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Thread: Action Item - tell Governor Kaine to put his pen down!

  1. #1
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    To sendGovernor Kaine anemail, go to: http://www.governor.virginia.gov/Abo...ctGovernor.cfm

    Sample message:


    SUBJECT: Please put that pen down!

    Dear Governor Kaine:

    Virginia leads the entire nation in reporting properly adjudicated findings of mental incompetency and incapacity to the federal government - some 80,000 reports!

    Please do not sign any rash executive order turning over mental health related records where there was not a properly adjudicated finding of mental incompetency and incapacity to the federal government - once those people retroactively lose their gun and other civil rights without any due process, they will never get their rights back.

    The Virginia Tech murders do call for action after proper study - but not simple REACTION with permanent consequences to potentially sane and innocent Americans who might have merely voluntarily undergone mental heath screening and treatment.

    If you do want to do something to increase campus security right now, issue an executive order barring VA colleges from administratively banning (the currently legal) concealed carry by students and staff who are permit holders over 21.

    Please let me know what you are going to do.

    Sincerely,
    YOUR NAME


    ----------------


    **************************************
    OpenCarry.org Press Release – 25 April 2007
    **************************************

    [/b]
    OpenCarry.org calls on Virginia Governor Tim Kaine (D) and Congress to take a breather before rushing to add millions of American's names to federal list of crazies![/b]
    [/b]
    If Kaine wants to do something now, he should issue an executive order barring VA colleges from administratively banning (the currently legal) concealed carry by students and staff who are permit holders over 21. [/b]
    [/b]
    If you like the federal no-fly list, you'll love what's coming next - the fortified crazy man list, brought to you bya friendly executive order!

    See "Kaine May Seek More Data for Gun Sales; Order Would Address Buyers' Mental Health," The Washington Post, byBrigid Schulte, 25 April 2007, p. A1, available at http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/04/24/AR2007042402524.html?hpid=topnews.

    Of course everybody agrees ex post that criminal madman Cho should have been a prohibited person as far as gun possession goes, and that he should have been committed to a medical institution and helped.

    But does that mean that everybody who evervoluntarily agreed to undergo mental health evaluation and treatment should be added to the federal crazy man list? Especially when federal gun disabilities are lifetime and there is no way to get off the list once added, even if cured?

    Governor Kaine is now considering forwarding names and personal identifying information on persons who, like Cho,voluntarily agreed to undergo mental health evaluation and treatment. If copied by other states, the result would not just betheretroactive removal of gun rights for millions of Americans without any notice - the federal crazy man list will interfere in Americans' right to work in most jobs requiring security clearance or background checks - increasingly, that's most people!

    Sliding down that slope, will crazy man list people's right to air travel be banned next - and an annotation placed on the person's REAL ID so that this ban can be enforced?

    The unintended consequences of a fortified federal crazy manlist in this era of identity theft and fraud will be immense.

    So to will be the deterrent effect on anybody in the future from seeking mental health treatment the sick will avoid treatment to protect their privacy and civil rights.

    If Kaine wants to do something now, he should issue an executive order barring VA colleges from administratively banning currently legal concealed carry by permit holders over 21.

    The Virginia Tech Student Assembly is now rumored to be considering a student bill to ask the VT Administration to repeal the student administrative gun ban for permit holders onthe VT campuseffective immediately

    Meanwhile, college groups are springing up around the country calling for right to carry - see http://concealedcampus.org.

    Further, in the next session, the VA General Assembly should decriminalize gun carry by permit holders on K-12 school grounds - we should have learned by now - no more gun free zones which is just a euphemism for victim disarmament zones.

    Congress too should slow down - now that the NRA has apparently folded it's opposition to RepresentativeCarolyn McCarthy's (D-NY) H.R. 297, Gun Owners of America appears to be the only major civil rights group in the United States standing up like the 300 Spartans did to Xerxes against the largest policy by anecdote steamroller seen since Sept. 11th brought us the Patriot Act.

    Click on the "VA Tech Shootings Spur Far-reaching Gun Control" link at http://www.gunowners.org/activism.htm.

    Let's be careful about letting government create anymore lists.

    ##########################
    Contact anytime on gun stories:
    Mike Stollenwerk/John Pierce
    http://www.OpenCarry.org
    ##########################

  2. #2
    Campaign Veteran roscoe13's Avatar
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    Make sure you proof read before using the sample message, there are several typos and mispelled words....

    Already sent mine ;-)
    "The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good." - George Washington

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    Sent

  4. #4
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    Ya.. Spell check before you send it off. I found some errors.

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    Founder's Club Member Tess's Avatar
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    Further, it appears his proposed knee-jerk reaction won't exclude those who seek counseling outside Virginia; in effect he penalizes citizens of the Commonwealth for seeking help. I included that in my modifications.
    Laws alone can not secure freedom of expression; in order that every man present his views without penalty there must be spirit of tolerance in the entire population. -Albert Einstein

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    roscoe13 wrote:
    Make sure you proof read before using the sample message, there are several typos and mispelled words....

    Already sent mine ;-)
    Sorry, typos fixed now I think.

  7. #7
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    Mike wrote:
    Sorry, typos fixed now I think.
    I wasn't trying to be critical, but we'll probably have a better chance of having a positive effect if we seem professional. Only other change I made was to add a "Please" at the beginning of "Do not sign any rash executive order"

    Peace
    "The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good." - George Washington

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    Sent

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    Regular Member 638Fitta's Avatar
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    My lovely wife, my son, and myself each sent one. Thanks for the sample and link.

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    All done

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    Regular Member Tricorn's Avatar
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    Done.

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    Sent!

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    Regular Member 638Fitta's Avatar
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    Hey all-

    Please take the time to go to GOA/ Gun Owners of America ( dot org ), and sign up for email alerts and also please reply to the HR297 on the legislative action center. That is if you haven't alreadyI would post a link but to be honest I don't know how to! And if you don't mind, please spread the word throughout the boards and where ever you go.

    Thanks!

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    www.goa.org is the link. They are great.

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    shdwrdr



    Thank you for posting the link.

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    shdwrdr wrote:
    http://www.goa.org is the link. They are great.

    Actually, it's http://www.gunowners.org/

    Peace
    "The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good." - George Washington

  17. #17
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    oops, my mistake. I tried to remember it off the top of my head. Sorry.

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    Kaine has made his executive order.

    http://www.wrva.com/cc-common/news/s...rticle=2056122

    Governor Says He's Closed Gun Loophole
    Virginia Governor Tim Kaine Says He Has Closed The Gun Loophole That Allowed Virginia Tech Shooter Seung-Hui Cho To Buy GunsBy The Associated PressMonday, April 30, 2007 RICHMOND, Va. (AP) _ Governor Tim Kaine said today he has closed the loophole that allowed a mentally disturbed Virginia Tech student to buy the guns he used to kill 32 classmates and faculty two weeks ago.

    Kaine says he issued an executive order today requiring immediately that the names of persons found dangerous and ordered to undergo involuntary mental health treatment be entered in a database barring the sale of firearms.

    Seung-Hui Cho had been ordered by a court to undergo psychiatric counseling after he was ruled to present a danger to himself.

    But because Cho was treated as an outpatient and never committed to a mental health hospital, the court finding never made it into the database that federal law requires gun dealers to check before selling a firearm.

    The law prohibits selling firearms to people judged to have mental disabilities.


    (Copyright 2007 by The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved.)


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    Kaine says he issued an executive order today requiring immediately that the names of persons found dangerous and ordered to undergo involuntary mental health treatment be entered in a database barring the sale of firearms.

    I do not like gun control either but... I feel this is needed.

    Can any of you actually say it is bad topreventdangerous people with mental problems from buying guns??

    Think about it before you scream out "2nd Amendment!!" "Gun Control!!"

    Let me think back over the past year of people who had access to guns.....

    Kennedy (dangerous mental who murdered two cops)

    Cho (dangerous mental who murdered 32 people)

    The keyword here is DANGEROUS!!! Not DEPRESSED!!


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    hlh wrote:
    Hi Leo, very seldom has any gun control law been up front and honest about what was truly written in the bill. If this actually keeps just crazies, that are declared crazy by medically training psychologists, from getting guns then great. But if it does the same thing the "domestic violence" bill did years ago where a misdemeanor causes one to loose constitutional rights for a life time, then it's bad. Ifa person can't go to family counseling without being labelled "crazy", then it's bad. I hope you're right.
    From what I heard on the news... the reporting system will apply only to those who are certified as dangerous and are forced into seeking help.

    If I recall correctly... the court ordered Cho to get help but the type of help was not at the level to restrict him from purchasing a gun.

    Now... when the court orders either type of help... it will be reported. So it will take the court to get involved before someone is banned from purchases.

    If you think about it.... recently we have had many crazy peopleusing guns to harm others. The people focus on the guns and start calling for gun control when we really need people control!!

    This law now stops crazy people from buying a dangerous weapon that can be used to kill several people in a matter of minutes.

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    hlh wrote:
    LEO 229 wrote:
    From what I heard on the news...
    That's just my point. I've read the same news. The media sells us a bad bill. The media sold us the "assault weapon" bill, and is selling it again. When does the media get anything mostly correct? We're often sold a "bill of goods". I hope this does what the "media" has told us, and nothing else.

    Well, this is true.... :?

    But is is going to happen so we can only hope for the best.

    I did hear something about "them" trying to get the assault weapon ban going again. Geezz!!! Like it really stops gun violence.

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    Founder's Club Member Tess's Avatar
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    LEO 229 wrote:
    The keyword here is DANGEROUS!!! Not DEPRESSED!!
    Do you trust someone who might get sued with making an objective determination? I don't. I envision everyone who is treated for whatever reason being in some database from which he can never extricate himself.

    I know way too many people who have gone through some hellish times, and have needed help - serious help, but have overcome those difficulties. Specifically, some veterans who have seen hell ... but who work through it. I would trust some of these with my life - or with my guns - but I don't trust the Commonwealth to treat them fairly. Call it too much interaction with state/county authorities.
    Laws alone can not secure freedom of expression; in order that every man present his views without penalty there must be spirit of tolerance in the entire population. -Albert Einstein

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    Tess wrote:
    LEO 229 wrote:
    The keyword here is DANGEROUS!!! Not DEPRESSED!!
    Do you trust someone who might get sued with making an objective determination? I don't. I envision everyone who is treated for whatever reason being in some database from which he can never extricate himself.

    I know way too many people who have gone through some hellish times, and have needed help - serious help, but have overcome those difficulties. Specifically, some veterans who have seen hell ... but who work through it. I would trust some of these with my life - or with my guns - but I don't trust the Commonwealth to treat them fairly. Call it too much interaction with state/county authorities.
    It really has nothing to do with being sued. I can be sued every day for false arrest but that does not stop me from arresting people. I know that what I am doing is right, just, and proper.

    The docs are going to do what needs to be done just as they always have. If someone is dangerous... the docsare going to act as they always have. The paperwork with be obtained thru a magistrate and the person will be involuntarily held till he can have a hearing a few days later.

    He will be taken off the streets and the public will be a little safer for a while. If he has beenreported as dangerous and cannot buy a gun.. that is fine with me. I do not want Cho walking into a police station killing people with guns he just bought.

    I have the right to live and not be murdered by a known mental patient who is known to be dangerous.

    The only way your going on the list is if your a danger. Seeking help for an addiction or marital counseling is not going to do it.


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    Here is another spin to consider. It is being marketed as closing that fictions gun show loop hole. While the any legislation that is not specific to exactly what mental problems it bad; the way it is being marked might not be.
    I have not seen the exact order to decide how closely he has stuck to his ass, oh I mean donkey, roots to completely understand the damage Kaine has just caused. I just don't trust anything coming out of a rottencrat as there is always something bad going to come out of their 'common sense'.
    While I don't want crazy people getting on a murder binge I also don't to approve of being limited in my exercise of freedom. Because admit it … people are never misdiagnosed. If people weren't so gullible as to believe every lie the politicians and media tell we would not be in this situation.





    Licensing the press is only a common sense measure to assure that the dissemination of information is true and of fact.

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    For those interested, I have pasted the text of the executive order in the following thread:

    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum54/2379.html

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