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Thread: Utah Firearms discharge ban continues

  1. #1
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    I called Utah county sheriffs department and they stated that the firearms discharge ban was still being enforced. I asked if the ban had been renewed and they informed me that it didn’t need to be renewed and was in force until otherwise stated.

    From my research into the law they could only ban the discharge due to a state of emergency being declared, and that had to be renewed every 30 days.

    So is the person I spoke with misinformed (wouldn’t be the first time), or do I have an incorrect understanding of how this law works (also wouldn’t be the first time)



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    dude when is this dam ban gunna be over with! i wanna shoot my gun! hahah

  3. #3
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    I haven't heard anything about a firearms ban -- why is this in effect?

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    Utah County has banned the discharge of firearms due to "fire danger". But it’s supposed to be over now (30 days from July 10th), except the sheriffs office says they are still enforcing the law.




    Edit for link: http://www.utahconcealedcarry.com/files/utahcountydischargeban.pdf

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    Yeah I just read about it on yahoo -- says it started july 3rd -- also heard that they attributed a number of fires to discharging a firearm -- glad im not in utah.

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    They claim 7, however upon research on these fires None can be proven bullets started the fires. The best they could find were shells in the area of the fires. I would like anyone to go into the mountains on Utah and go 100 yards without finding bullet shells.

    Utah blames fires on anything. in the last month we have had fires start because of: Hot car brakes, Lawn mower hitting a rock, ATV Tail pipes, catalytic converter falling from a car, etc But strangely no fires from fireworks or cigarette butts.... Yeah right....

    Smoking should be banned long before shooting, I am sure these "gun" fires are really some rude smoker not stomping out his butts.



  7. #7
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    funny thing is, id be able to find the bullets, i have a whites detector the hard part is decifering if it started a fire

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    xmirage2kx wrote:
    They claim 7, however upon research on these fires None can be proven bullets started the fires. The best they could find were shells in the area of the fires....

    Utah blames fires on anything. in the last month we have had fires start because of: Hot car brakes, Lawn mower hitting a rock, ATV Tail pipes, catalytic converter falling from a car, etc
    I was wondering about the same thing when I read this article:

    http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=148&sid=1431851

    The spokesguys seem kind of wishy-washy about cause and effect. Or even cause and probability.

    When they say:

    Fires are not uncommon at "make-shift" shooting areas or unauthorized shooting area's.

    That's pretty wishy-washy. It's not very meaningful.

    However, when they say:

    To date, two large fires have started as a result of firearms shooting activities in the unincorporated Utah County area.

    That's pretty specific. If they have data (probable cause, so to speak) then they probably can swing the ban politically for as long as they want to. However, your point about the statutory authority comes into play. Under what authority are they imposing the ban? My guess is that they probably have it. Some emergency power or public safety thing....

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    IANAL

    I followed the link and read:

    1. Governor Huntsman declared statewide ban (until rescinded) on discharging tracer ammunition. 4 July 07

    2. the county legislative body of Utah county ordnance bans firearm discharge (with exceptions) for 30 days, unless rescinded first. not to be renewed or continued except by or with consent of the board of county commissioners. 10 July 2007.

    You might check into what action is considered consent of the board of county commissioners. Does it have to be an official meeting with minutes and all. if so there would need to be a record of the renewal or continuance.

    A second thought is : did all countys pass the same ordnance? can you shoot in another county?


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    soLEGALLY we can shoot in the mountains?

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    They did renew the 30 days at the last county council on Aug 10th. News link here:
    http://www.heraldextra.com/content/view/232466/3/


    Looks like the Sheriff is going to do his own experimentation:
    http://www.heraldextra.com/content/view/232873/


    I've got a feeling this probably won't be addressed for another 30 days unless we start to make really big stink about it. :X


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    xmirage2kx wrote:
    They claim 7, however upon research on these fires None can be proven bullets started the fires. The best they could find were shells in the area of the fires. I would like anyone to go into the mountains on Utah and go 100 yards without finding bullet shells.
    I have now found that 1 fire was "believed" tohave beenstarted by tracer rounds.

    Other fires are still to be related to bullets due to occurring "near popular shooting areas"

    We cant sit by and just watch this happen anymore. I am still trying to get official documentation on these fires, but I am being told they are not a matter of public record and can only get watered down media versions. If anyone else has better luck let me know.

    Write letters send emails, make phone calls. They play the "pass the buck" game any time you even try to talk to a real person so don’t give up. If we continue to let this happen there will be a permanent ban on recreational shooting outside of official ranges.



  13. #13
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    xmirage2kx wrote:
    xmirage2kx wrote:
    They claim 7, however upon research on these fires None can be proven bullets started the fires. The best they could find were shells in the area of the fires. I would like anyone to go into the mountains on Utah and go 100 yards without finding bullet shells.
    I have now found that 1 fire was "believed" tohave beenstarted by tracer rounds.

    Other fires are still to be related to bullets due to occurring "near popular shooting areas"

    We cant sit by and just watch this happen anymore. I am still trying to get official documentation on these fires, but I am being told they are not a matter of public record and can only get watered down media versions. If anyone else has better luck let me know.

    Write letters send emails, make phone calls. They play the "pass the buck" game any time you even try to talk to a real person so don’t give up. If we continue to let this happen there will be a permanent ban on recreational shooting outside of official ranges.

    The fires must have some cause. The problem is figuring out what that is, if possible.

    The sheriff and the politicos seem to be guessing as to what the cause is and controlling their suspected cause.

    This is foolish on their part, for two reasons

    1. They are probablly/possibly falling into the trap of suspecting a cause that is easily controllable, i.e., gun shooting. Gun shooting is appealing as a cause because it is controllable (by ban).Often, theappealing cause is just a trap for the naive and uneducated, the extremists and the dullards.

    2. If the sheriff/politicos take action to prohibit their suspected cause (gun shooting) and fires still get started due to some other cause which they could have identified, then they are performing poorly in their appointed responsibility.


    The sheriff/politicos should be pressured to produce their evidence that their suspected cause is:

    a. reasonable, and

    b. that they are addressing alternative suspected causes.

    And, if fires still start which are not gun shooting related, they should all be taken to task for not doing what they could to identify and deter those other causes. This is basic analysis and....economics.

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    xmirage2kx wrote:
    I called Utah county sheriffs department and they stated that the firearms discharge ban was still being enforced. I asked if the ban had been renewed and they informed me that it didn’t need to be renewed and was in force until otherwise stated.

    From my research into the law they could only ban the discharge due to a state of emergency being declared, and that had to be renewed every 30 days.

    So is the person I spoke with misinformed (wouldn’t be the first time), or do I have an incorrect understanding of how this law works (also wouldn’t be the first time)

    Guys.., this is for UTAH COUNTY.

    I went on Saturday (Aug 11th) along with my Son-in-Law + his for friends and a son of the friends out to TOOELE and got some rounds of. 1 of the Gentlemen that was with us is with the County (TOOELE COUNTY):P

    We had some fun with a Kimber (.45), Llama(.45), 44Mag Ruger Vaquero, 44Mag Henry Rifle, 30-06, Bunch of Glock (of which I'm NOT an owner of), Bunch of 22's as well (not an owner either).

    When you go out to Tooele and instead to turn out to Grantsville (Right)at that Light you turn LEFT and up the road you turn 1st Right on to a dirt road. You can't miss it. "Left-over" targets Everywhere.

    We had ALOTS OF FUN BOYS.

    Let's round up one day and get our shooter's out and have some fun:celebrate



    Remember UTAH COUNTY ban:P

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    Remember UTAH COUNTY ban:P
    Utah County for now... If they receive no restance from banning shooting in Utah county whats to stop them from making it all of Utah?

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    xmirage2kx wrote:
    Remember UTAH COUNTY ban:P
    Utah County for now... If they receive no restance from banning shooting in Utah county whats to stop them from making it all of Utah?
    Nothing...,

    But enjoy ALL the OTHER locations for now:celebrate

  17. #17
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    how far from payson do i have to go to get someplace to shoot? (the nearest place)

  18. #18
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    Look on map quest, They have the county borders. Then take your GPS and go 10 feet on the other side and start shooting If no GPS then you might want to drive a little further to assure you are out of utah county.

  19. #19
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    haha how about you grab your GPS, come to my place, pick me up, go grab SGT jensen in sanaquin, and weel all go shooting lol

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    Give me a holler @ (801) 865-4571 and tell me when :celebrate

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    Post or PM me what days and times are good and we can set something up. I haven’t gotten to shoot in over 2 weeks now, and I think my gun is getting sad.

    Fridays and saturdays are usually best for me.


  22. #22
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    xmirage2kx wrote:
    Post or PM me what days and times are good and we can set something up. I haven’t gotten to shoot in over 2 weeks now, and I think my gun is getting sad.
    OOOOOooooooooohhhhhhh...

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    I too called Utah County Sheriff dept on Saturday, as well as Juab County, Tooele County, even Elko County in NV - all with the same responses - ban in effect! I'm eager to squeeze off some roundsoutside of the confines of agun range.

    Not that I'd voilate, but what exactly are the potential penalties for disregarding this temporary firearms discharge ban?

  24. #24
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    alts wrote:
    I too called Utah County Sheriff dept on Saturday, as well as Juab County, Tooele County, even Elko County in NV - all with the same responses - ban in effect! I'm eager to squeeze off some roundsoutside of the confines of agun range.

    Not that I'd voilate, but what exactly are the potential penalties for disregarding this temporary firearms discharge ban?
    Tooele said they have a ban in effect?

  25. #25
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    Yes on Saturday 11th Toole Sherriff's dept said ban in effect. Did you learn otherwise?

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