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Thread: Shoot through a door redux?

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    http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/05/us...erland&emc=rss

    September 5, 2007
    Musician Is Killed for Banging on a Door
    By GRETEL C. KOVACH

    DALLAS, Sept. 4 — A Texas rock musician was shot to death here early Monday by a neighbor who fired through a closed door, thinking he was scaring off a burglar.

    The incident occurred just three days after a new law took effect strengthening the right of Texans to use deadly force to protect themselves and their property.

    The musician, Jeffrey Carter Albrecht, 34, a keyboardist with Edie Brickell and the New Bohemians and the Dallas rock band Sorta, was shot in the head after he startled a man and his wife about 4 a.m. by pounding and kicking at their back door, the police said. Mr. Albrecht had just assaulted his girlfriend, who lives next door and had locked him out of her house, the police said.

    The neighbor, who has not been identified by the police, was awakened by his wife’s screams that someone was breaking into their home, according to the police report. The man yelled for the person to go away, but when the pounding continued, he fired through the top of the door.

    Mr. Albrecht, who was about 6-foot-5, was struck in the head.

    The police said the case would be referred to a grand jury for review. Mr. Albrecht’s mother, Judith Albrecht, would not say whether she thought the neighbor should be charged with a crime.

    “I think he was frightened, and I do think he could have made another choice,” Ms. Albrecht said. “I understand there are a lot of bad people, but Carter was not one of them.”

    Mr. Albrecht’s girlfriend, Ryann Rathbone, said she believed he was having a bad reaction to the combination of alcohol and an antismoking drug they both had taken for a week. The drug had given them hallucinatory dreams, Ms. Rathbone said.

    “This was not a drunken rage,” she said.

    “Carter would never have hurt me, ever,’’ Ms. Rathbone said.


    Texas has protected the right to “stand your ground” and use deadly force to protect oneself at home without first trying to retreat since 1995. And a law that took effect on Saturday expanded that so-called “castle doctrine” to apply to public spaces.

    The law also expanded civil immunity and could make it more difficult for the Albrecht family or relatives of those killed in similar incidents in Texas to win a wrongful-death suit, said James Dark, executive director of the Texas State Rifle Association, which lobbied for the new law.

    “These duty-to-retreat laws provide legal protection for those who are out committing criminal acts,” Mr. Dark said. Under the new Texas law, “the protection of the law falls on those who obey the law not those who violate the law.”

    Texas is one of 19 states with a castle doctrine self-defense law, according to the National Rifle Association.

    Marsha McCartney, president of the North Texas chapter of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, called Mr. Albrecht’s death “one more gun tragedy.”

    “I’m sure the man who did the shooting feels terrible about it,” Ms. McCartney said, “but legally in Texas he can do exactly what he did because he feels frightened.”

    Borris Miles, a Democratic state representative from Houston and a former schools police officer, opposed the legislation, which was signed into law in March.

    In July, Mr. Miles confronted a robber at his home construction site and shot him in the leg. No charges were filed, but he said he still opposed the new law.

    “We have a right to defend ourselves in our home. I support that and I always will,” Mr. Miles said. But the law went too far, he said, by expanding the right to use deadly force in the workplace and one’s automobile.


    I'm confused... he either just assaulted his girlfriend and she locked him out, or he was on some weird meds and would never hurt her. ???

    Regardless, this can't be read in any sort of good light for self-defense, home protection, or castle-doctrine. : (

    I can't say shooting through a closed door at an unknown person is a good idea. If somebody comes knocking (banging) at 4am on my back door, I'd call 911 and establish threat and to notify the police to start their drive over and keep a safe view of the door, if they break in...
    -Unrequited

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    Although it's hard to predict what I'd do until I'm faced with the situation, I'd like to think I'd do more like you suggest than what the shooter in that article did.

    To me, someone banging violently on the door does not constitute a threat to my safety. The second he gets the door open, however, all bets are off.

    I don't understand people who "fire warning shots in the air" or shoot "high in the door" to scare someone off. What happened to knowing what's behind your target?

    Stupid people should not have guns...

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    unrequited wrote:
    http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/05/us...nd&emc=rss

    ...was shot in the head after he startled a man and his wife about 4 a.m. by pounding and kicking at their back door, the police said. Mr. Albrecht had just assaulted his girlfriend, who lives next door and had locked him out of her house, the police said.

    The neighbor, who has not been identified by the police, was awakened by his wife’s screams that someone was breaking into their home, according to the police report. The man yelled for the person to go away, but when the pounding continued, he fired through the top of the door.

    I can't say shooting through a closed door at an unknown person is a good idea. If somebody comes knocking (banging) at 4am on my back door, I'd call 911 and establish threat and to notify the police to start their drive over and keep a safe view of the door, if they break in...
    Some people like to neutralize the threat as soon as possible. Proactive lot they are...

    Hey, if you got the gun, why not use it?

    I agree, regardless of the adjudication/disposition, the event cannot be good for the pro-gun/rights position.

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    Those evil guns are at it again...

    So, as I understand it, a large, angry drunk/tripping man starts trying to force his way into the wrong house, with the intention of beating the woman inside. The occupant, who gets startled by large, angry, violent drunken men trying to break into his home, proceeds to not wait until said person breaks down the door, and instead shoots through the door. Seems like a rock-solid defense to me, except for the shooting through the door part.

    I'd also be surprised if the new law made any difference in the shooter's decision to fire through the door, as most people don't keep up with current gun laws. Also, I doubt that the thought process in a rational person's head would go, "Well, this animal is trying to break into my house and either injure, sexually assault, or kill my wife. But! Current laws says I might be liable for shooting him, so I'll just give him what he wants." If he's going to shoot after the laws is put in place, I'd put my money on that he would have shot before the law was enacted. But, then again, that doesn't fit the anti-gun misinformation campaign, so I guess I'm wrong...

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    Yeah bad deal all around. Don't know all the circumstances but anybody getting woken at 4:00 am with someone trying to beat down your back door has got to be a bit nerve racking. I would hope if I was in the situation I would hold fire until the door was opened or in my case the window was broken and an arm was coming in.

    This will be a test of the Law. Was the high shot a justifiable use of force to scare aware said intruder or prevent entry or harm? Or, was it (the high shot) intended as deadly force.

    To me it does not matter who he was or why he was there but rather where he was and what he was trying to do. Regardless of the reasons when it comes right down to it and you have to make the choice and try and decide what this persons intentions are in a state of mind after being jarred awake late at night...........

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    Know your target and what is beyond it... You can hardly establish a proximate threat to your life and safety if you can't even see the guy on the other side of a locked door. Someone knocking late at night may be annoying, but it is not a capital offense. If I were on a grand jury (assuming this story is correct), I'd vote to indict the guy for negligent homicide, say.

    -ljp

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    imperialism2024 wrote:
    Those evil guns are at it again...

    So, as I understand it, a large, angry drunk/tripping man starts trying to force his way into the wrong house, with the intention of beating the woman inside. The occupant, who gets startled by large, angry, violent drunken men trying to break into his home, proceeds to not wait until said person breaks down the door, and instead shoots through the door. Seems like a rock-solid defense to me, except for the shooting through the door part.
    Um, that's the only substantivepart that is at issue...



    But the complicated web of situational details, citizen with a gun responsibilities and legal interpretations of reasonable fear of death or severe bodily injury may not need to be analyzed after all. The resolution, one which everyone can go along with, is becoming clearer.....

    Sue Pfizer Inc.!!!!



    Girlfriend of slain musician cites anti-smoking drug


    06:11 AM CDT on Wednesday, September 5, 2007

    By MICHAEL GRABELL and TANYA EISERER / The Dallas Morning News



    Friends of a popular Dallas musician killed early Monday are at a loss to explain what caused him to spin out of control, beat up his girlfriend and try to kick in her neighbor's door after a night of heavy drinking.

    Now they're wondering whether a pill that Carter Albrecht had recently started taking to quit smoking may have sent him over the edge. But there is no hard evidence that the drug causes bouts of rage.

    "I really believe it was the drug," said his girlfriend, Ryann Rathbone. "He would have never been abusive toward me, never, ever. He and I had a very peaceful, loving relationship. He and I loved each other so much."

    While some users of the drug Chantix have reported symptoms of anger on Internet blogs, no studies released by the Food and Drug Administration, the manufacturer Pfizer or other researchers have linked the drug to violent outbursts.

    "When there's something new put in the mixture, it's natural to wonder, 'Might this have made a difference?' " said Dr. Bryon Adinoff, an addiction expert at UT Southwestern Medical Center. "There may be truth to it, but we don't know and we likely may never know."

    Mr. Albrecht, who played guitar and keyboard for the bands Sorta and Edie Brickell & New Bohemians, was fatally shot as he tried to kick in the neighbor's door in the 9000 block of Santa Clara Drive, just east of White Rock Lake.

    Dallas police said the neighbor shot one time at the top of the door to scare him away, but instead struck the 6-foot-4 musician in the head.

    The case will be reviewed by a Dallas County grand jury to determine whether there will be charges against the neighbor, whose name has not been released.

    But the shooter will probably be protected under state laws allowing Texans to use deadly force to prevent someone from breaking into their homes at night. A new law that took effect Saturday, known as the "Castle Doctrine," strengthens those rights by eliminating the requirement that people try to flee before shooting in self-defense.

    One neighbor, Natalee Morse, said she and others who live nearby brought groceries to the homeowner in sympathy.

    "We wanted to do something to show we support them," she said. "It's a terrible position to be in. All of us thought we'd do the same thing if we were in that position."

    According to police reports, there have been 15 burglaries on the 1 ½-mile stretch of Santa Clara Drive since January 2006. Four of those burglaries took place in vacant houses, and one occurred in a backyard storage shed. No reports of robberies could be found during that time.



    'Chantix dreams'


    Friends said Mr. Albrecht, 34, was normally a laid-back guy who never became violent when drunk. He and his girlfriend had been taking Chantix for about a week and planned to stop smoking Monday. They had started having vivid sleep experiences that users have nicknamed "Chantix dreams."

    "It was giving them awful, strange nightmares," said bandmate Ward Williams.

    Changes in dreaming, along with nausea and constipation, are common reactions to the drug, according to Pfizer and the FDA. But they are also symptoms of withdrawal.

    Chantix is a prescription medicine that works by blocking nicotine from attaching to the brain receptors that produce feelings of pleasure. It was approved by the FDA in May 2006 after studies showed it to be far superior to other anti-smoking drugs without any major side effects.

    "While we haven't had an opportunity to review the details of this case, clinical studies do not suggest a causal relationship between Chantix use and rage," said Pfizer spokesman Francisco Gebauer.

    An FDA spokeswoman said the agency would look into the matter but didn't have enough information to say whether the drug could have contributed to Mr. Albrecht's violent outburst.

    But Dr. Adinoff said it's possible that heavy drinking on top of the Chantix might have triggered a strange reaction. That's why most drugs bear warnings against taking them with alcohol.

    "Both of them interact with some of the same regions of the brain," he said. "You mix alcohol with another drug that affects the central nervous system and you can easily get some unpredictable effects."



    Behavior change


    Ms. Rathbone said she met Mr. Albrecht about 1 a.m. Monday at a bar on Greenville Avenue. He had taken a dose of the drug just before going to the bar and didn't seem drunk when she got there, she said.

    But as they left the bar shortly after 2 a.m., Mr. Albrecht started acting bizarrely, she said. He began quoting a book about the oppression of the Jews called Constantine's Sword, which he had recently been reading.

    "He was saying weird, off-the-wall stuff that didn't match our conversation," Ms. Rathbone said. "I think because I didn't understand, he started to get mad at me. It didn't make sense."

    She said they were home about 10 minutes when he became out of control.

    "He wanted to leave, and I didn't want him to drive," she said. "He already didn't know who I was at that point. I didn't want him going anywhere."

    That's when he began to hit her, she said. "He didn't even realize he was hurting me. He had no idea. He was saying the same kinds of stuff that didn't make sense. It was like he was in a dream."

    Mr. Albrecht chased Ms. Rathbone outside, and she ran back in, locking him out, the police report said. Mr. Albrecht then went to the back of the neighbor's home and started banging.

    The Dallas County medical examiner's office will conduct toxicology tests to determine what was in Mr. Albrecht's system. But that will probably take several weeks.

    "We're not by any means scientists or chemists," said Sgt. Larry Lewis, a Dallas homicide supervisor. "We'll look at anything and everything."



    http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...2.4247864.html

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    So, as I understand it, a large, angry drunk/tripping man starts trying to force his way into the wrong house, with the intention of beating the woman inside
    Hey imperialism 2024....re-read the article....not quite how it went down.....either way, the point remains the same.......shooting through the door=bad. HankT, you may have adjust your "Postulate of Civilian Self-Defense" yet again.

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    HankT wrote:
    I can't say shooting through a closed door at an unknown person is a good idea. If somebody comes knocking (banging) at 4am on my back door, I'd call 911 and establish threat and to notify the police to start their drive over and keep a safe view of the door, if they break in...

    Some people like to neutralize the threat as soon as possible. Proactive lot they are...

    Hey, if you got the gun, why not use it?

    I agree, regardless of the adjudication/disposition, the event cannot be good for the pro-gun/rights position.
    I agree with HankT on this one.


    I remember when I was 12 and I went deer hunting with my older brother. I was hunting rabbits as I was not old enough to hunt deer. We ran into a California hunter and his response to, "Have you seen any deer?" was, "No but I've had a couple of sound shots" We then proceeded to hunt as far away from him as possible.

    YOU NEVER TAKE A SOUND SHOT.

    The 4 basic rules are;

    1. Treat every gun as if it is loaded.

    2. Never point any gun at anything you don't want to destroy.

    3. Keep your finger off the trigger until you have identified your target.

    4. KNOW YOUR TARGET AND WHAT IS BEHIND IT.

    I might add a fifth rule, to stay as far away from trigger happy people as possible.

    This was entirely avoidable and I am sorry for the dead man and his family.

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    The oldadage:

    Better to be judged by twelve than to be carried by six.

    doesn't seem to be quite so useful in situations like this, does it?

    The new adage seems quite a bit better:
    Better to do the right thing than have to be judged by twelve.1


    1. or investigated by one (department) and sued by one (family).

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    HankT wrote:
    The oldadage:

    Better to be judged by twelve than to be carried by six.

    doesn't seem to be quite so useful in situations like this, does it?

    The new adage seems quite a bit better:
    Better to do the right thing than have to be judged by twelve.1


    1. or investigated by one (department) and sued by one (family).


    "There ya Go Again" Ronald Regan

    HankT what you don't get is that the best safety devise is the gray matter between your ears. There is no adage or slogan or saying that fits all occasions.

    In the case of your slogan, "Better to do the right thing than have to be judged by twelve.1


    1. or investigated by one (department) and sued by one (family)." "


    You totally miss the concept that the "right thing", to be done, in a given situation,may be just the thing that does get you judged by twelve and investigated and sued.

    That is why we have brains so that we can decide for ourselves what the right thing to do, in a specific situation is, in spite of the potential consequences.

    Doing the right thing includes agreeing with you on the rare occasions that you are right.

    You were right in your previous post, but not in this one.




    In case some of you are wondering what HankT is referring to, it is to an exchange on another thread.



    Here is the meat of it.



    tarzan1888 wrote:
    HankT wrote:
    Here's a new adage, even better than the old one:

    Better to do the right thing than have to be judged by twelve.

    It is absolutely mandatory for people who wish to use deadly force to do the right thing......

    HankT, I don't know what you consider the "right thing to do", BUT if I see my wife, or another woman being raped or assaulted, the right thing for me to do is stop that rape or assault.

    If someone is in my house, heading for my bedroom or that of one of my children, the right thing for me to do is stop that threat.

    If I am on the street, in the mall etc.and am approached by a group of undesirables, who threaten me or mine, I will stop that threat.

    You do what you have to do and so will I.


    No one should ever "wish to use deadly force", but if the threat exists, you need to be ready to.


    HankT wrote:
    .....Copping out by saying (now) that you'll be willingto go through thecriminal justice system (then) for any mistakes you may make doesn't cut it too well. It just reveals a tendency toward simplism and, perhaps, irresponsibility.




    Not being willing to do what you need to do just reveals a tendency toward simplism and, perhaps irresponsibility.

    I remember, some years back, when they came out with a new cancer cure, but then some Bozo in the FDA, wanted to ban this cure because it had a tendency to cause 3 other types of cancer, and he thought that this made it a bad way to go.

    What he didn't realize was that the cancer this new medicine cured, was 100% fatal without it, and the other cancers that it MIGHT cause were easily cured or controlled by well established procedures.

    Yes if you NEED to use deadly force and use it, you MIGHT end up in court, but at least you WILL be alive to attest to your reason for using deadly force.

    Or you can be a do gooder, who doesn't want to decide to use deadly force, WHEN IT IS NEEDED, and never go to court because you are dead, or be like those idiots on Sinfield and go to court because you didn't help when you could.


    If you are not willing, ready andable to use deadly force, WHEN IT IS NEEDED, then you have no business carrying a gun, and conversely if you are anxious to use deadly force, WHEN IT IS NOT NEEDED, you also have no business carrying a gun.

    Another old adage that is a good one;

    "The very best safety is the one between your ears."







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    HankT wrote:
    imperialism2024 wrote:
    Those evil guns are at it again...

    So, as I understand it, a large, angry drunk/tripping man starts trying to force his way into the wrong house, with the intention of beating the woman inside. The occupant, who gets startled by large, angry, violent drunken men trying to break into his home, proceeds to not wait until said person breaks down the door, and instead shoots through the door. Seems like a rock-solid defense to me, except for the shooting through the door part.
    Um, that's the only substantivepart that is at issue...
    Er, to people like us. The article seems to imply that the issue was that he chose to use deadly force against a threat, not that he shot through a door to neutralize the threat.

    bayboy42, I don't see what was wrong with my summary... of course, the man doing the shooting perhaps didn't know that the shootee was looking to beat the woman inside (if he didn't know what house was his, how would he know what woman was his?), but I would assume that he would be shouting things giving an indication of wanting to harm a woman. After all, it's not too often that people go into drunken/medicated rages and stay silent...

    Anyhow, it seems to me that the main problem with the situation, even on top of the shooting that was committed, is that it is being blamed on Texas's new laws.

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    um imperialism...your summary was incorrect...you stated:
    So, as I understand it, a large, angry drunk/tripping man starts trying to force his way into the wrong house, with the intention of beating the woman inside.
    The article never gives any indication of what Albrechts's intention were....nor will they ever be able to because this idiot shot through his door.

    You go on to state
    "if he didn't know what house was his, how would he know what woman was his"
    Where did the article give any indication that Albrecht didn't know which house was his....and again, we'll never know because this idiot shot through his door.



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    I was about to reply to bayboy42's last post, and then realized that the article is fairly useless since we don't have the police report available, and so we can't really draw many conclusions from it except that 1) the shooter shot through a door at 2) a threatening person, and most importantly 3) the first article is blaming looser gun laws for the homocide. Everything else is speculation.

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    unrequited wrote:
    The musician, Jeffrey Carter Albrecht, 34, a keyboardist with Edie Brickell and the New Bohemians...
    This is an interesting case. All I can say is...I'm not aware of too many things. I know what I know, if you know what I mean.

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    Police Won't Charge Homeowner In Musician's Death
    http://cbs11tv.com/local/local_story_247152451.html

    (AP) DALLAS Police said Tuesday they aren't pursuing charges against a homeowner who shot and killed a former member of Edie Brickell & New Bohemians who tried kicking in his door in the middle of the night.

    The case will be turned over to a grand jury that will decide whether the homeowner will face charges. Dallas police Sgt. Larry Lewis said the shooting appears to fall under state law permitting deadly force as self-defense.

    Jeffrey Carter Albrecht, 34, was inebriated Monday when the wife of his girlfriend's neighbor began screaming around 4 a.m. that someone was breaking in, police said. After telling Albrecht to get away, the husband fired his handgun through the door and shot Albrecht in the head, police said. Albrecht had been fighting with his girlfriend.

    "He yelled several verbal warnings, 'I'll shoot! I'll shoot!'," Lewis said. "From what we gather, he fired near the top of the door, hoping he would scare the person away."

    The homeowner, whose identity wasn't released, was not arrested.

    The shooting came two days after the enactment of a new state law, nicknamed the "Castle Doctrine," that gives Texans a stronger legal right to defend themselves with deadly force in their homes, cars and workplaces.

    The bill, backed by the National Rifle Association, states that a person has no duty to retreat from an intruder before using deadly force. Lewis said he read over the Castle Doctrine on Tuesday, but said the homeowner appeared to be protected under another deadly force law already on the books.

    Under Chapter 9 of the state penal code, a person can protect their property with deadly force to "prevent the other's imminent commission ... of criminal mischief during the nighttime."

    "I think (the shooting) falls most under Chapter 9," Lewis said.

    Albrecht, who went by his middle name, had been a keyboard player for the New Bohemians since 1999, according to the band's Web site. He also played keyboard and guitar and sang for Sorta, named in 2006 as the best local music act by the Dallas Observer.

    Albrecht played several times with Brickell's husband, Paul Simon. He also played with Texas musician Charlie Sexton, a renowned guitarist.

    Danny Balis, Albrecht's roommate and fellow member of the Dallas rock band Sorta, said the shooter lived next door to Albrecht's girlfriend. Albrecht had been fighting with his girlfriend, authorities said.

    His death stunned friends and those who knew him in the North Texas music community. The idea of him banging on a door in the middle of the night seems out of character for a man known to be friendly and quiet, friends said.

    "He is not a violent person," said Carrie Garcia, Sorta's manager. "He is cool as a cucumber, shy, always wanted to make a joke in a situation that may be a little tense."


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    My point exactly imperialism!

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    It's hard to say what anyone would actually do in the middle of the night with a drunken madman trying to kick down the door. I'd like to think that I'd wait for the door to be kicked in, but on the other hand he did have a better chance of survival by stopping him before he kicked the door down. That way he still had the door to protect him from the attacker while waiting for his motor to shut down. I've heard it said that even after a hit in the the vital triangle area that shuts down the "supply" (blood pressure &/or lungs), there is still enough fuel & oxygen in the muscles & brain for the bad guy to continue attacking for anywhere from 20 to 40 seconds before he'll be forced to stop his attack.

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    swift wrote:
    I've heard it said that even after a hit in the the vital triangle area that shuts down the "supply" (blood pressure &/or lungs), there is still enough fuel & oxygen in the muscles & brain for the bad guy to continue attacking for anywhere from 20 to 40 seconds before he'll be forced to stop his attack.
    And that is why, on the 8th day of creation, God created the 12-gauge shotgun and said, "It is good."

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    Warning shot....







    Sept. 6, 2007, 6:56PM
    Man who shot musician told 911 he tried firing warning shot


    By PAUL J. WEBER Associated Press Writer
    © 2007 The Associated Press



    DALLAS — A homeowner who killed a member of Edie Brickell & New Bohemians by shooting a gun through his back door told a 911 operator he was trying to fire a warning shot but didn't think the musician "was that tall."

    But instead of scaring Jeffrey Carter Albrecht away, according to a tape of the 911 call released Thursday, the man tells the operator "I think I shot him" as Albrecht's body lay in the doorway.

    He was "trying to get in the back door," said the homeowner, who identifies himself as William Logg. "I woke up and my wife was screaming. ... I looked out there and he's like trying to beat through the window. I yelled at him to get away."

    Albrecht, who was 6-foot-5, was shot in the head around 4 a.m. Monday while trying to kick down Logg's back door, police said. Logg lives next door to Albrecht's girlfriend, whom police said the musician was fighting with before the shooting.

    Police and friends of Albrecht have said they don't know why the 34-year-old had gone to the neighbor's home.

    Albrecht's parents say despite the confusion over their son's actions, they understand why the neighbor reacted by firing his weapon.

    "They didn't invite someone at that time in the morning to be kicking at their door," Ken Albrecht, the musician's father, said in an interview with Dallas television station KTVT. "He had a house to protect, a wife to protect and my heart goes out to them."

    Coincidentally, the neighbor who shot Albrecht is also a musician. Logg, 54, is a blues guitarist who goes by the nickname "Smokey" and has recorded multiple albums.

    Logg will not face charges, police said. The case will instead be turned over to a grand jury, but police and Dallas prosecutors have said Logg appeared to be within his rights under the state's self-defense laws.

    The 10 1/2-minute call to 911 begins with Logg's wife screaming "There's someone in my yard!" Seconds after the call begins, a loud noise can be heard in the background.

    When the operator asks what the noise was, Logg's wife said she doesn't know. Soon after, Logg can be heard telling his wife, "I think I just shot him."

    "Oh my God! Oh my God, Billy, don't tell me that!" the woman says.

    Albrecht, who went by his middle name, had been a keyboard player for the New Bohemians since 1999, according to the band's Web site. Albrecht played several times with Brickell's husband, Paul Simon. He also played with Texas musician Charlie Sexton, a renowned guitarist.

    He also played keyboard and guitar and sang for Sorta, named in 2006 as the best local music act by the Dallas Observer.

    Edie Brickell & New Bohemians scored a breakout hit in 1989 with "What I Am." They broke up for several years but regrouped and put out an album last year.

    http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/tx/5114638.html


  21. #21
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    HankT wrote:
    Warning shot....







    Sept. 6, 2007, 6:56PM
    Man who shot musician told 911 he tried firing warning shot


    By PAUL J. WEBER Associated Press Writer
    © 2007 The Associated Press



    DALLAS — A homeowner who killed a member of Edie Brickell & New Bohemians by shooting a gun through his back door told a 911 operator he was trying to fire a warning shot but didn't think the musician "was that tall."

    But instead of scaring Jeffrey Carter Albrecht away, according to a tape of the 911 call released Thursday, the man tells the operator "I think I shot him" as Albrecht's body lay in the doorway.

    He was "trying to get in the back door," said the homeowner, who identifies himself as William Logg. "I woke up and my wife was screaming. ... I looked out there and he's like trying to beat through the window. I yelled at him to get away."

    Albrecht, who was 6-foot-5, was shot in the head around 4 a.m. Monday while trying to kick down Logg's back door, police said. Logg lives next door to Albrecht's girlfriend, whom police said the musician was fighting with before the shooting.

    Police and friends of Albrecht have said they don't know why the 34-year-old had gone to the neighbor's home.

    Albrecht's parents say despite the confusion over their son's actions, they understand why the neighbor reacted by firing his weapon.

    "They didn't invite someone at that time in the morning to be kicking at their door," Ken Albrecht, the musician's father, said in an interview with Dallas television station KTVT. "He had a house to protect, a wife to protect and my heart goes out to them."

    Coincidentally, the neighbor who shot Albrecht is also a musician. Logg, 54, is a blues guitarist who goes by the nickname "Smokey" and has recorded multiple albums.

    Logg will not face charges, police said. The case will instead be turned over to a grand jury, but police and Dallas prosecutors have said Logg appeared to be within his rights under the state's self-defense laws.

    The 10 1/2-minute call to 911 begins with Logg's wife screaming "There's someone in my yard!" Seconds after the call begins, a loud noise can be heard in the background.

    When the operator asks what the noise was, Logg's wife said she doesn't know. Soon after, Logg can be heard telling his wife, "I think I just shot him."

    "Oh my God! Oh my God, Billy, don't tell me that!" the woman says.

    Albrecht, who went by his middle name, had been a keyboard player for the New Bohemians since 1999, according to the band's Web site. Albrecht played several times with Brickell's husband, Paul Simon. He also played with Texas musician Charlie Sexton, a renowned guitarist.

    He also played keyboard and guitar and sang for Sorta, named in 2006 as the best local music act by the Dallas Observer.

    Edie Brickell & New Bohemians scored a breakout hit in 1989 with "What I Am." They broke up for several years but regrouped and put out an album last year.

    http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/tx/5114638.html
    NEVER fire a warning shot.

    "IF" you are going to use a gun for the protection of yourself or others, YOU must always "keep your head when all about you are loosing theirs and blaming it on you." RK

    We are not police and a warning shot is never a good idea.

  22. #22
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    As far as firing a warning shot goes:
    If you have time to fire a warning shot, the situation probably doesn't warant you shooting. I wouldn't shoot untill I was forced to shoot in self defence, I don't think there is as much legal protection for shooting to reduce your stress level.
    A warning shot should be fired at a safe backstop, which usualy means down (like the ground in front of your attacker.) A bullet fired up will always come back down, unless your gun can fire at escape velocity.

  23. #23
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    10 and half minutes with 911 and no response from police? How long did it take for a cruiser to show up after the shot was fired?

    I was always taught that if you point a gun at someone or something you better be prepared to kill.

    Monday morning quarterback says he made a mistake. However, at the time the homeowner made the decision to shoot it was the right one for the time. I'm sorry someone died. This whole situation is tragic for all parties involved.


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