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Thread: the final word on the Dayton situation

  1. #1
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    As of this morning, the grand jury returned no true bill - i.e. they did not indict me! Strike a blow for freedom. I was going to post this under Ohio, but I wanted the whole world to know. I am free and clear and just need a ride to pick up my stuff. I don't even have to pay the retainer I signed off on only just this morning. Simply outstanding.

    -a very happy armed Legba

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    Got a link to a post of the original issue?

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    Long story, but no - it was deleted. The nightmare is nearly over - just need to arrange to get my stuff back.

    -ljp

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    Bravo! Congratulations.

    Either we are equal or we are not. Good people ought to be armed where they will, with wits and guns and the truth. NRA *******

  5. #5
    State Researcher dng's Avatar
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    Congratulations! Did it happen because of a good lawyer, or did people really see the light?

    Edit: btw, I now expect you to show up at OFCC Picnic in the Park 5 next year...

  6. #6
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    Well, the grand jury saw through the lameness of the original police complaint, even absent any rebuttal from my attorney. One problem remains, however. They insist that I have some hoops to jump through yet in order to get my stuff back. My stuff is not theirs to give me, particularly after being cleared of criminal charges. The police property clerk guys have threatened me with civil forfeiture, although the city attorney's office doesn't know anything about any such claim against my stuff. Absolute ********, yet still.

    It seems that I have to file some formal request for my seized property - even though they never took or supplied an inventory of seized items - that I am told will take up to 6 weeks yet to process. I am being denied myproperty without due process, which I had understood to be unconstitutional.Fool I. Kafka never imagined ******** of this order. My 2nd amendment rights remain intact at least. One victory at a time. At least I have no record. My car and gun are not the instrumentality of any other offense, so there is no theoretical justification for this beyond "we're ******* with you because we can (especially since we lost on the criminal complaint)." Outrageous.

    -ljp

  7. #7
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    Do not count on getting your stuff back until it is in your possession, especially if they are really nice guns.

    These things have a bad habit of acquiring legs and walking out of the police inventory.

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    Legba wrote:
    I am being denied myproperty without due process, which I had understood to be unconstitutional.
    Loss of property without due process is a violation of your Fifth Amenment rights. It's also a violation of your Fourth Amenment rights as it was a warrantless seizure.

    See if the attorney you were going to retain will call the prosecutor's office. I received my possessions back one day later without any REAL issue.

    Good news though. I know the weight has been lifted and it feels good. Keep at it.

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    Well nothing is simple in Dayton. The entire city is corrupt. The police property guy was very smugly going on about forfeiture, but then I called the city attorney's office, and they knew nothing about it. I still have to jump through hoops, and there is no way to expedite it. I called the attorney general's office - they only handle consumer complaints. I called the mayor's office - they don't assert jurisdiction over complaints with the police... on and on. The is no oversight or accountability, which just confirms my belief that going about armed is the one and true measure of accountability. The state won't do it for you, and god forbid you have a nicer gun than a cop...

    -ljp

  10. #10
    Regular Member Marco's Avatar
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    File charges of theft Contact the BATF and the FBI.
    even if nothing comes of it it will be in his personal file

    If you think like a Statist, act like one, or back some, you've given up on freedom and have gone over to the dark side.
    The easiest ex. but probably the most difficult to grasp for gun owners is that fool permission slip so many of you have, especially if you show it off with pride. You should recognize it as an embarrassment, an infringement, a travesty and an affront to a free person.


    ~Alan Korwin

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    Won't happen that way. The irony is that I am an FFL licensee, and ought to get special treatment from the ATF accordingly, but they refuse to get involved in local jurisdictional matters, and might evenhold it against my license status if they knew that I had been facing a felony compaint. So... I can pay a lawyer a shitload of money to file motion(s) to expedite the release of my stuff, but the motion costs as much as the value of the stuff seized, so why bother? I'll just fill out the forms through the city attorney's office and wait for an answer - maybe by Thanksgiving. No exaggeration. At least I'm no longer in jeopardy of losing my liberty and gun rights, but I still want my stuff back. The police will not profit from their crimes, not at my expense anyway. Will apprise.

    -ljp

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    How about filing a report of a stolen gun? That actually might prove very useful if the city is as corrupt as you say it is, as I wouldn't be surprised if a bullet from your gun is "found" in a body. It probably won't do much to get your property back, but you'd be CYAing against a much worse fate.

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    That actually happened to somebody I knew a couple of years ago.

    He showed up at the policestation with a court order to retrieve his guns and they said that they were missing and couldn't find them.

    Several months later he was arrested when they tracedone of hisguns to a murder.

    Charges were dropped when he was able to prove that the murder occurred after the gun went "missing" from the police storage locker.

    Of course, he was never able to recover that gun, because it was now evidence in a murder.

  14. #14
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    Well, the police are either required to return your stuff or give you the replacement value of it. I have all my titles, receipts, etc, so they won't get very far pretending that it isn't my stuff or that it was "lost." As an FFLlicensee, if I report one of my guns missing or stolen, it automatically goes on the federal registry of hot guns, and whoever has it will get no peace when they are caught with it. Ten years federal prison time with no parole, just for having it, if I recall correctly.

    -ljp

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    State Researcher HankT's Avatar
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    Legba wrote:
    Long story, but no - it was deleted. The nightmare is nearly over - just need to arrange to get my stuff back.
    Great news about the no true bill! That's gotta be a relief.

    I still can't figure out why your first thread about it was deleted. It was gun-related, rights-related, and news about a OCDO member...

    Maybe it was BobCav but IIRC he indicated he didn't delete the thread.

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    I don't care to conjecture about it at this point. Nobody ever bothered to warn me or explain that I was crossing some boundaries. I certainly had no intention of putting anyone else in any compromising position, and I don't think that I did, but it is someone else's forum, and they can run it as they like.

    I just want my property back, as my legal rights are nominally restored already. I'm sure that this episode will put me on a "delay" list when I go to buy a gun in the future, but it's better than summary denial. I can only hope that the police aren't going to be any more vindictive than they have been. I intend to avoid the place beyond my one last trip to recover my stuff if/when they do release it. Will apprise.

    -ljp

    p.s. I am registered for a concealed carry class so as to avoid this problem with transporting firearms in the future. Even being in the right doesn't keep the Man from trying to wreck your life. They nearly succeeded in my case. The luck of the draw must have put some gun rights people on my grand jury - it could have just as easily gone the other way.


  17. #17
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    Maybe if you took your gf to nice places for dinner, um, this wouldn't have happened....

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    Yeah, the irony is that we had been arguing about where to go to eat, and it a fit of exasperation, I pulled about a hundred yards off the highway to a Wendy's drive-through for greaseburgers - then ensued the shitstorm with the narcotics task force when we stopped to eat in the parking lot (the dining room was about to close). There was apparently a stakeout going on that we wandered into.

    So, yes, if it weren't for female petulance about where to go to dinner, this wouldn't have happened at all.

    (I don't really blame her). ;-/

    -ljp

  19. #19
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    Legba wrote:
    So, yes, if it weren't for female petulance about where to go to dinner, this wouldn't have happened at all.

    (I don't really blame her). ;-/


    Tarzan would....



    Hungry....eat....where?...anywhere...why there? Here?

    Hungry..van...gun in box...parking lot...cops...danger...attack....search..

    uh-oh.... ungawwa...ungawwa....

    Ahhhh--waoaoahaoahaoaoaoahoaoaooaaoaoaooaoa!!!

    Dman b*tch!

  20. #20
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    HankT wrote:
    Legba wrote:
    Long story, but no - it was deleted. The nightmare is nearly over - just need to arrange to get my stuff back.
    Great news about the no true bill! That's gotta be a relief.

    I still can't figure out why your first thread about it was deleted. It was gun-related, rights-related, and news about a OCDO member...

    Maybe it was BobCav but IIRC he indicated he didn't delete the thread.
    No one was at fault or crossed any boundaries. We had a SQL table get corrupted and lost a few threads.



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    Thank you for a response. I had to wonder what was up. Probably just as well that the Dayton police didn't see the thread and send death squads after me for it - I exaggerate only slightly. They absolutely HATE me, especially after this bogus case got tossed. I still have to file a motion with the city attorney's office to recover my stuff at this rate.

    -ljp

  22. #22
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    Legba wrote:
    Thank you for a response. I had to wonder what was up. Probably just as well that the Dayton police didn't see the thread and send death squads after me for it - I exaggerate only slightly. They absolutely HATE me, especially after this bogus case got tossed. I still have to file a motion with the city attorney's office to recover my stuff at this rate.

    -ljp
    No problem.

    There were a few other threads that were lost and people were asking what they had done to have their threads deleted.

    It all was caused by the b*stard who was spamming the board with cell phone ads.

    While deleting his threads and him as a user, the threads table became corrupted. I rebuilt it and hoped for no lost data, but a few were lost.

  23. #23
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    Switch to Oracle

  24. #24
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    Unless you are extremely attached to that city, MOVE. If what happened to my brother is any indication of how police are everywhere, you are not safe staying there once your local cops decide they don't like you.

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