utbagpiper
Banned
imported post
SGT Jensen wrote:
I have listened and even been part of legislative hearings and debates where it is clear and stated that only those 21 and older can get a permit and conceal a firearm.
How many such debates or hearings have YOU ever attended? Until recently I had no concerns that the concealed weapons law made no explicit mention one way or the other about OC. That which is not prohibited is allowed in this nation. Basic principle of American-Anglo law going back some 500 years.
I AGREE with your view of the law. We are also completely agreed that a person with a permit can legally OC on college property. Our combined opinion and $2.00 will get a bad cup of coffee and not much else.
I HOPE he has no problems. If he does have problems, I would HOPE that he would prevail in court. But I've come to learn that our courts have NOTHING to with justice and VERY LITTLE to do with the actual law or even facts of the case. (And again, how much time have you spent in court seeing the crap that goes on?)
It is about egos and win-loss records and who can afford the best attorney and investigators for the longest time period. And the city or county has an endless supply of money for both.
I am not personally opposed to him OCing. If I had my druthers, any mature child (much less adult 18 or older) would be free to carry a gun OC or CC without being bothered. Make me king for a day (or three) and I'll make it all right. Until then, there are certain areas where I would exercise a bit of caution unless I was willing and anxious for a court fight. That is all I'm saying.
If he or anyone else wants to be the test case, he has my admiration. For that matter, those with permits who want to be a test case might care to go OC around UVSC or UoU. FAR better to have a nice, well planned, CLEAN case before the court than one that surprises you and the prosecution can make a case for disorderly conduct or disturbing the peace because someone was not expecting a problem and so was not prepared with the witnesses, recordings, and personal demeanor needed to prevent spurious extraneous charges. But I will not ignore what I view as potential risks.
Take my opinion for what they are. But remember that it is not your life nor mine in this case, but b1ack5mith's. So don't blow sunshine up anyone's kilt pretending that age is at all comparable to sex or race in this instance. If you don't know better, you need to study the law a little more so as to understand what are protected categories and what are not.
I'm not looking for a fight on this. Just offering my opinions and sincere cautions to any who do not want to get caught unawares.
Charles
SGT Jensen wrote:
Oh, is THAT all? For most of us, 6 months and $1000 fine, plus a gun related conviction on our record would be a life altering decision. If b1ack5mith wants to be a police officer, lawyer, or ever work in a field that requires a security clearance, such a conviction could throw a wrench in the works.
I have listened and even been part of legislative hearings and debates where it is clear and stated that only those 21 and older can get a permit and conceal a firearm.
How many such debates or hearings have YOU ever attended? Until recently I had no concerns that the concealed weapons law made no explicit mention one way or the other about OC. That which is not prohibited is allowed in this nation. Basic principle of American-Anglo law going back some 500 years.
I AGREE with your view of the law. We are also completely agreed that a person with a permit can legally OC on college property. Our combined opinion and $2.00 will get a bad cup of coffee and not much else.
I HOPE he has no problems. If he does have problems, I would HOPE that he would prevail in court. But I've come to learn that our courts have NOTHING to with justice and VERY LITTLE to do with the actual law or even facts of the case. (And again, how much time have you spent in court seeing the crap that goes on?)
It is about egos and win-loss records and who can afford the best attorney and investigators for the longest time period. And the city or county has an endless supply of money for both.
I am not personally opposed to him OCing. If I had my druthers, any mature child (much less adult 18 or older) would be free to carry a gun OC or CC without being bothered. Make me king for a day (or three) and I'll make it all right. Until then, there are certain areas where I would exercise a bit of caution unless I was willing and anxious for a court fight. That is all I'm saying.
If he or anyone else wants to be the test case, he has my admiration. For that matter, those with permits who want to be a test case might care to go OC around UVSC or UoU. FAR better to have a nice, well planned, CLEAN case before the court than one that surprises you and the prosecution can make a case for disorderly conduct or disturbing the peace because someone was not expecting a problem and so was not prepared with the witnesses, recordings, and personal demeanor needed to prevent spurious extraneous charges. But I will not ignore what I view as potential risks.
Take my opinion for what they are. But remember that it is not your life nor mine in this case, but b1ack5mith's. So don't blow sunshine up anyone's kilt pretending that age is at all comparable to sex or race in this instance. If you don't know better, you need to study the law a little more so as to understand what are protected categories and what are not.
I'm not looking for a fight on this. Just offering my opinions and sincere cautions to any who do not want to get caught unawares.
Charles
