it is not maintained publicy. If so, the owners/manager can state and/or post that weapons are not allowed and violating this would be a tresspass charge.

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    If they have a K-12 school I would say no, but as long as the meeting isn't for religious purposes there is no question that it is ok.

    VRmiller is right the church does have the right to post or eject you if they wish.

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    I believe this church does have a k-12 school associated with it, but this will take place at 7 PM, after school hours.

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    Taclead wrote:
    I believe this church does have a k-12 school associated with it, but this will take place at 7 PM, after school hours.
    Time of day makes no difference. That it is a school makes it off limits to open carry in general and concealed carry outside of a car. It is a class 6 felony.

    http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp...cod+18.2-308.1

    B. If any person possesses any firearm designed or intended to expel a projectile by action of an explosion of a combustible material while such person is upon (i) any public, private or religious elementary, middle or high school, including buildings and grounds; (ii) that portion of any property open to the public and then exclusively used for school-sponsored functions or extracurricular activities while such functions or activities are taking place; or (iii) any school bus owned or operated by any such school, he shall be guilty of a Class 6 felony; however, if the person possesses any firearm within a public, private or religious elementary, middle or high school building and intends to use, or attempts to use, such firearm, or displays such weapon in a threatening manner, such person shall be sentenced to a mandatory minimum term of imprisonment of five years to be served consecutively with any other sentence.

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    longwatch wrote:
    That it is a school makes it off limits to open carry in general and concealed carry outside of a car. It is a class 6 felony.
    The importance of knowing all applicable firearms laws and regulations cannot be over emphasized. ONE single mistake can result in the loss of 2A rights for LIFE. Thanks for the reminder, longwatch.

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    ParaWarthog wrote:
    longwatch wrote:
    That it is a school makes it off limits to open carry in general and concealed carry outside of a car.* It is a class 6 felony.
    The importance of knowing all applicable firearms laws and regulations cannot be over emphasized.* ONE single mistake can result in the loss of 2A rights for LIFE.* Thanks for the reminder, longwatch.
    Not to mention getting to meet your new cage mate "Bubba".:what:

    Regards
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    longwatch wrote:
    Taclead wrote:
    I believe this church does have a k-12 school associated with it, but this will take place at 7 PM, after school hours.
    Time of day makes no difference. That it is a school makes it off limits to open carry in general and concealed carry outside of a car. It is a class 6 felony.

    http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp...cod+18.2-308.1

    B. If any person possesses any firearm designed or intended to expel a projectile by action of an explosion of a combustible material while such person is upon (i) any public, private or religious elementary, middle or high school, including buildings and grounds; (ii) that portion of any property open to the public and then exclusively used for school-sponsored functions or extracurricular activities while such functions or activities are taking place; or (iii) any school bus owned or operated by any such school, he shall be guilty of a Class 6 felony; however, if the person possesses any firearm within a public, private or religious elementary, middle or high school building and intends to use, or attempts to use, such firearm, or displays such weapon in a threatening manner, such person shall be sentenced to a mandatory minimum term of imprisonment of five years to be served consecutively with any other sentence.
    Hey, that's the answer I was looking for my question about carrying at my Knights of Columbus meeting. Even though it's in a meeting room and not religious worship, this church does have a K-12 school, so that's that.

    As far as whothe legal owner of the property is, that depends on the church. For Catholic churches, the Archdiocese is the legal property owner. The parish and or priest are more like managers of the property than anything.

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    BobCav wrote:
    Hey, that's the answer I was looking for my question about carrying at my Knights of Columbus meeting. Even though it's in a meeting room and not religious worship, this church does have a K-12 school, so that's that.
    I am unsure about your parish, but the parish I am registered in has a seperate Knights of Columbus facility that is adjacent to the church property (which does have a school facility on the grounds). I don't know of the logistics concerning the relationship between the Church and the Knights of Columbus and it's easements, but to play it safe, I never carry on the grounds of my parish or adjacent facilities. I will likely avoid carrying on Church and/or Knight's facilities until such time that the VA state laws are relaxed a bit.


    What are the logistics in regards to Knights of Columbus and the Catholic Church?

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    vrwmiller wrote:
    BobCav wrote:
    Hey, that's the answer I was looking for my question about carrying at my Knights of Columbus meeting. Even though it's in a meeting room and not religious worship, this church does have a K-12 school, so that's that.
    I am unsure about your parish, but the parish I am registered in has a seperate Knights of Columbus facility that is adjacent to the church property (which does have a school facility on the grounds). I don't know of the logistics concerning the relationship between the Church and the Knights of Columbus and it's easements, but to play it safe, I never carry on the grounds of my parish or adjacent facilities. I will likely avoid carrying on Church and/or Knight's facilities until such time that the VA state laws are relaxed a bit.


    What are the logistics in regards to Knights of Columbus and the Catholic Church?
    Our meetings are in an all-purpose-room that is physically connected to the school and the church. The Knights of Columbus are the largest Catholic Men's fraternal benefit organizationthat supports our church andour community through charity events, mutual aid, and fellowship and a whole lot more. You can find out more info here: http://www.kofc.org/un/index.cfm If you're interested in joining, send me a PM!






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    Try tohave your next HOA meeting in a Public Library!

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    Do the carry laws apply to all schools or only nationally accredited schools? Not all Christian schools have national accreditation.

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    longwatch wrote:
    Taclead wrote:
    I believe this church does have a k-12 school associated with it, but this will take place at 7 PM, after school hours.
    Time of day makes no difference. That it is a school makes it off limits to open carry in general and concealed carry outside of a car. It is a class 6 felony.

    http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp...cod+18.2-308.1

    B. If any person possesses any firearm designed or intended to expel a projectile by action of an explosion of a combustible material while such person is upon (i) any public, private or religious elementary, middle or high school, including buildings and grounds; (ii) that portion of any property open to the public and then exclusively used for school-sponsored functions or extracurricular activities while such functions or activities are taking place; or (iii) any school bus owned or operated by any such school, he shall be guilty of a Class 6 felony; however, if the person possesses any firearm within a public, private or religious elementary, middle or high school building and intends to use, or attempts to use, such firearm, or displays such weapon in a threatening manner, such person shall be sentenced to a mandatory minimum term of imprisonment of five years to be served consecutively with any other sentence.
    There's one thing I've always wondered whenever I read this code. What gives the state the right to restrict gun possession on the property of private schools? If they can do this, what prevents the state from making it illegal to carry anywhere that school aged children are present? It seems like private schools, and churches that have private schools on the property, should be able to opt out of this. Otherwise, the state is taking rights away from them that other property holders have.

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