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Gun Control: It's not just for colored folks anymore

AbNo

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Cliff Notes version of this story: Final English 111 paper: Gun control, it's roots (post Civil War racism), and it's modern effects and implications on today's society.

A bit of branching out will occur as well, pointing to crime statistics (The Disaster Center has some well-compiled crime stats on their loosely organized page) versus Brady

I fully plan to post this here when I am done, as well.

If anyone has any interesting links they've already pulled up, or other information (I'll probably cover South vs. Maryland's implications while I'm at it), do feel free to share them.

My work is typically a dry read, but I can be rather informative at times. :)

It should be noted I commonly refer to this class as "Left Wing Studies 101". I'll give the professor enough credit to say that she's honest about it, however.

If nothing else, maybe this will spark some discussion.

Kind of like my Rant that died out over Thanksgiving. :D
 

Deanimator

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It never hurts to rub the noses of gun grabbers in the racist roots of gun control. Sometimes you can even get them to say their own racist things in favor of gun control. Strangely, they never seem to think that you'll remember, write down or save what they say to hard disk... ;)
 

unrequited

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However it started in this country, unfortunately gun control is equal opportunity now, and I think it should be addressed as such. Coloring the debate of gun control with racial undertones I think only serve to reduce our credibility in effecting future change.
 

Jersey Ron

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I think that's exactly what the original poster is saying. Hence the title:
"Gun Control: It's not just for colored folks anymore"

The link given just gives a historical view of how "laws" were passed to keep guns out of the hands from Afro-Americans back in the day. And now "they" are trying to pass more "laws" to keep EVERYONE from obtaining guns. I don't see a credibility problem anywhere by telling the truth.





Jersey

PS - And for the record the laws presented in the link would have applied DIRECTLY to me.


 

Deanimator

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unrequited wrote:
However it started in this country, unfortunately gun control is equal opportunity now, and I think it should be addressed as such. Coloring the debate of gun control with racial undertones I think only serve to reduce our credibility in effecting future change.

You'd be surprised. I've got a friend who used to be a criminal defense attorney in Chicago. He said that the ONLY White people he ever saw in "gun court" were the judges, bailiffs and testifying police.

Whites stopped by police in Chicago found to be carrying concealed weapons were released and got their guns back if they weren't otherwise breaking the law.

Blacks were arrested, indicted and tried.
 

openryan

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Deanimator wrote:
unrequited wrote:
However it started in this country, unfortunately gun control is equal opportunity now, and I think it should be addressed as such. Coloring the debate of gun control with racial undertones I think only serve to reduce our credibility in effecting future change.

You'd be surprised. I've got a friend who used to be a criminal defense attorney in Chicago. He said that the ONLY White people he ever saw in "gun court" were the judges, bailiffs and testifying police.

Whites stopped by police in Chicago found to be carrying concealed weapons were released and got their guns back if they weren't otherwise breaking the law.

Blacks were arrested, indicted and tried.
What?

Now these "Whites" that were set free and got their guns back... were they Chicago residents? Illinois residents? Out of state?

Further more, I want to know how the concealed weapons were found on them if they "weren't otherwise breaking the law", they must have been printing, or else they couldn't have been stopped unless they "were otherwise breaking the law"...

Also, how long ago was this, I couldn't believe it was recent, if it is, I will be shocked.
 

AbNo

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Hmm, I seem to recall working on cross-referencing Brady Bunch grades to per-capita crime levels a while back with Kendo.

I wonder if I still have that work in progress...

Can anyone think of some typically spouted reasons why people choose to go unarmed?

You know "The police will protect me", and such nonsense.

I plan to counter THAT with the South vs. Maryland case, and, with great hesitation, that Chicago cop caught on camera murdering someone on a subway. Probably not, actually. That's too much of a divergence. I will probably stick with typical police response times, and am considering having someone with an airsoft pistol come by while I'm doing this.
 

Tess

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AbNo wrote:
Hmm, I seem to recall working on cross-referencing Brady Bunch grades to per-capita crime levels a while back with Kendo.

I wonder if I still have that work in progress...

Can anyone think of some typically spouted reasons why people choose to go unarmed?

You know "The police will protect me", and such nonsense.

I plan to counter THAT with the South vs. Maryland case, and, with great hesitation, that Chicago cop caught on camera murdering someone on a subway. Probably not, actually. That's too much of a divergence. I will probably stick with typical police response times, and am considering having someone with an airsoft pistol come by while I'm doing this.
Actually, I had a nice conversation with my mechanic a couple of months ago. He didn't notice my sidearm until we'd been talking nearly 15 minutes, then it became a topic of conversation.

He said he could never bear to shoot, even in defense of his life. Or that of his children.

Much as I disagree with him, I have to respect that he's thought it through and made a decision. Very different from MOST who choose to go unarmed, I think.
 

Deanimator

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openryan wrote:
Deanimator wrote:
unrequited wrote:
However it started in this country, unfortunately gun control is equal opportunity now, and I think it should be addressed as such. Coloring the debate of gun control with racial undertones I think only serve to reduce our credibility in effecting future change.

You'd be surprised. I've got a friend who used to be a criminal defense attorney in Chicago. He said that the ONLY White people he ever saw in "gun court" were the judges, bailiffs and testifying police.

Whites stopped by police in Chicago found to be carrying concealed weapons were released and got their guns back if they weren't otherwise breaking the law.

Blacks were arrested, indicted and tried.
What?

Now these "Whites" that were set free and got their guns back... were they Chicago residents? Illinois residents? Out of state?

Further more, I want to know how the concealed weapons were found on them if they "weren't otherwise breaking the law", they must have been printing, or else they couldn't have been stopped unless they "were otherwise breaking the law"...

Also, how long ago was this, I couldn't believe it was recent, if it is, I will be shocked.
Chicago residents, stopped for things like traffic infractions.

7 or so years ago.

Officers on http://secondcitycop.blogspot.com have mentioned letting people go.

Of course too, Chicago is the most racist city in the United States.
 

openryan

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I am having a bit of trouble finding what you mentioned on that site, have a direct link by chance?

Is chicago being the most racist city an assumption by you? I don't know how you could statistically support that, I would think it was NY, but even I am guessing...
 

MetalChris

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openryan wrote:
I am having a bit of trouble finding what you mentioned on that site, have a direct link by chance?

Is chicago being the most racist city an assumption by you? I don't know how you could statistically support that, I would think it was NY, but even I am guessing...
Hmm...I thought Jena was the most racist city in the history of the world.

:p :p
 

unrequited

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USAF_MetalChris wrote:
openryan wrote:
I am having a bit of trouble finding what you mentioned on that site, have a direct link by chance?

Is chicago being the most racist city an assumption by you?  I don't know how you could statistically support that, I would think it was NY, but even I am guessing...
Hmm...I thought Jena was the most racist city in the history of the world.

:p :p
That's a biiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiig can of worms I'd love to go more into depth... not in this thread though. I think there's another one open. Basically though, the whole town should be razed... both sides.
 

imperialism2024

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AbNo wrote:
Hmm, I seem to recall working on cross-referencing Brady Bunch grades to per-capita crime levels a while back with Kendo.

I wonder if I still have that work in progress...

Can anyone think of some typically spouted reasons why people choose to go unarmed?

You know "The police will protect me", and such nonsense.

I plan to counter THAT with the South vs. Maryland case, and, with great hesitation, that Chicago cop caught on camera murdering someone on a subway. Probably not, actually. That's too much of a divergence. I will probably stick with typical police response times, and am considering having someone with an airsoft pistol come by while I'm doing this.
How about "violence begets violence... if I have a gun, other people will just become more violent."

Or "I'll just give them whatever they want"

Or "I stay out of the 'bad parts' of town, so I don't need it"

Or "I've never needed a gun before, so why would I need one in the future?"

Or my father's reason, "I fear that I wouldn't have enough self-restraint to use good judgement when I get angry at someone, and might end up shooting them." [Even though that would probably be legal in Texas]

Interesting, though, as I'm currently working on a paper about how gun control more severely impacts racial and ethnic minorities.
 

AbNo

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"violence begets violence... if I have a gun, other people will just become more violent."

If this were true, violence would be rampant in police stations, were a majority of the people working there are armed.

Including a reminder that people calling the cops are doing just that, calling in potentially violent backup. ;)

"I'll just give them whatever they want" - Plenty of cases of people being killed after giving in to robbery demands.

"I stay out of the 'bad parts' of town, so I don't need it"
Plenty of cases of someone leaving the bad part of town to go mess with the locals. Also, a lot of municipal buildings seem to be in bad areas.

"I've never needed a gun before, so why would I need one in the future?"

Seatbelt/Insurance argument. :D

Or my father's reason, "I fear that I wouldn't have enough self-restraint to use good judgement when I get angry at someone, and might end up shooting them." [Even though that would probably be legal in Texas]

Which is why carrying shouldn't be mandated. Well, that's not WHY it shouldn't be mandated, but....

Thank you for those, Imp!
 

imperialism2024

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AbNo wrote:
"violence begets violence... if I have a gun, other people will just become more violent."

If this were true, violence would be rampant in police stations, were a majority of the people working there are armed.

Including a reminder that people calling the cops are doing just that, calling in potentially violent backup. ;)

But the police are an elite group of people. Only they can be trusted with guns. They never misuse their power, either.

"I'll just give them whatever they want" - Plenty of cases of people being killed after giving in to robbery demands.

Well, a few times someone tried to resist and were killed, so obviously you should just give in.

"I stay out of the 'bad parts' of town, so I don't need it"
Plenty of cases of someone leaving the bad part of town to go mess with the locals. Also, a lot of municipal buildings seem to be in bad areas.

The bad people won't attack me because I'm a good person. And, if I have to go to a municipal building, the fact that it is a government building means that no one will have evil guns there.

"I've never needed a gun before, so why would I need one in the future?"

Seatbelt/Insurance argument. :D

Well, seatbelts and insurance make us safe. Guns only kill people.

Or my father's reason, "I fear that I wouldn't have enough self-restraint to use good judgement when I get angry at someone, and might end up shooting them." [Even though that would probably be legal in Texas]

Which is why carrying shouldn't be mandated. Well, that's not WHY it shouldn't be mandated, but....

Thank you for those, Imp!
I need to go throw up now...

:lol:
 

Deanimator

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openryan wrote:
I am having a bit of trouble finding what you mentioned on that site, have a direct link by chance?

Is chicago being the most racist city an assumption by you? I don't know how you could statistically support that, I would think it was NY, but even I am guessing...

You'll have to search through it. Of course if you do, you'll find a LOT of interesting things on a variety of subjects.

I grew up in Chicago. I've never been ANYWHERE in the WORLD that could hold a candle to Chicago for racism, and not just Whites against Blacks. Whites hate Blacks; Blacks hate Jews; Mexicans hate Puerto Ricans, etc., etc., etc.

Any town that attracts neo-Nazi leader Frank Collin AND Louis Farrakhan has to have a "special" quality.
 

AbNo

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Early draft. I'm literally in the middle of working on it, and Kendo's helping.

We're actually having a good time with this, though I'm kind of scaring myself (you'll know when you get to it).

Gun Control: It's not just for Colored People Anymore

A recurring theme in modern politics is the issue of whether the common citizen is entitled to the right to own and carry arms. Typically, this argument is considered “Gun Control versus Gun Rights.”

--Southern Racism, post Civ War.

--The subject of interpretation of the Second Amendment (Quote 2A) has been a constant There are some that would argue the right of one to self defense is a bit outdated, and should be repealed in a puff of obsolescence.

Indeed, using the same logic, one could argue for voiding the Third Amendment, and, in keeping with the current trend of Imminent Domain, allowing for members of the military and national guard the use of people's homes for an indeterminate period. This would have the secondary benefit of keeping citizens safe from crime, as armed soldiers would be living in the homes of the American people.

The Fourth Amendment is another troublesome problem that could be done away with as we continue our modernization of the Bill of Rights. Allowing for unreasonable search and seizure by government officials, including local, state, and federal police agencies would ensure that persons harboring now-illegal weapons would be unable to hide them. The benefits of public safety would reach until new levels.

The Fifth Amendment can be disposed of as well, for similar reasons to the Fourth. Allowing people to get away with not admitting to having dangerous items in the midst of an official investigation, and subsequent trial allows an unverified number of potentially dangerous people the ability to escape prosecution at the hands of what can only be considered a just and fair trial.

With the danger of guns gone, the only crime that will be committed will be gun crimes, and if a an officer of the law says you have a dangerous firearm of any type, it should be prima facia evidence of your guilt, thus negating the need for a trial, your rights as an accused person, or the need for a trial by a jury of your peers. Indeed, with these reasons pointing out the glaringly superannuated nature of the Sixth and Seventh Amendments, excessive bail would not be an issue, as most, if not all crime will have stopped at this point. With this in mind, one can safely write off the Eighth Amendment as no longer needed.

Unfortunately, at this point, there may become a problem wherein people may insist they have the right to other kinds of dangerous ideas or items, possibly even weapons. For these reasons, the Ninth Amendment will most likely have to be stricken from the books, to ensure continued safety of the populace. With the Tenth Amendment being so closely tied to the Ninth, it only makes logical sense to remove any record of state or individual rights as well, lest there be any dangerous forms of dissent among citizen-subjects.

The First Amendment provides certain problems as well, but, being that it was written into the Bill of Rights prior to any other, it should only be subject to review, and possible revision, for public safety. Hate speech, conspiracy to commit a crime, or instruction in the commission of a crime can be very dangerous. The exact limits of the freedom of speech should be clearly defined, to ensure a proper level of freedom that does not go too far.



'Now that gun crimes are completely impossible'
"Don't believe the lie that guns are the great equalizer. A 120 lb. woman should be fully capable of fighting off a 220 lb. man"

-- The author of the paper was Eric Harris, one of the now-deceased infamous duo that was responsible for putting gun violence in schools in the public forefront.

--The point is, one does not know who is buying guns, particularly during illegal gun sales. With this in mind, it makes perfect sense to pass a law

AC
Pepper Spray – 20+ seconds to start
Call the cops – 45 minutes to Indian American Cafe
Cops – No duty to protect
Gun bans – Machinegun in Britain, cops are scared, stabbings WAY up, Australian Screwdriver stabbings, DC, Chicago, LA, NYC
Guns cause crime – Gun shows, police stations
Fewer guns, more safety – Unarmed victim zones
Gun nuts – Dali Lama and Ghandi

Talking Points
McCarthy – Barrel Shroud – Truly, these safety devices, which keep people from burning their hands on hot metal are a threat. Representative McCarthy is truly a Renaissance Woman, in touch with how to keep her constituents safe, even if they do not have any fingerprints from hot metal.
-Tucker Carlson: In February you introduced the Assault Weapons Ban and Law Enforcement Protection Act of 2007; it would regulate semi-automatic assault weapons, including weapons that have pistol grips, a forward grip, and something called a barrel shroud. Weapons with a barrel shroud would be regulated. What's a barrel shroud, and why should we regulate it?
-Carolyn McCarthy: I think, I think the more important thing is that it also would have had banned the large capacity clips that Colin Ferguson had used, and also, uh, the killer, but when we're talking about--
-Carlson [overlapping]: Right...but I...oh, okay...but I, I read--I read the legislation--I, I'm sorry--I read the legislation and it said that it would regulate barrel shrouds. What's a barrel shroud, and why we should regulate that?
-McCarthy: The guns that were chosen back in uh, in those days were basically the guns that most gangs and criminals were using to kill our, our police officers. I'm not saying it was the best bill, but that was the best bill the we could get out at that particular time.
-Carlson: Okay, do you know what a barrel shroud is?
-McCarthy: I actually don't know what a barrel shroud is--
-Carlson: --Oh, okay, 'cause it's in your legislation--
-McCarthy: --I believe it's a shoulder thing that goes up.
-Carlson: No, it's not.


-- Find the shroud off the 995


Guns vs. Other death causes
V tech report's conflicting views
Racist beginnings
Brady vs Crime Rates

PC
DoJ RKBA is an individual right
Reported defensive uses yearly

I doubt I'll cover everything here, but I figured having more ready is better than not having enough. :D

I'll be back in a bit. Feel free to offer suggestions!

Edit: After commenting that I felt ill after having read my own dismantling of the Bill of Rights....

[user]Kendo_Bunny[/user]
How do you think George Orwell felt?
 
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