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Thread: New guy from Lower Alabama

  1. #1
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    Hi neighbors. I joined up toOpen Carry just a few days ago and have been tyring to read up on as many past threads as time allows, particularly things that have to do with the great state of Alabama. I`m 56 yrs. old and proud to have been born and raised here in Mobile.I`m just asupset as most of you guysare that our laws pertaining to the right to carry are so messed up and hard to understand. I have had an Alabama concealed carry permit for over 30 yrs. but can not tell you how badly I would love to be able to open carry without the fear of going to jail and or being fined.Is there anything going on that might brighten my outlook on things. No one has posted anything since Hungsquirrel`s trip to Taco Bell. You did good Hung, have you OCed anywhere else since then? And what is the lastestnews on VMathis and the Wal-Mart deal? Ya`ll let me know whats going on and if there is anything new in the works that will let us excersize what should be our right to poen carry. Thanks and hope to be takling with ya`ll. Karl.

  2. #2
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    Welcome to OCDO sir. It isa pleasure to meet you. As I assume you have read up on, my situation with Wal Mart has pretty much been resolved. The only update that I think I have failed to include in the thread is that Wal Mart officially withdrew their "ban" on me and I got a letter from the manager of the Andalusia store saying in effect "we're doing this so you don't sue us, but if you come back with a gun openly displayed, we'll arrest you again."

  3. #3
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    Thanks for the welcome Victor. Glad all is well with that. Will things ever change in Alabama?

  4. #4
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    I fear that our cause will not really gain any ground until we can convince a lot of other people to participate with us. The truth is, LEOs and civilians alike, believe that it is illegal. Hell I thought it was illegal until I found this site. Really, one of us with enough money needs to get arrested and take it to the Alabama supreme court. That's the only thing I think will help us. Unfortunately, I don't have that kind of money, so.... We'll just have to wait and deal with it. Glad to know that I have another NATIVE Alabamian here too though. I was born and raised in Opp Alabama (in Covington County), and only recently moved up to Troy for college.I am a pre-law student, so perhaps one day, I will be able to use my professional position to help make a difference.

  5. #5
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    Sounds good, glad to know you also, be talking at ya.

  6. #6
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    vmathis12019 wrote:
    I fear that our cause will not really gain any ground until we can convince a lot of other people to participate with us. The truth is, LEOs and civilians alike, believe that it is illegal. Hell I thought it was illegal until I found this site.
    Yes, indeedy, awareness is a big problem.Not only in Alabama butin the rest of the country as well.

    That's why a solution to increase awareness of legal and responsible OC that was proposed by a member here is such a good idea. Take a look at the thread:

    Let's have a national OC day!!!

    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum4/6016.html

    Increasing awarness should be one of the key strategic programs in the open carry community. A National OC Day would do that quite nicely.

    Welcome to OCDO, flounder22!



  7. #7
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    Thanks for the welcome Hank. I`ll be looking in everyday to see what is going on.

  8. #8
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    Flounder,
    No, I have not OCed since then except while driving. I think before I take my OC crusade any further, I will start by writing Sheriff Cochran as well as the MPD police chief explaining the complete legality of OC and see how they respond. What do yall think?

    On a lighter note, I had two very positive LEO encounters in my store regarding concealed carry. I am feeling a bit lazy at the moment, so here is a cut/paste from my post on The High Road:

    I had a customer sell me merchandise, and when doing so I am required to ask for a photo ID in case the merchandise turns out to have been stolen. The customer handed me his sheriff's department photo ID. I commented that it looked very similar to my pistol permit (as permits are issued by the sheriff here). He asked me what I carried, and I described the pistols I generally carry. I then complained that my corporate massah's don't let me carry at work. He said as long as it's concealed, they can't do anything. I corrected him and told him about the following Alabama statute:

    Quote: Section 13A-11-52

    Except as otherwise provided in this article, no person shall carry a pistol about his person on premises not his own or under his control.

    He then said he wouldn't dream of charging someone for violating that section. I was amazed that an officer would openly admit not wanting to enforce a law, particularly one related to firearms! He then told me he was glad I carry, and wished "all" law-abiding citizens would do so!

    As if that weren't enough, a uniformed officer came in later in the afternoon and commented about "robbery season" (the Christmas holidays). There have been a string of burglaries in the area, including a holdup at a convenience store where the perp used a shotgun (so much for the notion that banning handguns will stop crime). I again complained that I am not allowed to carry at work. The officer then told me he has a part time job and his other employer doesn't permit carry; he carries anyway, and doesn't care what the law has to say on the matter. I told him about the Law Enforcement Officers Safety Act of 2004, and he had no idea LEOs are given more carry leeway nationwide now. He also said that while being a LEO is dangerous work, there's no way in hell he would work a retail job during the holidays, when burglaries are rampant and no one is allowed to carry while at work.

    In summary, two pleasant RKBA encounters with LEOs insofar as their attitudes toward carry. Two LEOs willing to bend or break unjust laws to protect themselves. Also, two LEOs who knew very little about firearm law to begin with!

  9. #9
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    HungSquirrel wrote:
    He said as long as it's concealed, they can't do anything. I corrected him and told him about the following
    Alabama statute:
    The LEO is wrong....they can fire you from your job and tell you not to return to their property
    Quote: Section 13A-11-52
    52 does not apply if you have a valid Alabama Pistol License....."Except as otherwise provided"....73 "provides otherwise"
    Except as otherwise provided in this article, no person shall carry a pistol about his person on premises not his own or under his control.

    He then said he wouldn't dream of charging someone for violating that section. I was amazed ......
    Of course not, it wouldn't be that section that you would be charged with...if you have a PL....see above. If your employer "tresspassed" you, the LEO would have no choice wheather to charge you.

    Also, two LEOs who knew very little about firearm law to begin with!
    Good observation....you may want to study the laws a bit more and pay little to no attention to LEO opinions as to what the laws are...some will tell you X is illegal when it isn't, others will make it up as they go....just my observation.
    There are a few cases in some of the other Alabama threads that may help you "enlighten" your local LEOs if you decide to write them.....good luck

  10. #10
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    Hungsquirrel, did you write Sheriff Cochran yet? I`ed very much like to know what he had to say. Let me know what your letter contained and how he responded,I might send him one also. We got get more people on board concering OC here in Alabama or at least here in Mobile Co., but I don`t quite know how to do it without getting into trouble. Maybe one of those letters to the editor type thing that you see in the news paper.

  11. #11
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    I haven't written the Sheriff yet. I have two papers to write by Saturday evening...in Spanish. I think I'll save the letter-writing for when I have a bit of free time. I also want to collaborate with others before sending it to make sure it is polite and to the point.

  12. #12
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    Good deal. Please keep me posted.

  13. #13
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    Speaking for one that has CC'd for 20+ years, I have never been offended or concerned about open carry. Of course, I carry a weapon every day so my comfort may be slightly skewed. I also think that our greatest ally is education of the non carrying public.

    John

  14. #14
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    Has anyone written to the MOPD or the Mobile County Sherriff yet?

    I have contacted a couple of friends in law enforcement here in the Mobile area, (one is a US Navy MA who is also an officer on Dauphin Island), and asked their opinion and where I can go for further info.

  15. #15
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    I know ththread is fairly old and I am new to the forum, so what kind of problems y'all having over there

    I'm listed as Moss Point, but closer to Grand Bay, so I will be 'OC'ing in AL quite a bit.

    On a side note, Flounder22, are you a member of MBKFA? I've seen that username somewhere and think that is where. If so, I go by Kayak Jack on that forum.

  16. #16
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    I haven't been able to get BEANS from anyone at Cochran's office on this yet! I have had a couple of long 'back & forth' email sessions with LEOs from other agencies, though. In every case the outcome was the same, when I trotted out the actual legal text and statements from our norther county neighbors I get nothing but silence in return. Strange, that...

  17. #17
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    Even Mobile Police Department pretended to reply to my letter. Not word one from Cochran or his MCSO cronies.

  18. #18
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    OC legal in Mobile, AL according to Sheriff Cochran

    Yesterday was a good day for Open Carry in Mobile. I was driving down the road, then turned on the radio to FM Talk, and Sheriff Cochran of Mobile County Alabama was on the radio. I called the radio show and was the first caller patched through. I asked the Sheriff's opinion on open carry of firearms and expressed that many law enforcement officers either don't know or don't like it. Live on the air he responded that it is in fact legal to open carry in the state of Alabama, and that all of his deputies were aware of that fact. He went on to say that he does not recommend it because concerned citizens may call the law on you... And you must have a CCWP to take your pistol in your vehicle. I have read in another post that Cochran did not allow open carry, so it was good to hear it straight from the horse's mouth that he knows OC is perfectly legal.

  19. #19
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    Good job.

    If a PD decides that they must respond to all MWAG calls, more power to them.

    Respond, yes.
    Stop, NO.

    Unless the OCer is doing something other than going about normal lawful business while carrying that would present RAS of a crime, he should NEVER be stopped. Working that precise issue with the Montgomery PD right now.

  20. #20
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    911 operators & dispatchers need training

    It is the 911 operators and dispatchers that could use some training. Someone calls to say, "There is a man with a gun." Response should be... "Is he hurting anything, threatening anyone, or waving it around?" If not, proceed to, "OC is legal here. If there is a problem, we would be happy to send someone, otherwise, have a nice day."

    The cops used to get called for things like "Blacks in a restaurant" but we all know there is no crime there.

  21. #21
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    In talking to City Investigators (Montgomery equivalent of IAD), the investigator related that the 911 operators likely did not know that OC is lawful. I pointed out that part of the fix would be for all 911 operators to be trained in lawful OC, and some questions to ask to determine if officers need to be dispatched. Here is a sample convo.

    Operator: 911, what is your emergency?
    Caller: There is a man with a gun in Target.
    O: Is the gun in its holster?
    C: Yes, but I am scared. He is not allowed to do that.
    O: It is possible that he is allowed to carry. Is he handling the gun?
    C: No.
    O: Is he threatening or being argumentative with anyone?
    C: No.
    O: Is he doing anything else that leads you to believe that he will use the gun.
    C: Well, just that he has it with him.
    O: Open carry of a firearm in Alabama is lawful. We can send an officer for a look-see, but unless the man is doing something illegal or threatening, the officer won't even stop him and talk to him. Do you still need us to take an officer off patrol to take a look?
    C: Well, I guess not.

    --or--

    C: Yes, this man needs to be stopped.
    O: OK, there is an officer on the way. However, if the man is simply carrying a properly holstered firearm, we will not stop, detain, question, or arrest him. He will be allowed to go about his business. Should the officer contact you at the scene? ...

  22. #22
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    Thumbs up

    Yes! Please! Sign me up! How can i make that part of my reality?!?
    It takes a village to raise an idiot.

  23. #23
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    Talk to your local 911 folks. I talked to the guy who heads up the communication department in Montgomery. He agrees that 911 operators need a script to deal with MWAG calls that could eliminate responding to calls on law-abiding OCers. He is going to meet with the city attorney, the police, and his staff to study the issue. He'll get back with me in a few days.

  24. #24
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    911 call

    "Yes ma'am, he is legally allowed to carry a firearm openly. Do you really want me to dispatch an officer off patrol? The closest unit will take 10 minutes to get there, 20 minutes to investigate the situation, another 10 minutes to fill out a report, then 10 more minutes to get back to real crime prevention. Add the fuel cost and maintenance of the cruiser, the cost to taxpayers is going to be $139 to check out a law abiding citizen. Does that sound like a good use of our resources to you?"

  25. #25
    Regular Member FedFirefighter's Avatar
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    Mobile ?

    Can anyone from the Mobile area let me know what the OC climate is like there, and how is the MPD about handling it? My wife will be in Mobile area for a year, starting in Jan. I will be down there frequently and would like to OC as comfortably as I do around the Wiregrass area. We were down yesterday to check out the town, and saw cops everywhere. I was CC'ing then until I feel it out or get some feedback. Thanks.

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