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Thread: when can you reload?

  1. #1
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    It seems that when a encounter with a leo results in a disarmament, it is often "given back" unloaded and perhaps disassembled, with orders to "wait until I’m out of sight before you reload" Of course, this statement is asinine. But is it a order you have to follow? If you’re given your gun back, I’m thinking the encounter is over. Particularly if you ask "Am I free to go?" And get an affirmative answer. Can your loading the gun in a public place be any more dangerous then the leo unloading it in the same place? For that matter; with my 1911 in a Blackhawk CQC, I can drop the gun in (click), insert the magazine, rack the slide, engage the safety, and be ready to continue on my way. Or did I just justify being proned again? I know it’s not legal advice, but what do you all think?

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    ijusam wrote:

    It seems that when a encounter with a leo results in a disarmament, it is often "given back" unloaded and perhaps disassembled, with orders to "wait until I’m out of sight before you reload" Of course, this statement is asinine. But is it a order you have to follow? If you’re given your gun back, I’m thinking the encounter is over. Particularly if you ask "Am I free to go?" And get an affirmative answer. Can your loading the gun in a public place be any more dangerous then the leo unloading it in the same place? For that matter; with my 1911 in a Blackhawk CQC, I can drop the gun in (click), insert the magazine, rack the slide, engage the safety, and be ready to continue on my way. Or did I just justify being proned again? I know it’s not legal advice, but what do you all think?
    How did the encounter originate? Was it for a legite reason? meaning, were you violating a law in Delaware? IMO, if a LEO orders you to disarm; DISARM. Always better to argue the point later. If you ask the LEO "Am I free to go?" (they says yes)then the encounter is over. Load and carry the weapon as the law provides. Are you competent in handling your own firearm? Just because someone is a LEO doesn't make them more capable of handling a firearm better than you.Is the LEO familiar with your particular firearm? Who's to say? IMO, I never want to disarm, but when dealing with a LEO you never know what interpretationof the law you are going to get.



    just my .02

  3. #3
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    kerchaulk wrote:
    How did the encounter originate? Was it for a legite reason? meaning, were you violating a law in Delaware? IMO, if a LEO orders you to disarm; DISARM. Always better to argue the point later. If you ask the LEO "Am I free to go?" (they says yes)then the encounter is over. Load and carry the weapon as the law provides. Are you competent in handling your own firearm? Just because someone is a LEO doesn't make them more capable of handling a firearm better than you.Is the LEO familiar with your particular firearm? Who's to say? IMO, I never want to disarm, but when dealing with a LEO you never know what interpretationof the law you are going to get.
    Delaware doesn't really have any restrictions on where you can carry -- just Federal Buildings and in the state's slot casinos. He's asking that, after an encounter where someone has been disarmed, the police return your firearm unloaded and say, "Wait until I leave before you reload." How much weight does that have? Can you simply do it right there in their presence despite their 'request' or is it an order?

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    Interesting question... I personally wouldn't because you don't want to get hit with a brandishing charge to fight after the stop. > )
    -Unrequited

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    Interesting response, 'because you might..." The road to hell is paved with what-ifs.



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    ijusam wrote:

    It seems that when a encounter with a leo results in a disarmament, it is often "given back" unloaded and perhaps disassembled, with orders to "wait until I’m out of sight before you reload" Of course, this statement is asinine. But is it a order you have to follow? If you’re given your gun back, I’m thinking the encounter is over. Particularly if you ask "Am I free to go?" And get an affirmative answer. Can your loading the gun in a public place be any more dangerous then the leo unloading it in the same place? For that matter; with my 1911 in a Blackhawk CQC, I can drop the gun in (click), insert the magazine, rack the slide, engage the safety, and be ready to continue on my way. Or did I just justify being proned again? I know it’s not legal advice, but what do you all think?
    The officer has disarmed you, removing your ability to defend yourself. While the officer is in your presence he could, though he is under no obligation, protect you. If he orders you not to reload in his presence, he is ordering you to be vulnerable and defenceless for a period of time.

    Is the police motto to Serve and Protect, or is it to Violate and Make Vulnerable?

    I would (with my handy Sony recording every word) ask the officer: Under what authority are you ordering me to remain unarmed and vulnerable?

    Handling the firearm in the presence of the police could end much worse than a citation or arrest. You might take a dirt nap.


    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitableand let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come . PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

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    Good question, I've been pondering the same thing after reading the many posts on here where that has been done. Fortunately I've never been in that situation. I would say that you would have every right to load and holster the minute he hands it back to you, in fact I could see someone getting the mag back in and racking it before the officer could get his words out. Problem is, from the LEO point of view, he just potentially pissed off a guy that now has a loaded gun IN HIS HANDS. If the LEO's gun is still in his holster, then he would have no chance of drawing if you decided to shoot him. I can't blame the LEO for making that request (order).

    I would say that you are under no legal obligation to wait until he leaves. I would also say, however, that it is an acceptable courtesy allow a comfortable distance between yourself and the LEO before handling the firearm. I would follow his request not for fear of his reaction, but in understanding that he is indeed afraid of you holding a gun.

    This goes back to the whole thing with people in authoritative positions. They are tasked with upholding and enforcing THE LAW. There is no greaterdirect authority than that. They HAVE to be confident in order to accomplish this, and having a firearm on their side helps most with this confidence. When they encounter another person who is equally armed, many lose that confidence because they are no longer any more powerful than you are. This doesn't excuse rude or unlawful behavior, but it helps to explain what they're thinking.

    If they need to be out of sight before you re-load, just smile and accept the fact that they have, while perhaps reluctantly, recognized that you are an equal. Oh, and if a LEO does ever hand you your sidearm back and doesn't bat an eyelash as you re-load and holster, commend him for his confidence and maturity (unless he's a jerk, lol).

  8. #8
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    kerchaulk wrote:
    How did the encounter originate? Was it for a legite reason? meaning, were you violating a law in Delaware? IMO, if a LEO orders you to disarm; DISARM. Always better to argue the point later. If you ask the LEO "Am I free to go?" (they says yes)then the encounter is over. Load and carry the weapon as the law provides. Are you competent in handling your own firearm? Just because someone is a LEO doesn't make them more capable of handling a firearm better than you.Is the LEO familiar with your particular firearm? Who's to say? IMO, I never want to disarm, but when dealing with a LEO you never know what interpretationof the law you are going to get.

    This question is based on my observations on this site. I have been open carrying since May and have not had any encounters with leos. in answer to ypur questions

    How did the encounter originate? Was it for a legite reason? meaning, were you violating a law in Delaware?I don't think it matters in this senerio how the encounter happened, the leo is given your gun back so the encounter is ending well, or at least without an arrest.

    Load and carry the weapon as the law provides. as with open carry there isn't (in delaware) a law that tells you when you can load your weapon



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    unrequited wrote:
    Interesting question... I personally wouldn't because you don't want to get hit with a brandishing charge to fight after the stop. > )
    Delaware doesn't have a brandishing law. but this is a good point for other states. but that was what I was addressing with my observations that I could reload while holstered with a serpa CQC. ie. guns not waved around and muzzle control is observed.

    edited to add: not that anyone waves their gun around and disregards muzzle control while reloading

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