Road Rage... Bad News!

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Joshmmm, that's a good writeup. Thanks for that.

I don't think it's reasonable to assume that you must be an absolute angel before you can defend yourself. If that were the case, may as well forget it.

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Yeah, nice to know the law recognizes people can sometimes say impolite things.

For me, I'd like to avoid a lethal force confrontation, so I'll keep working on being a perfect angel.

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joshmmm wrote:

  Honking is an everyday occurrence that we are all accustomed to. 

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She was warning motorists that a vehicular traffic hazard existed, mainly, his effort to cut her off caused her to apply the brakes rapidly, honking informed those behind her and around her that evasive manuevers may be required to avoid an accident, due to the reckless driving of the motorist directly in front of her...

:celebrate:

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apjonas wrote:

What's the guy's name? I can't find a newspaper account or local TV report of the incident.

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Good question.

Makes you wonder doesn't it.

Is there a little fishing from a moving boat going on here?

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tarzan1888 wrote:

apjonas wrote:

What's the guy's name? I can't find a newspaper account or local TV report of the incident.

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Good question.

Makes you wonder doesn't it.

Is there a little fishing from a moving boat going on here?

Click to expand...

Do you really think the newspapers in this town report every crime that happens? If you want to dig this up, you are going to have to go to the king county district court and look it up; you will seldomly find such an un-interesting (to most readers) story in the newspaper. Nobody was shot, nobody killed, not gang related, no police over-reaction, no crying child missing his mother, etc. It will NOT be reported on. We, as 2A advocates, can be thankful that cases like this don't hit the mainstream.

Did it happen? I have no idea, but the lack of it being reported on in a newspaper means nothing.

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I'm not from the Seattle area so I don't know what is typical. Just about everywhere I've lived an incident of "road rage" and/or display of a firearm would make the paper (at least of the local area). Most papers jump at the chance to show how "unsafe" it is to allow ordinary citizens to carry handguns. In any event, the OP could give provide the guy's name since it would make the records easier to find. Or his friend's name - it ain't secret anymore. Heck, since he knows the guy was arrested just the name of the PD involved would be a help. Maybe Tarzan1888 has a point. This story is long on drama, short on verifiable facts.

joshmmm wrote:

tarzan1888 wrote:

apjonas wrote:

What's the guy's name? I can't find a newspaper account or local TV report of the incident.

Click to expand...

Good question.

Makes you wonder doesn't it.

Is there a little fishing from a moving boat going on here?

Click to expand...

Do you really think the newspapers in this town report every crime that happens? If you want to dig this up, you are going to have to go to the king county district court and look it up; you will seldomly find such an un-interesting (to most readers) story in the newspaper. Nobody was shot, nobody killed, not gang related, no police over-reaction, no crying child missing his mother, etc. It will NOT be reported on. We, as 2A advocates, can be thankful that cases like this don't hit the mainstream.

Did it happen? I have no idea, but the lack of it being reported on in a newspaper means nothing.

Click to expand...

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apjonas wrote:

I'm not from the Seattle area so I don't know what is typical. Just about everywhere I've lived an incident of "road rage" and/or display of a firearm would make the paper (at least of the local area). Most papers jump at the chance to show how "unsafe" it is to allow ordinary citizens to carry handguns. In any event, the OP could give provide the guy's name since it would make the records easier to find. Or his friend's name - it ain't secret anymore. Heck, since he knows the guy was arrested just the name of the PD involved would be a help. Maybe Tarzan1888 has a point. This story is long on drama, short on verifiable facts.

joshmmm wrote:

tarzan1888 wrote:

apjonas wrote:

What's the guy's name? I can't find a newspaper account or local TV report of the incident.

Click to expand...

Good question.

Makes you wonder doesn't it.

Is there a little fishing from a moving boat going on here?

Click to expand...

Do you really think the newspapers in this town report every crime that happens? If you want to dig this up, you are going to have to go to the king county district court and look it up; you will seldomly find such an un-interesting (to most readers) story in the newspaper. Nobody was shot, nobody killed, not gang related, no police over-reaction, no crying child missing his mother, etc. It will NOT be reported on. We, as 2A advocates, can be thankful that cases like this don't hit the mainstream.

Did it happen? I have no idea, but the lack of it being reported on in a newspaper means nothing.

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+1

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ConditionThree wrote:

May I suggest a turret mounted ma duece?

All kidding aside, I think this brandishing bozo really needed to try that with any other lawfully armed citizen. Im certain he wouldnt have gotten very far attempting to intimidate someone prepared to defend themselves.

Tell "Susie" to upcaliber her self defense weapon. A .25 will just make a fat man angry, unless you hit him in the eye.

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I may not be fat, but I was shot with a .25 and it nearly killed me (well technically it did, but the paramedics revived me). My friend and I were being irresponsible, and long story short, I caught a .25 in my chest. It went through my heart and dropped me. I am very lucky to be alive.

This says 1 of 2 things about .25acp*:

1) .25 acp was able to take me down, and therefore is not as weak of a round as it gets credit for.

<or>

2) I was hit in one of the only places that can guarantee fatal results, and lived to tell the tale, and therefore .25acp deserves it's bad rep as a weak round.

I haven't decided which statement I agree with.





*it also saysseveral things about irresponsible handling of firearms, needless to say I've taken a gun safety class since then, and I am now a big advocate of proper gun handling and safety. The four rules would have stopped this event from ever happening, if only I had known them. Perhaps teaching gun safety in school would have prevented a potential tragity, like the many others each year that have worse results. I say if the school can teach you how to use a condom, and not claim that it is advocating underage sex, than the school can teach you to use a handgun and not claim that it is advocatingviolence.

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expvideo wrote:

SNIP I say if the school can teach you how to use a condom, and not claim that it is advocating underage sex, than the school can teach you to use a handgun and not claim that it is advocatingviolence.

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Handy little argument, that one is.

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apjonas wrote:

I'm not from the Seattle area so I don't know what is typical. Just about everywhere I've lived an incident of "road rage" and/or display of a firearm would make the paper (at least of the local area). Most papers jump at the chance to show how "unsafe" it is to allow ordinary citizens to carry handguns. In any event, the OP could give provide the guy's name since it would make the records easier to find. Or his friend's name - it ain't secret anymore. Heck, since he knows the guy was arrested just the name of the PD involved would be a help. Maybe Tarzan1888 has a point. This story is long on drama, short on verifiable facts.

joshmmm wrote:

tarzan1888 wrote:

apjonas wrote:

What's the guy's name? I can't find a newspaper account or local TV report of the incident.

Click to expand...

Good question.

Makes you wonder doesn't it.

Is there a little fishing from a moving boat going on here?

Click to expand...

Do you really think the newspapers in this town report every crime that happens? If you want to dig this up, you are going to have to go to the king county district court and look it up; you will seldomly find such an un-interesting (to most readers) story in the newspaper. Nobody was shot, nobody killed, not gang related, no police over-reaction, no crying child missing his mother, etc. It will NOT be reported on. We, as 2A advocates, can be thankful that cases like this don't hit the mainstream.

Did it happen? I have no idea, but the lack of it being reported on in a newspaper means nothing.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

That makes it pretty obvious that you aren't from seattle. A lot of stuff happens out here that doesn't make the paper. In fact, since I used to work in nightclubs, I've seen a lot of stuff that didn't make the paper. Rarely does a shooting in a club parkinglot make the paper, or a gang fight, or just about anything else.

I used to joke with my friends that if 3 people didn't get killed and one of them wasn't a cop, it wasn't going to make the paper.

It's a big city. Sh!t happens. It rarely makes the news. If you don't believe me, you obviouslydon't live in Seattle. I'm sure your small town paper manages to get every little thing that happens outthere, but out here there's too much to put in the paper, and people don't want to read about violence all the time.

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expvideo wrote:

That makes it pretty obvious that you aren't from seattle.  A lot of stuff happens out here that doesn't make the paper.  In fact, since I used to work in nightclubs, I've seen a lot of stuff that didn't make the paper.  Rarely does a shooting in a club parkinglot make the paper, or a gang fight, or just about anything else. 

I used to joke with my friends that if 3 people didn't get killed and one of them wasn't a cop, it wasn't going to make the paper.

It's a big city.  Sh!t happens.  It rarely makes the news.  If you don't believe me, you obviously don't live in Seattle.  I'm sure your small town paper manages to get every little thing that happens out there, but out here there's too much to put in the paper, and people don't want to read about violence all the time.

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Evidently you don't read the newspapers or watch the television because this sort of thing has been getting lots of attention from the press, especially as it applies to the Belltown area clubs.

The reason it's getting attention is because the Seattle media is playing along with the fools at CeaseFire and the Mayor's office and the police chief to campaign for an erosion of state preemption laws in January in Olympia.

The argument will be that Seattle MUST have the authority to pass its own gun laws because of all the violence downtown.

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expvideo wrote:

That makes it pretty obvious that you aren't from seattle.

As opposed to this sentence?



[align=center]"I'm not from the Seattle area so I don't know what is typical."[/align]
Excellent analysis on your part.

A lot of stuff happens out here that doesn't make the paper.

That is true in many, if not most, metropolitan areas. I really don't think Seattle is peculiar in that regard.

In fact, since I used to work in nightclubs, I've seen a lot of stuff that didn't make the paper. Rarely does a shooting in a club parkinglot make the paper, or a gang fight, or just about anything else.

A fight, no. But I didn't know that shootings were so routine as not to merit a mention in your local rag. Memo to self: Do not move to Seattle.

I used to joke with my friends that if 3 people didn't get killed and one of them wasn't a cop, it wasn't going to make the paper.

That is a thigh slapper.

It's a big city. Sh!t happens. It rarely makes the news.

I already knew that Seattle is a big city. I'll take your word on the rest of it.

If you don't believe me, you obviouslydon't live in Seattle.

Umm, as I stated in my previous post and as you so cleverly deduced - I do not live in Seattle. Everybody got that?

I'm sure your small town paper manages to get every little thing that happens outthere,

I have lived in Baltimore, Chicago and Phoenix. Now, I split my time between Milwaukee and Atlanta. A couple of cow towns compared to Seattle I know but astory like this would be reported by the local paper even if the major metro dailies thought it of no significance. Even the suburban papers have police beat reporters.

but out here there's too much to put in the paper, and people don't want to read about violence all the time.

What with the horoscopes, salmon recipes, and new illegal alien sanctuary policies, I can see why SPI and its lesser cousins don't have time for such a mundane story. It's nice to see a newspaper that cares about its readers' sensibilities.

Of course, none of this explains why the OP is unwilling to provide information that he knows or can easily obtain. Pending such information, I am siding with Tarzan1888. This story is pure fiction.


expvideo wrote:

apjonas wrote:

I'm not from the Seattle area so I don't know what is typical. Just about everywhere I've lived an incident of "road rage" and/or display of a firearm would make the paper (at least of the local area). Most papers jump at the chance to show how "unsafe" it is to allow ordinary citizens to carry handguns. In any event, the OP could give provide the guy's name since it would make the records easier to find. Or his friend's name - it ain't secret anymore. Heck, since he knows the guy was arrested just the name of the PD involved would be a help. Maybe Tarzan1888 has a point. This story is long on drama, short on verifiable facts.

joshmmm wrote:

tarzan1888 wrote:

apjonas wrote:

What's the guy's name? I can't find a newspaper account or local TV report of the incident.

Click to expand...

Good question.

Makes you wonder doesn't it.

Is there a little fishing from a moving boat going on here?

Click to expand...

Do you really think the newspapers in this town report every crime that happens? If you want to dig this up, you are going to have to go to the king county district court and look it up; you will seldomly find such an un-interesting (to most readers) story in the newspaper. Nobody was shot, nobody killed, not gang related, no police over-reaction, no crying child missing his mother, etc. It will NOT be reported on. We, as 2A advocates, can be thankful that cases like this don't hit the mainstream.

Did it happen? I have no idea, but the lack of it being reported on in a newspaper means nothing.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

That makes it pretty obvious that you aren't from seattle. A lot of stuff happens out here that doesn't make the paper. In fact, since I used to work in nightclubs, I've seen a lot of stuff that didn't make the paper. Rarely does a shooting in a club parkinglot make the paper, or a gang fight, or just about anything else.

I used to joke with my friends that if 3 people didn't get killed and one of them wasn't a cop, it wasn't going to make the paper.

It's a big city. Sh!t happens. It rarely makes the news. If you don't believe me, you obviouslydon't live in Seattle. I'm sure your small town paper manages to get every little thing that happens outthere, but out here there's too much to put in the paper, and people don't want to read about violence all the time.

Click to expand...

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apjonas wrote:

expvideo wrote:

That makes it pretty obvious that you aren't from seattle.

As opposed to this sentence?




[align=center]"I'm not from the Seattle area so I don't know what is typical."[/align]
Excellent analysis on your part.

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Wow. I can feel the love in this thread.

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apjonas wrote:

expvideo wrote:

That makes it pretty obvious that you aren't from seattle.

As opposed to this sentence?




[align=center]"I'm not from the Seattle area so I don't know what is typical."[/align]
Excellent analysis on your part.

A lot of stuff happens out here that doesn't make the paper.

That is true in many, if not most, metropolitan areas. I really don't think Seattle is peculiar in that regard.

In fact, since I used to work in nightclubs, I've seen a lot of stuff that didn't make the paper. Rarely does a shooting in a club parkinglot make the paper, or a gang fight, or just about anything else.

A fight, no. But I didn't know that shootings were so routine as not to merit a mention in your local rag. Memo to self: Do not move to Seattle.

I used to joke with my friends that if 3 people didn't get killed and one of them wasn't a cop, it wasn't going to make the paper.

That is a thigh slapper.

It's a big city. Sh!t happens. It rarely makes the news.

I already knew that Seattle is a big city. I'll take your word on the rest of it.

If you don't believe me, you obviouslydon't live in Seattle.

Umm, as I stated in my previous post and as you so cleverly deduced - I do not live in Seattle. Everybody got that?

I'm sure your small town paper manages to get every little thing that happens outthere,

I have lived in Baltimore, Chicago and Phoenix. Now, I split my time between Milwaukee and Atlanta. A couple of cow towns compared to Seattle I know but astory like this would be reported by the local paper even if the major metro dailies thought it of no significance. Even the suburban papers have police beat reporters.

but out here there's too much to put in the paper, and people don't want to read about violence all the time.

What with the horoscopes, salmon recipes, and new illegal alien sanctuary policies, I can see why SPI and its lesser cousins don't have time for such a mundane story. It's nice to see a newspaper that cares about its readers' sensibilities.

Of course, none of this explains why the OP is unwilling to provide information that he knows or can easily obtain. Pending such information, I am siding with Tarzan1888. This story is pure fiction.


expvideo wrote:

apjonas wrote:

I'm not from the Seattle area so I don't know what is typical. Just about everywhere I've lived an incident of "road rage" and/or display of a firearm would make the paper (at least of the local area). Most papers jump at the chance to show how "unsafe" it is to allow ordinary citizens to carry handguns. In any event, the OP could give provide the guy's name since it would make the records easier to find. Or his friend's name - it ain't secret anymore. Heck, since he knows the guy was arrested just the name of the PD involved would be a help. Maybe Tarzan1888 has a point. This story is long on drama, short on verifiable facts.

joshmmm wrote:

tarzan1888 wrote:

apjonas wrote:

What's the guy's name? I can't find a newspaper account or local TV report of the incident.

Click to expand...

Good question.

Makes you wonder doesn't it.

Is there a little fishing from a moving boat going on here?

Click to expand...

Do you really think the newspapers in this town report every crime that happens? If you want to dig this up, you are going to have to go to the king county district court and look it up; you will seldomly find such an un-interesting (to most readers) story in the newspaper. Nobody was shot, nobody killed, not gang related, no police over-reaction, no crying child missing his mother, etc. It will NOT be reported on. We, as 2A advocates, can be thankful that cases like this don't hit the mainstream.

Did it happen? I have no idea, but the lack of it being reported on in a newspaper means nothing.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

That makes it pretty obvious that you aren't from seattle. A lot of stuff happens out here that doesn't make the paper. In fact, since I used to work in nightclubs, I've seen a lot of stuff that didn't make the paper. Rarely does a shooting in a club parkinglot make the paper, or a gang fight, or just about anything else.

I used to joke with my friends that if 3 people didn't get killed and one of them wasn't a cop, it wasn't going to make the paper.

It's a big city. Sh!t happens. It rarely makes the news. If you don't believe me, you obviouslydon't live in Seattle. I'm sure your small town paper manages to get every little thing that happens outthere, but out here there's too much to put in the paper, and people don't want to read about violence all the time.

Click to expand...

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Very well said. :uhoh:

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I've personally witnessed much worse things that never made the paper. A guy walked across the parking lot at the club and pointed a mac11 at a crowd of about 30 people and was threatening to shoot them. Never made the paper.

On a seperate occasion, a gun was pulled in a fight in the club parking lot and one of our bouncers shot a couple of times at the guy (not accurately apparently). Didn't make the paper (that incident I wasn't there for, but all of my co-workers were, so I'm pretty confident it happened).

I was walking around greenlake (crowded, rich neighborhood)with my now fiancee on our first date when somebody emptied a .45's magazine across the street (you could tell from the sound and it was close enough to make a distinction, that's why I say it was a .45). Never made the paper.

There's a lot more, but I think I'm making a good enough point. Seattle's not that dangerous if you stay in the safe parts. After dark in the gang-infested neighborhoods a lot of bad things can happen. I'm sure that's true of any city.

Nearly 2.5 millioncases of an individual being able to protect themselves with the presence of a firearm are reported every year. Few of those cases ever make the paper. I'm sure a lot happens in your own city that doesn't make the paper. I know for a fact that it happens in mine.

So why don't we leave the seattle-area expertise to the people that live on this side of the country? If you have never lived here, stop telling me I'm wrong about what I've seen; it makes you sound like an ass.

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expvideo wrote:

I've personally witnessed much worse things that never made the paper. A guy walked across the parking lot at the club and pointed a mac11 at a crowd of about 30 people and was threatening to shoot them. Never made the paper.

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Clearly you live a more exciting life than I do.

On a seperate occasion, a gun was pulled in a fight in the club parking lot and one of our bouncers shot a couple of times at the guy (not accurately apparently). Didn't make the paper (that incident I wasn't there for, but all of my co-workers were, so I'm pretty confident it happened).

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I have no reason to dispute your colleagues either.

I was walking around greenlake (crowded, rich neighborhood)with my now fiancee on our first date when somebody emptied a .45's magazine across the street (you could tell from the sound and it was close enough to make a distinction, that's why I say it was a .45). Never made the paper.

Click to expand...

It could have been a .44 .

There's a lot more, but I think I'm making a good enough point. Seattle's not that dangerous if you stay in the safe parts. After dark in the gang-infested neighborhoods a lot of bad things can happen. I'm sure that's true of any city.

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Frankly, I don't know what point you're trying to make.

Nearly 2.5 millioncases of an individual being able to protect themselves with the presence of a firearm are reported every year. Few of those cases ever make the paper. I'm sure a lot happens in your own city that doesn't make the paper. I know for a fact that it happens in mine.

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Perhaps but a defensive use is not what we were talking about anyway.

So why don't we leave the seattle-area expertise to the people that live on this side of the country? If you have never lived here, stop telling me I'm wrong about what I've seen; it makes you sound like an ass.

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I am perfectly willing to concede superior knowledge of Seattle to you. I never said anything to the contrary. Why you have erected this strawman is not clear. Perhaps you and the OP are one and the same person. My point is that the story lacks the ring of truth. This position is bolstered by the fact that the OP refuses to provide any information that could be checked out. Your assertion that somehow I claimed special knowledge of Seattle is false and was clearly used as a strawman that you could bash in order to take the focus away from the real question - is this a true story. No need to get testy. Just provide some evidence that this is not fiction.

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apjonas wrote:

expvideo wrote:

I've personally witnessed much worse things that never made the paper. A guy walked across the parking lot at the club and pointed a mac11 at a crowd of about 30 people and was threatening to shoot them. Never made the paper.

Click to expand...

Clearly you live a more exciting life than I do.

On a seperate occasion, a gun was pulled in a fight in the club parking lot and one of our bouncers shot a couple of times at the guy (not accurately apparently). Didn't make the paper (that incident I wasn't there for, but all of my co-workers were, so I'm pretty confident it happened).

Click to expand...

I have no reason to dispute your colleagues either.

I was walking around greenlake (crowded, rich neighborhood)with my now fiancee on our first date when somebody emptied a .45's magazine across the street (you could tell from the sound and it was close enough to make a distinction, that's why I say it was a .45). Never made the paper.

Click to expand...

It could have been a .44 .

There's a lot more, but I think I'm making a good enough point. Seattle's not that dangerous if you stay in the safe parts. After dark in the gang-infested neighborhoods a lot of bad things can happen. I'm sure that's true of any city.

Click to expand...

Frankly, I don't know what point you're trying to make.

Nearly 2.5 millioncases of an individual being able to protect themselves with the presence of a firearm are reported every year. Few of those cases ever make the paper. I'm sure a lot happens in your own city that doesn't make the paper. I know for a fact that it happens in mine.

Click to expand...

Perhaps but a defensive use is not what we were talking about anyway.

So why don't we leave the seattle-area expertise to the people that live on this side of the country? If you have never lived here, stop telling me I'm wrong about what I've seen; it makes you sound like an ass.

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I am perfectly willing to concede superior knowledge of Seattle to you. I never said anything to the contrary. Why you have erected this strawman is not clear. Perhaps you and the OP are one and the same person. My point is that the story lacks the ring of truth. This position is bolstered by the fact that the OP refuses to provide any information that could be checked out. Your assertion that somehow I claimed special knowledge of Seattle is false and was clearly used as a strawman that you could bash in order to take the focus away from the real question - is this a true story. No need to get testy. Just provide some evidence that this is not fiction.

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My appologies. I didn't realize that you were a master of unravelling complex conspiracies. You have caught me red handed. I am the OP, we are one in the same. I fed you this story to manipulate your emotions and waste your time. That's just the kind of coniving trickster I am.

You have a very well developed sense of paranoia that spies and imposters like myself could only dream of having. I'm sure it has helped you to get to the bottom of many an internet case where someone said something happened, but didn't have evidence to back it up.



A quick read through the WA board might help you to understand that I am a regular poster on this board, and while my points are not always agreed with, they are usually respected as those of a decent individual that wouldn't post a somewhat pointless story, just for the joy of not explaining it or proving it happened. I would appreciate you not accusing me of such rediculously time-wasting practices, and kindly piss off. If I wanted to have a factless emotional arguement I would email the brady group. I won't be doing that here with you.

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WTF is OP?

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The horn in a car is meant as a safety device. It's actually required in some (if not all) states for a car to even be legal. What is its intended purpose? It's meant as a warning to other motorists when there is a danger. This can be from one driver to others or from a near-victim to the person who caused the incident so they're at least aware of what they're doing, etc. In this case, I'd say her use of her horn was of the second type listed here (intentionally) and also the first type (even if not why it was performed).

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USN_MA1 wrote:

WTF is OP?

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Good question. I'm still trying to learn all the lingo around here myself. It made for a good day of foruming when I figured out that LEO meant law enforcement officer. heh We need a book of commonly used jargon used around here and their meanings.

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USN_MA1 wrote:

WTF is OP?

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OP = Original Poster; e.g. the person that started the thread.