Page 1 of 5 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 125

Thread: OPEN CARRY IN MICHIGAN

  1. #1
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    St. Louis, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    43

    Post imported post

    Does anyone know where i can find in the law that open carry is legal in Michigan. ive been asked to show the law by a friend and im not sure where to start.

    thanks

  2. #2
    State Researcher dng's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    , , USA
    Posts
    1,290

    Post imported post

    Google "michigan gun laws" Or hopefully this link will tell you what you need to know:

    http://www.legislature.mi.gov/docume...s/Firearms.pdf

  3. #3
    Founder's Club Member OC-Glock19's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Woodbridge, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    561

    Post imported post

    glock36 wrote:
    Does anyone know where i can find in the law that open carry is legal in Michigan. ive been asked to show the law by a friend and im not sure where to start.

    thanks
    As has been pointed out elsewhere on this board, there are no laws allowing any behavior, only laws prohibiting that behavior. For instance, there is no law that says you can wear a red shirt on Fridays because unless prohibited by statute you can do what you want.

    If you are stopped by anyone who says that open carry is illegal in Michigan ask for the statute that prohibits it. (Hint: they won't find it, unless of course you're carrying openly in your vehicle and you don't have a permit to carry concealed.)

  4. #4
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    St. Louis, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    43

    Post imported post

    yeah theres nothing in the link about OC just CCW. I didnt think there would be anything on the books.

    What would calling the AG and asking provide, if anything?

  5. #5
    State Researcher dng's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    , , USA
    Posts
    1,290

    Post imported post

    OC-Glock19 is right. Kinda the: don't ask; don't tell policy. It is not prohibited, so you are free to do it.

  6. #6
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    St. Louis, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    43

    Post imported post

    I like that policy

  7. #7
    Moderator / Administrator
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Fairfax County, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    8,711

    Post imported post

    glock36 wrote:
    Does anyone know where i can find in the law that open carry is legal in Michigan. ive been asked to show the law by a friend and im not sure where to start.

    thanks
    Ask the freind to show YOU the law than bans open carry in Michigan.

  8. #8
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    St. Louis, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    43

    Post imported post

    see now i would take that as saying as long as its a pistol you can transport it without a permit inside your vehicle.

    but this seems to contradict that:

    750.227 Concealed weapons; carrying; penalty.
    Sec. 227. (1) A person shall not carry a dagger, dirk, stiletto, a double-edged nonfolding stabbing instrument of any
    length, or any other dangerous weapon, except a hunting knife adapted and carried as such, concealed on or about his or her
    person, or whether concealed or otherwise in any vehicle operated or occupied by the person, except in his or her dwelling
    house, place of business or on other land possessed by the person.
    (2) A person shall not carry a pistol concealed on or about his or her person, or, whether concealed or otherwise, in a
    vehicle operated or occupied by the person, except in his or her dwelling house, place of business, or on other land possessed
    by the person, without a license to carry the pistol as provided by law and if licensed, shall not carry the pistol in a place or
    manner inconsistent with any restrictions upon such license.

    (3) A person who violates this section is guilty of a felony, punishable by imprisonment for not more than 5 years, or by a
    fine of not more than $2,500.00.

    Confusing

  9. #9
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    St. Louis, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    43

    Post imported post

    Yeah but " on or about" sound like on or anywhere near the person to me.

  10. #10
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Burton, Michigan
    Posts
    3,361

    Post imported post

    glock36 wrote:
    Yeah but " on or about" sound like on or anywhere near the person to me.
    Date updated: Jul 28, 2005 @ 8:54 pm

    From the Michigan State Police Web Site.

    7. If I do not have a CCW permit, may I transport my pistol in a motor vehicle?

    Answer A person is now permitted to transport a pistol for a lawful purpose if the owner or occupant of the vehicle is the registered owner of the firearm and the pistol is unloaded and in a closed case in the trunk of the vehicle. If the vehicle does not have a trunk, the pistol may be in the passenger compartment of the vehicle unloaded and inaccessible to the occupants of the vehicle.

    The law defines ‘lawful purpose’ as:

    • While en route to or from a hunting or target shooting area.
    • While transporting a pistol to or from home or place of business and a place of repair.
    • While moving goods from one place of residence or business to another place of residence or business.
    • While transporting a licensed pistol to or from a law enforcement agency for the purpose of having a safety inspection performed (registering the pistol) or to have a law enforcement official take possession of the pistol.
    • While en route to or from home or place of business to a gun show or place of purchase or sale.
    • While en route to or from home to a public shooting facility or land where the discharge of firearms is permitted.
    • While en route to or from home to private property where the pistol is to be used as permitted by law, rule, regulation, or local ordinance.
    Federal Law on the Transportation of Firearms. Title 18 U.S.C. Section 926A

  11. #11
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Burton, Michigan
    Posts
    3,361

    Post imported post

    glock36 wrote:
    Does anyone know where i can find in the law that open carry is legal in Michigan. ive been asked to show the law by a friend and im not sure where to start.

    thanks
    From MCRGO.org



    You were quoted as saying 'open-carry' was still legal in Michigan. I am in possession of a CPL, now but I cannot find any reference to open-carry in my copy of the Michigan Firearms Laws. Please clarify. What is open-carry? When does it apply as compared to my CPL?

    A:

    In the 19th century, Michigan outlawed the carry of concealed weapons. The rational was that a person could use a concealed pistol in a fight and surprise his or her opponent. That is, a person had a right to know if the other person was armed before getting in a dispute. Michigan has forbidden the carrying of a pistol without a license in a motor vehicle, whether concealed or not, for much the same reason. Poachers who would hunt from cars may very well be the reason that we can only carry our long guns cased or in the truck of an automobile (MCL 324.43513). There are other laws that forbid the carrying of pistols with an unlawful intent (MCL 750.226), and the brandishing of a firearm (MCL 750.234e). Since there are no laws that forbid it, the open carrying of a pistol or other firearm, without unlawful intent and without brandishing, outside of a vehicle is legal.


    Also see:


    AG Opinions: 3158, 7101 & 7113


  12. #12
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    St. Louis, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    43

    Post imported post

    thanks for the help guys.

  13. #13
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    15

    Post imported post

    I was just about to post on this same topic, but instead of starting a new topic, and with no intent of thread jacking, i will ask a bit in more detail the same question.





    I have no CPL at all and can not apply for one until next year. The joys of being dumb and young. anyhow my question is the same esential question



    If i have no CPL or any similar license, I can carry open anywhere I want with the exception of the "gun free" zones. I can openly carry on my property or conceal on my property if wanting to, however if I choose to walk off of my property, i must then openly carry, even if tyhat means simply tucking in my shirt???

  14. #14
    Founder's Club Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Henderson, Nevada, USA
    Posts
    333

    Post imported post

    As was already mentioned, anything not prohibited is allowed. There are no laws *making* something legal, other than in the case where a law modifies another law, such as the case with concealed carry permit laws that override the blanket prohibitions against concealed carry.

    That being the case, the firearm laws for Michigan are covered by:

    The State Constitution

    § 6 Bearing of arms.
    Sec. 6.
    Every person has a right to keep and bear arms for the defense of himself and the state.

    History: Const. 1963, Art. I, § 6, Eff. Jan. 1, 1964

    State law sections 28.421 - 28.435 which you can search/read at: http://www.legislature.mi.gov/

  15. #15
    Founder's Club Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Henderson, Nevada, USA
    Posts
    333

    Post imported post

    This is from the Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners

    http://www.mcrgo.org/mcrgo/d_ccwfaq.asp

    Q: You were quoted as saying 'open-carry' was still legal in Michigan. I am in possession of a CPL, now but I cannot find any reference to open-carry in my copy of the Michigan Firearms Laws. Please clarify. What is open-carry? When does it apply as compared to my CPL? A: In the 19th century, Michigan outlawed the carry of concealed weapons. The rational was that a person could use a concealed pistol in a fight and surprise his or her opponent. That is, a person had a right to know if the other person was armed before getting in a dispute. Michigan has forbidden the carrying of a pistol without a license in a motor vehicle, whether concealed or not, for much the same reason. Poachers who would hunt from cars may very well be the reason that we can only carry our long guns cased or in the truck of an automobile (MCL 324.43513). There are other laws that forbid the carrying of pistols with an unlawful intent (MCL 750.226), and the brandishing of a firearm (MCL 750.234e). Since there are no laws that forbid it, the open carrying of a pistol or other firearm, without unlawful intent and without brandishing, outside of a vehicle is legal.


  16. #16
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    15

    Post imported post

    so then what would be something good to print and have handy for those oh so nice encounters with LEO's????

  17. #17
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Michigan, USA
    Posts
    902

    Post imported post

    Here is the law dealing with open carry



    750.234d Possession of firearm on certain premises prohibited; applicability; violation as misdemeanor; penalty. Sec. 234d.
    (1) Except as provided in subsection (2), a person shall not possess a firearm on the premises of any of the following:
    (a) A depository financial institution or a subsidiary or affiliate of a depository financial institution.
    (b) A church or other house of religious worship.
    (c) A court.
    (d) A theatre.
    (e) A sports arena.
    (f) A day care center.
    (g) A hospital.
    (h) An establishment licensed under the Michigan liquor control act, Act No. 8 of the Public Acts of the Extra Session of 1933, being sections 436.1 to 436.58 of the Michigan Compiled Laws.
    (2) This section does not apply to any of the following:
    (a) A person who owns, or is employed by or contracted by, an entity described in subsection (1) if the possession of that firearm is to provide security services for that entity.
    (b) A peace officer.
    (c) A person licensed by this state or another state to carry a concealed weapon.
    ------------------------------------------------------------------


    There it is, this has been discussed before, Lonnie and I do not know how much clearer this can get. The above section of law does NOT deal with CPL's. It deals with open carry. If you have a permit from ANY state (does not have to be home-state like it does with CCW) you can open carry anywhere.

    Open carry is legal without a permit, UNLESS you carry into any of the places listed above. The places listed above are off-limits UNLESS you have a license to carry a concealed weapon from ANY state.

    The law isn't even silent on the matter as it is in Virginia, in Michigan it actually says so in black and white.

    I don't care what some sheriff's or some PD's think. This isn't Mexico, you do not make up laws as you go along. If people are serious about OC'ing and think they will get in trouble then sent a polite letter to the city attorney and police chief explaining that what you are doing is legal and you expect nothing more then being asked to show any states CCW permit if you are open carrying into an otherwise prohibited place.

    If you want to open carry, go for it. If you want to CCW then if you still want to carry into pistol free zones (assuming you are not exempt) then simply uncover your pistol and enter these places.

    Saying it can't be done is hogwash. Look at the resistance Pacific Northwest Open Carry got with Portland and Seattle as well as other cities, many of them turned around when the proper steps were taken. There is no reason people in Michigan can not do the same, you can not be penalized when you break no law, it's actually that simple.


    Keep in mind, vehicle carry is dealt with under 750.227 Concealed weapons; carrying; penalty.
    Sec. 227

  18. #18
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    15

    Post imported post

    thank you very much for the info. I feel much more informed now...... I have been for awhile now looking for t"the law that says so" and really as everyone is stating. there are only laws preventing things.



    you guys are awesome.



    i will start my own threads from now on...

  19. #19
    State Researcher HankT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Invisible Mode
    Posts
    6,217

    Post imported post

    nextlevelcell wrote:
    I have no CPL at all and can not apply for one until next year. The joys of being dumb and young. anyhow my question is the same esential question



    If i have no CPL or any similar license, I can carry open anywhere I want with the exception of the "gun free" zones. I can openly carry on my property or conceal on my property if wanting to, however if I choose to walk off of my property, i must then openly carry, even if tyhat means simply tucking in my shirt???
    So, you are prohibited from getting a concealed pistol license but you can open carry legally? Other than on your property, I mean.

    How is that?

  20. #20
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Grand Rapids, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    1,416

    Post imported post

    HankT wrote:
    nextlevelcell wrote:
    I have no CPL at all and can not apply for one until next year. The joys of being dumb and young. anyhow my question is the same esential question



    If i have no CPL or any similar license, I can carry open anywhere I want with the exception of the "gun free" zones. I can openly carry on my property or conceal on my property if wanting to, however if I choose to walk off of my property, i must then openly carry, even if tyhat means simply tucking in my shirt???
    So, you are prohibited from getting a concealed pistol license but you can open carry legally? Other than on your property, I mean.

    How is that?
    I believe it's been covered in this thread already, but I think it's because OC is legal in the state of Michigan. One does not need a CPL for it. I could be wrong, but that's what I've gathered from this board.

  21. #21
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    1,169

    Post imported post

    Actually this section does not "deal with" OC. It "deals with" possession. It doesn't matter whether the firearm is concealed or not. There is really no structural difference in the law between OC and CC.

    Open Carry is permitted everywhere except where prohibited by statute but further subject to exceptions to this prohibition.

    Concealed Carry is permitted everywhere except where prohibited by statute but further subject to exceptions to this prohibition.

    In both case OC/CC is permitted:

    Michigan - prohibitions + exceptions to prohibitions = legal carry space. Now the details differ between the two but the starting point and process are the same.



    Jared wrote:
    Here is the law dealing with open carry



    750.234d Possession of firearm on certain premises prohibited; applicability; violation as misdemeanor; penalty. Sec. 234d.
    (1) Except as provided in subsection (2), a person shall not possess a firearm on the premises of any of the following:
    (a) A depository financial institution or a subsidiary or affiliate of a depository financial institution.
    (b) A church or other house of religious worship.
    (c) A court.
    (d) A theatre.
    (e) A sports arena.
    (f) A day care center.
    (g) A hospital.
    (h) An establishment licensed under the Michigan liquor control act, Act No. 8 of the Public Acts of the Extra Session of 1933, being sections 436.1 to 436.58 of the Michigan Compiled Laws.
    (2) This section does not apply to any of the following:
    (a) A person who owns, or is employed by or contracted by, an entity described in subsection (1) if the possession of that firearm is to provide security services for that entity.
    (b) A peace officer.
    (c) A person licensed by this state or another state to carry a concealed weapon.
    ------------------------------------------------------------------


    There it is, this has been discussed before, Lonnie and I do not know how much clearer this can get. The above section of law does NOT deal with CPL's. It deals with open carry. If you have a permit from ANY state (does not have to be home-state like it does with CCW) you can open carry anywhere.

    Open carry is legal without a permit, UNLESS you carry into any of the places listed above. The places listed above are off-limits UNLESS you have a license to carry a concealed weapon from ANY state.

    The law isn't even silent on the matter as it is in Virginia, in Michigan it actually says so in black and white.

    I don't care what some sheriff's or some PD's think. This isn't Mexico, you do not make up laws as you go along. If people are serious about OC'ing and think they will get in trouble then sent a polite letter to the city attorney and police chief explaining that what you are doing is legal and you expect nothing more then being asked to show any states CCW permit if you are open carrying into an otherwise prohibited place.

    If you want to open carry, go for it. If you want to CCW then if you still want to carry into pistol free zones (assuming you are not exempt) then simply uncover your pistol and enter these places.

    Saying it can't be done is hogwash. Look at the resistance Pacific Northwest Open Carry got with Portland and Seattle as well as other cities, many of them turned around when the proper steps were taken. There is no reason people in Michigan can not do the same, you can not be penalized when you break no law, it's actually that simple.


    Keep in mind, vehicle carry is dealt with under 750.227 Concealed weapons; carrying; penalty.
    Sec. 227

  22. #22
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Livingston Co., Michigan, , USA
    Posts
    275

    Post imported post

    "And you can also show them this one, which specifically allows transportation of loaded pistols in vehicles:

    750.227c Transporting or possessing loaded firearm in or upon vehicle; violation as misdemeanor; penalty; applicability to person violating § 312.10(1)(g).



    Sec. 227c.

    (1) Except as otherwise permitted by law, a person shall not transport or possess in or upon a sailboat or a motor vehicle, aircraft, motorboat, or any other vehicle propelled by mechanical means, a firearm, other than a pistol, which is loaded."

    .

    glock36 wrote:
    see now i would take that as saying as long as its a pistol you can transport it without a permit inside your vehicle.

    but this seems to contradict that:

    750.227 Concealed weapons; carrying; penalty.
    Sec. 227. (1) A person shall not carry a dagger, dirk, stiletto, a double-edged nonfolding stabbing instrument of any
    length, or any other dangerous weapon, except a hunting knife adapted and carried as such, concealed on or about his or her
    person, or whether concealed or otherwise in any vehicle operated or occupied by the person, except in his or her dwelling
    house, place of business or on other land possessed by the person.
    (2) A person shall not carry a pistol concealed on or about his or her person, or, whether concealed or otherwise, in a
    vehicle operated or occupied by the person, except in his or her dwelling house, place of business, or on other land possessed
    by the person, without a license to carry the pistol as provided by law and if licensed, shall not carry the pistol in a place or
    manner inconsistent with any restrictions upon such license.

    (3) A person who violates this section is guilty of a felony, punishable by imprisonment for not more than 5 years, or by a
    fine of not more than $2,500.00.

    Confusing

    This says you CAN'T carry a loaded firearm in a vehicle. It also points out the exception of a loaded pistol WITH a CPL. If you don't have a CPL, you CAN'T have a loaded pistol either.

    At NO time for any reason, with or without any kind of a permit,you can"t have a loaded rifle or shotgun in (or on) a vehicle.




  23. #23
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Michigan, USA
    Posts
    902

    Post imported post

    apjonas wrote:
    Actually this section does not "deal with" OC. It "deals with" possession. It doesn't matter whether the firearm is concealed or not. There is really no structural difference in the law between OC and CC.

    Open Carry is permitted everywhere except where prohibited by statute but further subject to exceptions to this prohibition.

    Concealed Carry is permitted everywhere except where prohibited by statute but further subject to exceptions to this prohibition.

    In both case OC/CC is permitted:

    Michigan - prohibitions + exceptions to prohibitions = legal carry space. Now the details differ between the two but the starting point and process are the same.



    You need to read the law. The restrictions dealing with concealed pistols only apply to.... concealed pistols; therefore, these are the only restrictions that apply to open carry (unless you have a permit) and these would never apply to CCW anyway because if you have a CPL then this law does not apply to you as you would only have to worry about the CPL law.

    If I'm not making any sense, please tell me so I can somehow further clarify this.

  24. #24
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Wakefield, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    1

    Post imported post

    SpringerXDacp wrote:
    glock36 wrote:
    Does anyone know where i can find in the law that open carry is legal in Michigan. ive been asked to show the law by a friend and im not sure where to start.

    thanks
    From MCRGO.org




    You were quoted as saying 'open-carry' was still legal in Michigan. I am in possession of a CPL, now but I cannot find any reference to open-carry in my copy of the Michigan Firearms Laws. Please clarify. What is open-carry? When does it apply as compared to my CPL?

    A:

    In the 19th century, Michigan outlawed the carry of concealed weapons. The rational was that a person could use a concealed pistol in a fight and surprise his or her opponent. That is, a person had a right to know if the other person was armed before getting in a dispute. Michigan has forbidden the carrying of a pistol without a license in a motor vehicle, whether concealed or not, for much the same reason. Poachers who would hunt from cars may very well be the reason that we can only carry our long guns cased or in the truck of an automobile (MCL 324.43513). There are other laws that forbid the carrying of pistols with an unlawful intent (MCL 750.226), and the brandishing of a firearm (MCL 750.234e). Since there are no laws that forbid it, the open carrying of a pistol or other firearm, without unlawful intent and without brandishing, outside of a vehicle is legal.



    Also see:



    AG Opinions: 3158, 7101 & 7113
    This is correct, except it depends on how much of a ***** the judge is for brandishing, which is defined as "diplaying or waving menacingly". Some activist types would consider this to be the case any time it is outside of a holster or case.

  25. #25
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Livingston Co., Michigan, , USA
    Posts
    275

    Post imported post

    SGT_Bill wrote:
    SpringerXDacp wrote:
    glock36 wrote:
    Does anyone know where i can find in the law that open carry is legal in Michigan. ive been asked to show the law by a friend and im not sure where to start.

    thanks
    From MCRGO.org





    You were quoted as saying 'open-carry' was still legal in Michigan. I am in possession of a CPL, now but I cannot find any reference to open-carry in my copy of the Michigan Firearms Laws. Please clarify. What is open-carry? When does it apply as compared to my CPL?

    A:

    In the 19th century, Michigan outlawed the carry of concealed weapons. The rational was that a person could use a concealed pistol in a fight and surprise his or her opponent. That is, a person had a right to know if the other person was armed before getting in a dispute. Michigan has forbidden the carrying of a pistol without a license in a motor vehicle, whether concealed or not, for much the same reason. Poachers who would hunt from cars may very well be the reason that we can only carry our long guns cased or in the truck of an automobile (MCL 324.43513). There are other laws that forbid the carrying of pistols with an unlawful intent (MCL 750.226), and the brandishing of a firearm (MCL 750.234e). Since there are no laws that forbid it, the open carrying of a pistol or other firearm, without unlawful intent and without brandishing, outside of a vehicle is legal.




    Also see:




    AG Opinions: 3158, 7101 & 7113
    This is correct, except it depends on how much of a ***** the judge is for brandishing, which is defined as "diplaying or waving menacingly". Some activist types would consider this to be the case any time it is outside of a holster or case.
    Yah SGT......
    This is what is being threatened but I haven't been able to find an example of it actually happening. It seems that Cities are more worried about being sued for arresting someone for doing NOTHING wrong then trying to scare people into giving up their rights.

Page 1 of 5 123 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •