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Thread: Informing law enforcement while driving...

  1. #1
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    Hey everyone, im back, and guess what i brought more trouble with me! :?

    So today im goin down 264 and goin a lil fast and i get pulled over. The cop, wo wasnt very nice to begin with, takes my license and registaration back to his car to write my ticket.

    When he returns he gives me te ticket to sign and what not and THEN says i saw when you opened your wallet that you had a gun permit (first off i didnt open my wallet, my IDs are in a carrying thing that i keep in my front pocket), then he asked are you carrying. I tell him no, im not.

    He then says "Well you know that its that law that if pulled over you have to tell the officer that you have a permit and whether or not you are carrying"

    I told him, no, ive always heard the opposite. He then said "Well i put a hit on your license so if you dont inform law enforcement when you get pulled over again then you will lose your permit"

    Am i nuts? Is packing.org that wrong? that site says you dont have to inform.

    I looked it up in the codes and couldnt find anyhting, i looked it up in my Virginia Gun owners guide, nothing. I called the police department, asked th enice lady if she could tell me the code. She put me on hold for a few minutes then came back adn said she couldnt find any code. Please tell me someone knows somehting here!! Not only did he say that i had to tell an LEO whether or not i had a gun but also that i have a permit!!

    Please help me before i really think that this whole place has gone insane and i lock myself in a basement and wait for the end of the world...



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    There is NO duty to inform. You only have to produce your permit if you are carrying and are asked by the officer to do so (see the code below). I would recommend filing a complaint against the officer so that the department can get him squared away!

    I also would guess that he is just making up the part about the "hit on your license," because when they run your license they already know that you have a permit.

    File a complaint and let us know how it goes. Here is the code that applies:

    § 18.2-308.H
    The person issued the permit shall have such permit on his person at all times during which he is carrying a concealed handgun and shall display the permit and a photo-identification issued by a government agency of the Commonwealth or by the United States Department of Defense or United States State Department (passport) upon demand by a law-enforcement officer.
    It can't get much clearer than that!

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    PackininVB wrote:
    When he returns he gives me te ticket to sign and what not and THEN says i saw when you opened your wallet that you had a gun permit (first off i didnt open my wallet, my IDs are in a carrying thing that i keep in my front pocket), then he asked are you carrying. I tell him no, im not.
    Thank GOD you weren't open carrying!



    PackininVB wrote:
    So today im goin down 264 and goin a lil fast and i get pulled over. The cop, wo wasnt very nice to begin with, takes my license and registaration back to his car to write my ticket.
    So, how fast were you going?






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    So im not as nuts as i thought i was... what the hell is going on? why do cops seem to need to spout off laws that they dont know without even making a call and asking if they are correct??

    This kind of stuff really pisses me off. I didnt even have my gun on me and i got **** for it!

    By this guys logic i would have to say when i got pulled over "Hey, i have a permit, but i dont have a gun on me..."



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    Oh and i was just goin a lil over :?:?

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    Founder's Club Member Hawkflyer's Avatar
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    Informing the LEO is a suggested courtesy not the law. The Virginia State Police have a very nice pamphlet covering Firearms laws in virginia -

    See Here

    If it was the law, it would be in here, and it is not. You might want to consider having a few of these in your glove box. You can get them free at any VSP barracks.

    Regards
    "Research has shown that a 230 grain lead pellet placed just behind the ear at 850 FPS results in a permanent cure for violent criminal behavior."
    "If you are not getting Flak, you are not over the target"
    "186,000 Miles per second! ... Not just a good idea ... It's the law!"

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    I have a VA permit, and a VA divers license. The only way he know that i have a permit is when he checked my license in his car. He said he saw me open my wallet, but i never did cause my IDs were in my front pocket...

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    So, Have you filed a complaint, called the officers seargent, or found the internal affairs form on their web-site?

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    Wooley wrote:
    VB, since you're in VB there is a possibility that you are Navy and have an out of state permit? Not saying he was right, but does anyone know if youhave to inform in VA if you're carrying with say, a Florida permit?
    There is no duty to preemptively inform no matter what type of permit you have. And you are only required to carry your permit if you are carrying a concealed handgun.

    Take another look at the law, it's pretty simple: If you are carrying concealed, you must have the permit on your person, and you must display the permit upon demand by the officer.

    § 18.2-308.H
    The person issued the permit shall have such permit on his person at all times during which he is carrying a concealed handgun and shall display the permit and a photo-identification issued by a government agency of the Commonwealth or by the United States Department of Defense or United States State Department (passport) upon demand by a law-enforcement officer.
    I agree with SicSemperTyrannis, the officer needs some edumacating through a complaint.

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    You are not required to tell LEO you have a concealed weapon.

    Same goes for those who are concealing and have no permit. If it is discovered that you have a permit or your found to becarrying a concealed weapon... you need to show your permit.

    He cannot put ANYTHING on your license either. This was an empty threat in an attempt to get you to report yourself next time.

    Where did you get stopped? What is the officer's name?

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    LEO 229 wrote:
    Where did you get stopped? What is the officer's name?
    Yes, do tell. The officer obviously overlooked the customary serial-number check. LEO229 will want to make sure he doesn't overlook it again. :P
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Citizen wrote:
    Yes, do tell. The officer obviously overlooked the customary serial-number check. LEO229 will want to make sure he doesn't overlook it again. :P
    PackinginVB wasn't carrying, so it would be hard to so a SN check even for a rogue officer!


    Citizen, did LEO229 give you a speeding ticket or something?!?

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    Citizen wrote:
    LEO 229 wrote:
    Where did you get stopped? What is the officer's name?
    Yes, do tell. The officer obviously overlooked the customary serial-number check. LEO229 will want to make sure he doesn't overlook it again. :P
    Well, I heard others run SN of guns in private residences without probable cause.... why not on a traffic stop too..

    One of these days... I will stop citizen and search him from head to toe... :shock:

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    TEX1N wrote:
    Citizen, did LEO229 give you a speeding ticket or something?!?
    Oh, lord. Don't even ask.

    Edit: Too late.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  15. #15
    Regular Member zoom6zoom's Avatar
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    why do cops seem to need to spout off laws that they dont know without even making a call and asking if they are correct??
    Maybe he's planning on applying for a position with the Manassas PD.

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    I was pulled on 264 goin towards the beach by witchduck. The officers name is TPR M.S. Walden. By his logic he was saying that even if i wasnt carrying i still needed to inform the cop that i had a permit and that i wasnt carrying.

    Maybe if i wrote a complaint then i could show that this trooper is slightly incompetent and tell them "Yeah i bet he said i was speeding too!" lol

    Anyone have a link to what i would need to do to file a complaint?

    At least this time it wasnt me who screwed up, (cept for goin too fast of course)

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    PackininVB wrote:
    I was pulled on 264 goin towards the beach by witchduck. The officers name is TPR M.S. Walden. By his logic he was saying that even if i wasnt carrying i still needed to inform the cop that i had a permit and that i wasnt carrying.

    Maybe if i wrote a complaint then i could show that this trooper is slightly incompetent and tell them "Yeah i bet he said i was speeding too!" lol

    Anyone have a link to what i would need to do to file a complaint?

    At least this time it wasnt me who screwed up, (cept for goin too fast of course)
    Just as a tip, if I were you I would think of what he did as a kind of threat. He basically told you that he had flagged your records in such a way that other LEOs who be alerted to treat you in a special way in the future, This would be a violation of your right to "Equal Protection" under the law. Sure if there was an attitude issue report that, but you need to focus on how this guy violated your rights, and how that threat caused you distress and was intimidating. This is especially true since there in NO requirement that you do what this LEO told you must be done.

    If you go off on a lot of tangents in your complaint they will ignore you.

    If you go the the VSP website you can find the information required to file a complaint.

    Before you do that and while the incident is fresh in your mind, but before you tell the story so many times than it gets embellished, write down the facts of what occurred. This will help you prepare your complaint. Time date, loction and other specific details are critical.

    Regards
    "Research has shown that a 230 grain lead pellet placed just behind the ear at 850 FPS results in a permanent cure for violent criminal behavior."
    "If you are not getting Flak, you are not over the target"
    "186,000 Miles per second! ... Not just a good idea ... It's the law!"

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    Regular Member ChinChin's Avatar
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    PackininVB wrote
    When he returns he gives me te ticket to sign and what not and THEN says i saw when you opened your wallet that you had a gun permit (first off i didnt open my wallet, my IDs are in a carrying thing that i keep in my front pocket), then he asked are you carrying. I tell him no, im not.

    He then says "Well you know that its that law that if pulled over you have to tell the officer that you have a permit and whether or not you are carrying"

    I told him, no, ive always heard the opposite. He then said "Well i put a hit on your license so if you dont inform law enforcement when you get pulled over again then you will lose your permit"

    Mrs. ChinChin was recently pulled over by one of Manassas' offiers, who attempted to tell her the same thing after being pulled over for a expired tag. Looking at her ticket I half-expected to see the name "Codfelter" but it actualy had a name not connected to the Tony's 7 affair.

    I made sure Mrs. ChinChin was re-schooled on VA laws and then called Manassas PD to make sure they instructed their officers not to lie to citizens. I was half tempted to invoke VCDL and inquire if they desired another appearance at the next town council meeting, but thought better as A) I don't have a fracton of that clout, and B) Mrs. ChinChin now sees my point in never engaging an LEO of Manassas in conversastion of any kind as 9 out of 10 times they're on a fishing trip.

    Not a badge-basher, but those people in Manassas need some serious retraining.
    The problem with the internet is nobody can really tell when youre serious and when youre being sarcastic. Abraham Lincoln

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    ChinChin wrote:
    ...SNIP
    Not a badge-basher, but those people in Manassas need some serious retraining.
    As a professional LE trainer I can assure you that you are mistaken. Before they can be "RETRAINED", they must be trained in the first place. It is clear that this critical first step has been omitted.

    Regards
    "Research has shown that a 230 grain lead pellet placed just behind the ear at 850 FPS results in a permanent cure for violent criminal behavior."
    "If you are not getting Flak, you are not over the target"
    "186,000 Miles per second! ... Not just a good idea ... It's the law!"

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    PackininVB wrote:
    I was pulled on 264 goin towards the beach by witchduck. The officers name is TPR M.S. Walden. By his logic he was saying that even if i wasnt carrying i still needed to inform the cop that i had a permit and that i wasnt carrying.

    Maybe if i wrote a complaint then i could show that this trooper is slightly incompetent and tell them "Yeah i bet he said i was speeding too!" lol

    Anyone have a link to what i would need to do to file a complaint?
    That is near where Reverend43 got stopped 3 months ago and got hassled:

    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/view_to...ight=low+ready

    Reverend43 said he was going to file a complaint. He can probably help you out on the details on filing and what the response was.

    Hey, maybe it was the same trooper...if it was, could be a pattern.

  21. #21
    Founder's Club Member Hawkflyer's Avatar
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    If you have a Virginia permit he probably does. If you have an out of state permit, most likely not. Unless there is formal reciprocity between two states they do not trade the information necessary to add it to your records here.

    Regards
    "Research has shown that a 230 grain lead pellet placed just behind the ear at 850 FPS results in a permanent cure for violent criminal behavior."
    "If you are not getting Flak, you are not over the target"
    "186,000 Miles per second! ... Not just a good idea ... It's the law!"

  22. #22
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    I remember all the fact, it was pretty cut adn dry, he just gave me my ticket and told me that crap. ill check out the VSP website and see what i can do. Thanks for your support guys.

  23. #23
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    Citizen wrote:
    LEO 229 wrote:
    Where did you get stopped? What is the officer's name?
    Yes, do tell. The officer obviously overlooked the customary serial-number check. LEO229 will want to make sure he doesn't overlook it again. :P
    AAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

    But...

    He didn't have his gun with him. If he had, THEN the serial would have been run, and his pistol would be returned to him disassembled. The cop would also empty his magazine before handing it back to him and instruct him not to put it back together "until I'm out of sight".

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    nakedshoplifter wrote:
    Citizen wrote:
    LEO 229 wrote:
    Where did you get stopped? What is the officer's name?
    Yes, do tell. The officer obviously overlooked the customary serial-number check. LEO229 will want to make sure he doesn't overlook it again. :P
    AAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

    But...

    He didn't have his gun with him. If he had, THEN the serial would have been run, and his pistol would be returned to him disassembled. The cop would also empty his magazine before handing it back to him and instruct him not to put it back together "until I'm out of sight".
    I would not reach for my pistol while being detained for a ticket. This was mentioned by a gentlemen at the last manassas meeting. He was stopped and asked to remove his pistol from his holster. I can not remember if he did? However, I think it is wrong, and I think you are just asking for more trouble or maybeshot if you comply. If they arrest me for something, then they can have my gun and they can take it themselves. As a side bar, if they were to ever do this to my wife, I assure you the sh*t would hit the fan like you have never seen before. As for Manassas -- They will only see me at the city meetings. I have no reason to be in their town until they get educated.

    Maybe Hawkflyer needs to moonlight over there and straighten them out.:P

    DC

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    I would contact VSP and complain that you were harassed based on the fact you have a CHP. There is no need to report you have a permit and your not armed. This is the dumbest thing I have ever heard. You do not even have to tell me your armed!!

    He ran your license and discovered you had a permit. He then startedquestioning you only to find out you did not have a gun today. He took it personal that you did not tell him so he decided to "put a hit" on your license.

    What a load of crap!! That was unprofessional and what he said was not even true. This tactic needs to be stopped immediately.



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