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Thread: Closest I have come to a shooting

  1. #1
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    Hi all. I figured I might as well post about the closest I have come to shooting someone. I work armed security in the poconos, PA. And supervise several sites. Over the past four years I have had to draw several times a year. Winter of 2004 I received a callfor atrespasser at a residence. At the home were the two female residents,approx 40y/o and 19y/o along with the 19y/o's baby.

    They let me in the kitchen sliders via the side deck. The female owner said her ex boyfriend who was known to beat her was in the crawl space getting his stuff. He hadn,t lived there for several months. This woman was known to me from other calls. She justwould not get a P.F.A. Knowing he is violent I called the local P.S.P. barracks and was told they were en route. He was not a threat while in the crawl space.

    While standing in the kitchen with them this idiot stormed up on the deck and opened the slider that does not lock. I blocked his path telling him to leave and got shoved by him, screaming to the ex behind me that he could " **ing kill her. Why did you call him?" I drew my Fox O.C. and batonspraying him squarely in the face, heavy stream. He ran out on the deck, threw a broom back at me and went down the stairs. I stayed on the deck. He ran over to the wood pile in front of the deck which is about three feet of the ground and grabbed the full size axe. In my head I was wondering if the O.C. would kick in. I drew my Ruger p97, .45acp, . As he turned and began coming toward the steps I shouted " stop or I will shoot you in the chest." While he wasstanding at the bottom of the steps I cocked the ruger back for single action and took up slack. I knew this was clearly a do or die time; and actually said to myself " Lord steady my hand.!"

    This guy stood at the bottom of the stairs with the axe over his head cursing. He then dropped one hand and began wiping at his face, with the axe weaving. The O.C. Kicked in. It seemed like a long time but maybe really thirty seconds or so. Time does become distorted. The temperature was in the single digits and I suspect that delayed the O.C. He had been outside and his face was red from cold. Finally he dropped the axe and ran around the house cursing, wiping snow on his face. He was able to get around to his car at the roadway and drive off.

    Okay so where is the P.S.P. ? Twenty five minutes after I called them Two units rolled up. I was the only guard on duty with no backup available except the P.S.P. It is true that the police respond to clean up the mess and do the paperwork.

    Having this long to reflect I know this would have been a clean shoot. If I had fled when threatened the female residents & baby would have no protection. Looking back I even believe that I was waiting too long to shoot. He was closer than 21 feet and I had no where to go. How many shots would it have taken to stop this clearly enraged, healthy male? Who knows. But having to work alone so often I have promised myself not to let an attacker get that close, especially when protecting others. I had a duty to stay there and deal with him.

    The investigating Trooper said he would have shot him when he first picked up the axe. So what was the outcome of all this? The female residents although grateful did not want to go to court to testify. At the scene they did each write a statement supporting my story. When we got to the magistrates office several weeks later the ADA told me the guy was a loser w/o a job or money. They wanted to let him plead guilty to harassment for $300.00. When I protested he told me that I along with the detective agency I work for could always sue him in a civil action.

    The trooper at the magistrates court with me seemed disgusted and lectured this guy that he was lucky to be alive and that if troopers had been dealing with him he would most likely be dead.

  2. #2
    State Researcher HankT's Avatar
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    Goof with an ax....

    Very tough encounter, IDA77. Glad you made out OK. I think you done dman good.

    Great example of keeping your head under extreme pressure.

  3. #3
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    Makes me wonder when he'll do something violent again.

    Maybe the world would've been better off without him. :?

    Glad you're ok and you protected yourself and the ladies.

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    Sitting there on the wire edge of condition red; I don't envy you for the situation, but I wish I had your nerves. I'm really surprised by how long it took for the OC to get to him; I didn't know it could be delayed like that. I guess it never gets cold enough for that in my neck of the woods.

    Instead of beating yourself up for a decision that might have been wrong in a different situation, remember that you solved the problem without any loss of life. Not to mention the fact that you clearly demonstrated the power of a firearm to deter violent crime without causing physical harm. That helps all of us.

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    Good ole DA's cutting deals with the poor criminals because they are in hard times.

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    hogleg wrote:
    Good ole DA's cutting deals with the poor criminals because they are in hard times.
    Exactly. It really aggravates me to think that my life is only worth maybe $300 to the state. Oh, he was allowed to set up a payment plan too.

    As for the O/C delay I assume it was because of the extreme cold. I spray 5 or 6 people a year and have never had such a delayed responce. Also this was the only person I have had in such cold weather, outdoors. For inside use I carry pepper foam. I have used it three times at a Mc Donalds in doors, with little irritrant effect to others nearby. If all hell ever breaks loose in lovely Mt. Pocono, PA. Like it has before I keep a 16oz Fox 5.3 in my duty bag.

    Since the previous incident I have switched to a good retention holster from Safariland, a thigh rig. My holster then was a cheapie without adequate retention, I know nothing beats training but at close quarters or when working crowds I wanted greater retention. I also bought a glock22. I like the consistent trigger pull. The Ruger has a looooong pull in double action. Finally I have added a b.u.g. to my daily wear. A Taurus ultralight worn in a holster on my body armor.

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    Regular Member compmanio365's Avatar
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    I really would like getting some of that foam type OC, all I have right now is spray, and we all know what happens when you spray that into a headwind........anyone know how much they ask for and if they make kinds that you can keep in a pocket?

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    compmanio365 wrote:
    I really would like getting some of that foam type OC, all I have right now is spray, and we all know what happens when you spray that into a headwind........anyone know how much they ask for and if they make kinds that you can keep in a pocket?
    I just checked for you. Quartermaster has it in two sizes the MK-3 & MK-4. The MK-3 is smaller but the same diameter can as the larger. 67 gram vs. 117 grams. I have never seen it in a key chain size. The foam formula probably takes up more space in a can. Go to http://www.qmuniforms.com

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    IDA77 wrote:
    For inside use I carry pepper foam. I have used it three times at a Mc Donalds in doors, with little irritrant effect to others nearby.
    3 times in Mickey-D's? The food that bad?

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    Tomahawk wrote:
    IDA77 wrote:
    *For inside use I carry pepper foam. I have used it three times at a Mc Donalds in doors, with little irritrant effect to others nearby.
    3 times in Mickey-D's? The food that bad?
    I think it's that bland heh. Nothing compared to that Thai we had Tuesday night.
    -Unrequited

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    Regular Member compmanio365's Avatar
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    I think they spray pepper spray all over some of that Thai food it's that hot..... :P

    And I just ordered the catalog from that site IDA77, thanks for the link.

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    Good job, IDA.

    You handled the situation better than I think most would.

    Especially when he had the axe.

    (Though I'd not condemn you in the slightest for shooting that idiot)
    Why open carry? Because 1911 > 911.

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    woah...thats a close call, and I have to say you have balls of steel to not shoot him when he got the ax. Good to know eveything ended well, and you did not have to shoot him. I don't have any issues with shooting or possably killing a man to save a life, but it's not something I would take easy.

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    hogleg wrote:
    Good ole DA's cutting deals with the poor criminals because they are in hard times.
    I guess I'm in the wrong jurisdiction... ;-/

    -ljp

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    IdahoCorsair wrote:
    Makes me wonder when he'll do something violent again.

    Maybe the world would've been better off without him. :?
    I wonder if the ax guy is still eligible to legally purchase, own and carry a gun?

    If he is still eligible, would that be a good thing?

    Of course, if he is not eligible, some people would definitely say that it's a bad thing...that the guy should have the right to have a gun...since he's payed his debt to society and has fulfilled his punishments, whatever they were...

  17. #17
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    good chance he still can he only plead to harrassment. a summary offense. I recently started working at the county jail as a c/o and I cant believe how screwed up the system is. When a guy comes through intake we see his history and most are multiple offenders that should have been put away a long time ago.

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    When you say O.C. in here, do you mean open carry? Or something else?

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    Regular Member VAopencarry's Avatar
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    OC= Open Carry, can also mean Oleoresin Capsicum(Pepper Spray)
    CC=Concealed Carry
    OCDO= Open Carry Dot Org
    BG= Bad Guy
    LEO= Law Enforcement Officer
    IWB= Inside Waist Band
    OWB= Outside Waist Band
    SCOTUS= Supreme Court Of The United States
    NRA= National Rifle Association
    GOA= Gun Owners of America
    THR= www.TheHighRoad
    TFL=www.TheFiringLine
    AG= Attorney General
    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." - Thomas Jefferson

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    IDA77 wrote:
    compmanio365 wrote:
    I really would like getting some of that foam type OC, all I have right now is spray, and we all know what happens when you spray that into a headwind........anyone know how much they ask for and if they make kinds that you can keep in a pocket?
    I just checked for you. Quartermaster has it in two sizes the MK-3 & MK-4. The MK-3 is smaller but the same diameter can as the larger. 67 gram vs. 117 grams. I have never seen it in a key chain size. The foam formula probably takes up more space in a can. Go to http://www.qmuniforms.com
    Cheaperthandirt.com has foam flip top, or no top, good prices, high potency.


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    VAopencarry wrote:
    OC= Open Carry, can also mean Oleoresin Capsicum(Pepper Spray)
    CC=Concealed Carry
    OCDO= Open Carry Dot Org
    BG= Bad Guy
    LEO= Law Enforcement Officer
    IWB= Inside Waist Band
    OWB= Outside Waist Band
    SCOTUS= Supreme Court Of The United States
    NRA= National Rifle Association
    GOA= Gun Owners of America
    THR= http://www.TheHighRoad
    TFL=http://www.TheFiringLine
    AG= Attorney General
    You forgot:
    BUG=BackUp Gun
    RKBA=the Right to Keep and Bear Arms


    I'm sure there are others, but I can't think of them right now.

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