• We are now running on a new, and hopefully much-improved, server. In addition we are also on new forum software. Any move entails a lot of technical details and I suspect we will encounter a few issues as the new server goes live. Please be patient with us. It will be worth it! :) Please help by posting all issues here.
  • The forum will be down for about an hour this weekend for maintenance. I apologize for the inconvenience.
  • If you are having trouble seeing the forum then you may need to clear your browser's DNS cache. Click here for instructions on how to do that
  • Please review the Forum Rules frequently as we are constantly trying to improve the forum for our members and visitors.

stupid

bellbw

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 20, 2007
Messages
48
Location
, ,
imported post

There is a friend of mine who thinks he knows everything about guns because one of his old friends owned basically an arsenal of sigs, springfield armory and other expensve guns. He talks about how much he knows, but apparently he knows nothing. The other day I finally let him handle my bersa with regret (I usually never let anyone handle it, ever). Nothing went off, and there was no accident, but it burns in the back of my skull just how bad it could have been. I unloaded it before I handed it to him, and he just snatched up the clipped and tried to chamber a round on a gun he had never worked before because he knows everything about every gun apparently. While trying to chamber a round he was pointing it directly at his dog. I told him to watch where he was pointing it, so he turns and starts pointing it directly at another guys head who was in the room with us. He tries to chamber the round at this moment before I can stop him, and doesnt even pull the slide back far enough to chamber it, and it jams. He proceeds to try to unjam it while still pointing it at this guy while I am telling him over and over to point it up toward the ceiling. Finally, I grabbed the slide, pointed it toward the ceiling, and pulled on the outside of the trigger guard to get enough pressure to keep the slide back, and manuevered it out of his hand. He actually said "just point it at me, I don't care, its notgonna go off". I then, pointed it in a safe direction, unloaded it, and left as soon as I could because I was so furious at his stupidity. And yes, I say stupidity because he thinks he knows so f***ing much, when all he knows is what expensive guns are supposed to be nice, but nothing about gun safety. The worst part is he claims to know about it, and refuses to listen to me when I tell him what he actually needs to be doing. I have tried numerous times to tell him what he needs to do,and that is the only time he has held my bersa, and best believe the last. He keeps asking me when I am going to take him to the range and challenging that he can have better acuracy than me even though he hasnt shot in years, and I shoot every few weeks. He will never be seen shooting with me, you can bet on that.I just dont understand these people. Do they want to become a statistic. I just cant get the thought out of my mind that someone could have been shot because of my one moment of weakness in my trust with him handling it. I feel it is more my fault than anyones. Just needed to vent...it bothers me so much, I dont think anyone but me, my dad, and my girlfriend (who was patient enough and eager enough to learn each and every detail that my dad and I taught her about gun safety will be allowed to ever handle any of my guns anymore, loaded or unloaded. This is a friend I hang out with on a regular basis, but this one situation has led me to completely avoid his phonecalls because it makes me realize how ignorant he is.
I guess my overall message is here, is be aware of who you let handle them. I know we all know this, but until you see the potential disaster that I was staring at yesterday, sometimes it is hard to fathom. If someone is willing to learn and implement the safety standards that are set, its a whole nother game, but some people should never be allowed to hold a gun. I feel stupid for ever letting him hold it. BE SAFE guys! Don't make my mistake that could have ended up way worse.
 

kle

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Messages
348
Location
, Virginia, USA
imported post

Yeah, man...gotta set him down a little. A bit too much stupidity and not enough common sense.

If, someday, he really wants to learn, and you're willing to teach him proper gun-handling technique (i.e. the 4 Rules), bring along some snap-caps: looks like the real thing, but won't come with any consequences in case he gets the urge to work the trigger with the gun pointed at someone's face. Except for you to reprimand him for doing that and not following the 4 Rules (all four of which would've been broken).

Makes me almost kinda understand why getting a Concealed Handgun Permit in Virginia requires training in gun-safety, and it kinda scares me that, in your friend's case, he doesn't need a permit or any training to carry a firearm openly. Some people should just not be able to have guns--they will eventually give the Anti-Rights people another reason/statistic to further encroach on our Right to Keep and Bear Arms.

We must be vigilant--we are the vanguard. We must safely store our sidearms at all times, be mindful of where they're pointed, and who or what is doing the pointing. We must uphold an image of responsibility to show the others.

Please, be safe. As often as this is repeated, as often as this is a sign-off or signature for other people's posts here, it is nevertheless a genuine sentiment: Do be safe.
 

bellbw

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 20, 2007
Messages
48
Location
, ,
imported post

Yea, he thinks because he has shot so many nice guns that he doesnt need any training, so unless he comes to me and asked, he is done with handling mine anyway. I agree that some sort of at least short training course should be required before your first purchace (or a test you can take that lets you opt out of the class for people who already know what they are doing, as many of us were taught correctly by our elders). The problem is, many people know the rules and get so comfortable with guns they think they do not apply. I don't even like when a seller hands it to me with the barrel pointed in my direction even knowing the shelf guns are unloaded. Oh well....BE SAFE.
 

psmartin

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 2, 2006
Messages
205
Location
Richmond, Virginia, USA
imported post

I am concerned for anyone who doesn`t show a healthy "fear" of improper/unsafe handling.

last month a guy shot both of his kids by accident(1 bullet, 2 hits = real bad luck) while cleaning his collection.

every good electrician has a healthy fear of electricity, every gun owner needs to realize these objects can cause death without prudent and cautious handling.

bellbw wrote:
Yea, he thinks because he has shot so many nice guns that  he doesnt need any training, so unless he comes to me and asked, he is done with handling mine anyway. I agree that some sort of at least short training course should be required before your first purchace (or a test you can take that lets you opt out of the class for people who already know what they are doing, as many of us were taught correctly by our elders). The problem is, many people know the rules and get so comfortable with guns they think they do not apply. I don't even like when a seller hands it to me with the barrel pointed in my direction even knowing the shelf guns are unloaded. Oh well....BE SAFE.
 

Tess

Founder's Club Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2006
Messages
3,837
Location
Bryan, TX
imported post

bellbw wrote:
There is a friend of mine who thinks he knows everything about guns because one of his old friends owned basically an arsenal of sigs, springfield armory and other expensve guns. He talks about how much he knows, but apparently he knows nothing. The other day I finally let him handle my bersa with regret (I usually never let anyone handle it, ever). Nothing went off, and there was no accident, but it burns in the back of my skull just how bad it could have been. I unloaded it before I handed it to him, and he just snatched up the clipped and tried to chamber a round on a gun he had never worked before because he knows everything about every gun apparently. While trying to chamber a round he was pointing it directly at his dog. I told him to watch where he was pointing it, so he turns and starts pointing it directly at another guys head who was in the room with us. He tries to chamber the round at this moment before I can stop him, and doesnt even pull the slide back far enough to chamber it, and it jams. He proceeds to try to unjam it while still pointing it at this guy while I am telling him over and over to point it up toward the ceiling. Finally, I grabbed the slide, pointed it toward the ceiling, and pulled on the outside of the trigger guard to get enough pressure to keep the slide back, and manuevered it out of his hand. He actually said "just point it at me, I don't care, its notgonna go off". I then, pointed it in a safe direction, unloaded it, and left as soon as I could because I was so furious at his stupidity. And yes, I say stupidity because he thinks he knows so f***ing much, when all he knows is what expensive guns are supposed to be nice, but nothing about gun safety. The worst part is he claims to know about it, and refuses to listen to me when I tell him what he actually needs to be doing. I have tried numerous times to tell him what he needs to do,and that is the only time he has held my bersa, and best believe the last. He keeps asking me when I am going to take him to the range and challenging that he can have better acuracy than me even though he hasnt shot in years, and I shoot every few weeks. He will never be seen shooting with me, you can bet on that.I just dont understand these people. Do they want to become a statistic. I just cant get the thought out of my mind that someone could have been shot because of my one moment of weakness in my trust with him handling it. I feel it is more my fault than anyones. Just needed to vent...it bothers me so much, I dont think anyone but me, my dad, and my girlfriend (who was patient enough and eager enough to learn each and every detail that my dad and I taught her about gun safety will be allowed to ever handle any of my guns anymore, loaded or unloaded. This is a friend I hang out with on a regular basis, but this one situation has led me to completely avoid his phonecalls because it makes me realize how ignorant he is.
I guess my overall message is here, is be aware of who you let handle them. I know we all know this, but until you see the potential disaster that I was staring at yesterday, sometimes it is hard to fathom. If someone is willing to learn and implement the safety standards that are set, its a whole nother game, but some people should never be allowed to hold a gun. I feel stupid for ever letting him hold it. BE SAFE guys! Don't make my mistake that could have ended up way worse.


Don't beat yourself up forever. You recognize you did something you shouldn't have, but you also learned quite a lesson.

When he asks when you'e going shooting, your answer should be "never". He'll be deflated, and will probably argue, but your point is that you don't shoot voluntarily with people who aren't responsible enough to handle the weapons safely.

I understand where you're coming from. My dad was a collector. It was not unusual to have 5-6 guys sitting around the kitchen table passing guns around and talking guns. There was one friend Dad really liked, but whe he was around there were never any guns out. Dad had seen him once behaving poorly with a weapon. I was too young, and don't really know what kinds of conversations went on about it, but I know there was never a gun out of the safe when Mike was around.


And I have refused to deal with the dealer (at Chantilly, no less) who picked up the Wather PPK to show me, but kept his finger inside the trigger guard. I went elsewhere, and I informed him why I was leaving.
 

LEO 229

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2007
Messages
7,606
Location
USA
imported post

Don't let it bother you too much....

I NEVER let anyone handle my firearms unless I completely trust them. You knew this guy was a knucklehead and gave him a chance to prove it.

I would never do anything gun related with this guy!! He is not safe and will most likely put the lives of others at risk every time he picks up a gun.
 

IanB

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 18, 2006
Messages
1,896
Location
Northern VA
imported post

Whenever I let anyone look at my firearms I make it clear that:

a: It will be unloaded and REMAIN unloaded.
b: I will hover over you like a jealous girlfriend until you give it back.
c: You will obey all firearms laws while in possession of said firearm.
d: You may dry-fire the firearm (centerfire only) in a safe direction.
e: If you ask I will show you how it works and take it apart.
f: If you want to see the ammo you must hand the gun back to me first.
g: If I ask for the gun back you hand it back immediately, no "just a second" baloney.

There may be more but that's all I can think of right now.
 

Citizen

Founder's Club Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2006
Messages
18,269
Location
Fairfax Co., VA
imported post

Based on the original post, I'm guessing the unsafe one has some mental stability problems or ahistory of drug abuse. Maybe taking medication for for a mentalproblem currently. I've met people who were a little or a lot loose with their firearms safety, but never anyonethis bad. Telling someone to point the gun at them isn't just unsafe, its reckless--well beyond not knowingor practicinga safetypoint here and there.

Its a good cautionary anecdote,however.I'm glad to have received the information.
 

casullshooter

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2006
Messages
490
Location
Bristow, Virginia, USA
imported post

Better to lose a friend because he is mad than to attend his or anyone elses funeral caused by your gun in his hands . Doing the right thing is not always the easiest path.......
 

ParaWarthog

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 16, 2007
Messages
206
Location
, ,
imported post

I've always used the saying "You don't get a retry with a gun accident." I am always amazed at the lack of safety displayed by some who are supposedly gun afficionados. I don't feel bad about correcting their unsafe behavior, either.
 
Top