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Thread: OC at IU-A THREAT??

  1. #1
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    I went to visit a friend of mine in Bloomington for his Birthday. I thought I would be interesting to OC in Bloomington since it is a college town. My friend lives in the varsity courts apartment complex, right next to IU. Me and my friend went to get some redbull for later that night. I OCed into the gas station, I didnt even really get a second look. That was the only stop we made. We went back to his apartment and he wanted to introduce me to some friends he made this semester. I went to CC instead of OC. My friend told me that would be cool with OCing in there apartment because he had told them about me OCing. We went over to the apartment, there was 3 guys sitting down playing video games. Call of Duty 4 Good game. But anywayI said hello and shock everyones hands, but i noticed the last guy was in the military because he had on a ARMY tee on and had his dog tags out. This is how the conversation went.

    Army guy: Why are you carrying a gun

    Me: For Safety.

    Army Guy: You cantcarry a gun out like that.

    Me: Yes i can. In Indiana you get an LTC not a CCW

    Army: Nothing is going to happen on a college campus.

    Me: Maybe but i would rather be safe than sorry.

    Army guy: Well I think thats fuckin gay.

    Me: No reason to get hostel, but whatis your problem with it anyway, I have a permit to carry, i have every legal right to carry a gun.

    Army guy: Well i think you are a threat.

    Me: A threat(with a laugh)

    Army guy: Yea a fuckin threat

    Me: are you sure your not made because I am carrying a gun and you are not.

    Army guy: (pulls out an Military ID) this says i can carry a gun when ever the **** I want.

    Me: Actually no that does not say you can carry a gun whenever you want, you should go get a permit.

    Army guy: No one would say **** to me if showed them this

    Me: Thats fine with me, man, I am done with it.

    Army guy: You think you are cool, huh

    Me: Dude, im done with it.

    Then i told my friend we should leave because I could tell he did not want to here anything I had to say. It was not worth fighting over.

    I never thought someone would call me threat. Has anyone ever been referred to a threat before. It kinda blew my mind.

    Tell me if im wrong, but i do not believe you can carry without aLTC (in Indiana)even if you are in the military.

    This is the second time I posted this because for some reason the first didnt show up, so if the second one shows up and the convo is a little different then this one, it is because i cant remember what was said word for word. Just the main points

  2. #2
    Regular Member vermonter's Avatar
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    Shows you how they are "training" the troops. If there is ever Martial Law here b/c of some disaster do you really think the troops are going to respect your right to carry? The declaration that we will not lose our guns during a declared emergency isn't worth the paper it's written on. What do you think would happen if that same guy had a full auto carbine and told you "surrender you gun, this is Martial Law"! You gonna argue? If you want your freedom vote for Ron Paul!

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    At best, your Military ID can get you out of some very minor infractions in the cop is sympathetic. Military ID's have nothing to do with the ability to carry a concealed weapon... anywhere. From several of the stories we've seen here, some LEO's have told Marines/Army that they don't feel they're qualified to be open carrying a gun, so I'd think that carrying a concealed gun with only a MilID would get them tossed in jail.

    Army: Nothing is going to happen on a college campus.
    Oh, and if you see him, ask him what he was smoking during the Virginia Tech shootings to think that nothing could happen on a college campus. You can also point him to the numerous quantities of robberies, rapes and assaults every week on college campuses -- I know a few have been reported at University of Delaware these past few weeks alone.

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    Vermonter,

    Let's not start putting all the military people into one group just because one of them is stupid.

    We all hate it when the anti's group all of us law abiding citizens in with the criminals when they do something stupid.

    Overall our military are a fine bunch of men and women, who go about their daily tasks and don't make stupid remarks like this guy did.

    Just my thoughts.

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    You were a threat... to him. Before you showed up, he was the "Alpha Male" in the room. By showing up with a gun, you were now "tougher" than him and he had to try to back you down. He thinks he won because you left. We know you had the brains and the balls to do what was right. Good move!

    By the way, the only thing his Military ID would do for him is get him a trip to the Brig after he gets out of civilian jail.

    LoveMyCountry

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    "If there is ever Martial Law here"

    I'm more worried about Martian Law. Those dang Martians. Think they can come here and take our women...

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    Regular Member Beau's Avatar
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    HMDGLOCK wrote:
    Army guy: Well i think you are a threat.

    Me: A threat(with a laugh)

    Army guy: Yea a fuckin threat

    Me: are you sure your not made because I am carrying a gun and you are not.

    Army guy: (pulls out an Military ID) this says i can carry a gun when ever the **** I want.

    Army guy: No one would say **** to me if showed them this
    I can't believe this guy. I served five years in the Navy and I know his type. He wants to be as previously stated by another memberthe "Alpha Male". He is power hungry and believes that being in the military empowers him more than it actually does.

    His ID statement made me laugh. Other than maybe getting out of a traffic ticket and 10% discounts at select stores his ID is worthless.

    Now I don't know much about Army regulations But being in theNavy when it comes to gunsit goes like this. Unlessit's issued, you don't have it. The only time I owned a gun while in the military I was stationed in Washington state. I lived on base and had to check my gun into the local Police Department. I congradulate you HMDGLOCK on the way you handled the situation. There is only way to win with a person like that and you did it.
    Colorado Gun Owners - COGO
    http://www.ColoradoGunOwners.com

    A discussion forum for Colorado Gun Owners.

    Colorado Firearm law.
    http://www.lexisnexis.com/hottopics/colorado/
    Lexis Nexis: Colorado law pertaining to firearms.
    Title 18, Article 12

  8. #8
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    Beau wrote:
    HMDGLOCK wrote:
    Army guy: Well i think you are a threat.

    Me: A threat(with a laugh)

    Army guy: Yea a fuckin threat

    Me: are you sure your not made because I am carrying a gun and you are not.

    Army guy: (pulls out an Military ID) this says i can carry a gun when ever the **** I want.

    Army guy: No one would say **** to me if showed them this
    I can't believe this guy. I served five years in the Navy and I know his type. He wants to be as previously stated by another memberthe "Alpha Male". He is power hungry and believes that being in the military empowers him more than it actually does.

    His ID statement made me laugh. Other than maybe getting out of a traffic ticket and 10% discounts at select stores his ID is worthless.

    Now I don't know much about Army regulations But being in theNavy when it comes to gunsit goes like this. Unlessit's issued, you don't have it. The only time I owned a gun while in the military I was stationed in Washington state. I lived on base and had to check my gun into the local Police Department. I congradulate you HMDGLOCK on the way you handled the situation. There is only way to win with a person like that and you did it.
    He was probably an MP. I know PLENTY of idiots like that in the Air Force and they're all Security Forces (AF MPs.)

  9. #9
    Regular Member Beau's Avatar
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    USAF_MetalChris wrote:

    He was probably an MP. I know PLENTY of idiots like that in the Air Force and they're all Security Forces (AF MPs.)
    I hear that. I grew up by Lowry and Buckly Air Force bases in Colorado. I had friends who would take me on base and the MP's were always mean.
    Colorado Gun Owners - COGO
    http://www.ColoradoGunOwners.com

    A discussion forum for Colorado Gun Owners.

    Colorado Firearm law.
    http://www.lexisnexis.com/hottopics/colorado/
    Lexis Nexis: Colorado law pertaining to firearms.
    Title 18, Article 12

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    Indiana has an exemption for military (must be on duty, etc.) so this person was not entirely off-base although his all encompassing language is not true. You really should have left at the first sign of hostility (a hostel is a cheap hotel for young people). Carrying (openly or concealed) puts great responsibility on you. Your ego isn't that important -- is it?

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    apjonas wrote:
    Indiana has an exemption for military (must be on duty, etc.) so this person was not entirely off-base although his all encompassing language is not true. You really should have left at the first sign of hostility (a hostel is a cheap hotel for young people). Carrying (openly or concealed) puts great responsibility on you. Your ego isn't that important -- is it?
    Sorry for miss spelling a word. In my conversation with the army guy when did i ever show an ego. Sometimes I wonder on this site so many people will give their opinionsin a forum, but they say you should never give your opinion on something in the street because you have a gun. I don't know about everyone else,if someone is going to attack me in any kind away, im not going to runaway like a scared dog. I will try to talk about it and if that does not work I'll leave. If what i said was having an big ego than oh well, because I thought I did a good job with this guy. Also I am not the only one that thought I did good.

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    HMDGLOCK wrote:
    apjonas wrote:
    Indiana has an exemption for military (must be on duty, etc.) so this person was not entirely off-base although his all encompassing language is not true. You really should have left at the first sign of hostility (a hostel is a cheap hotel for young people). Carrying (openly or concealed) puts great responsibility on you. Your ego isn't that important -- is it?
    Sorry for miss spelling a word. In my conversation with the army guy when did i ever show an ego. Sometimes I wonder on this site so many people will give their opinionsin a forum, but they say you should never give your opinion on something in the street because you have a gun. I don't know about everyone else,if someone is going to attack me in any kind away, im not going to runaway like a scared dog. I will try to talk about it and if that does not work I'll leave. If what i said was having an big ego than oh well, because I thought I did a good job with this guy. Also I am not the only one that thought I did good.
    I don't want to speak for others on this list. Based on your description, I thought you acted appropriately. That said, my opinion is that when you are carrying (openly or otherwise) the potential for catastrophic escalation is greatly increased. It behooves us as responsible carriers to use extra care to avoid that escalation whenever possible. This is why, for example, I don't drink when I carry. After all, the reason we carry is to protect ourselves and our families, not to help us "cash the checks written by our mouths", so to speak. The first rule should always be to exit from a potentially bad situation before it escalates.

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    HMDGLOCK wrote:
    Army guy: (pulls out an Military ID) this says i can carry a gun when ever the **** I want.
    No, it says that he can carry a gun when issued to him, and fire it when ordered. He can't do a damn thinghe wants. He's government property, just like his weapon and his BDU's.

  14. #14
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    As said above this guy is power hungry. Some people, unfortunately, join the police force simply for the gun/badge/power, and some go the military for the same reasons.

    He was probably angry that you were able to carry a firearm openly, yet he couldn't...

    Wearing the dog tags out like that is a bit showy I think, and it just further supports my theory. It is great to have pride in what you do, but this guy is an egomaniac.

    I also can't believe that he would say nothing is going to happen on a college campus, what rock has this guy been living under?! (Probably under the same rock where a military ID gives you unlimited power...)

    His use of profanity also shows that he is angry, probably not at you, but because others, non-military/police can carry firearms like that, and it annoys him. Profanity rarely strengthens an argument.

    Sounds like this guy might have been drinking, was he?

    Wouldn't worry about it too much, and if anyone was the threat, it was him and his stupidity.

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    Has anybody mentioned the point that he couldn'thave considered the OP a threat. One doesn't go around antagonizing armed people one considers a threat.

    He knew the OP was not a threat, thus he felt safe in his verbally agressive behavior.

    Well handled, I think.

    Perhaps another, additional tactic would be to confuse them just long enough to make a graceful exit by stating the obvious, "Well, thanks for proving you don't really consider me a threat. Otherwise you wouldn't be trying to antagonize me."
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Citizen wrote:
    Has anybody mentioned the point that he couldn'thave considered the OP a threat. One doesn't go around antagonizing armed people one considers a threat.

    He knew the OP was not a threat, thus he felt safe in his verbally agressive behavior.

    Well handled, I think.

    Perhaps another, additional tactic would be to confuse them just long enough to make a graceful exit by stating the obvious, "Well, thanks for proving you don't really consider me a threat. Otherwise you wouldn't be trying to antagonize me."
    +1

    And could have only gotten more upset when you didn't come down to his level...

    Some people just want a reaction, however it is quite dumb to antagonize and armed person.

    With the way the guy held himself during this, I wonder how this guy would have reacted if he had the gun and HMDGLOCK had been questioning him like this, I don't think he would have been as composed to say the least...

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    HMDGLOCK wrote:
    Army guy: (pulls out an Military ID) this says i can carry a gun when ever the **** I want.

    The only carry exemption for any Military is while in uniform and required for the performance of official military duties. That means he has to have been ordered to carry for a specific military purpose, not just cause he feels like playing John Wayne.


    TSgt USAF (Retired)



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    I'm in the Navy currently stationed in New Orleans, I carry everyday while off duty. (I live off base.) Having a military ID doesn't do a damn thing. It gets me free drinks and a discount, and access to certain areas, but it does not give me the ability to do whatever I want. Should I catch flak from an LEO, sure, I might mention that i'm military just to help him trust me more, seeing as I don't want to get arrested for doing something legal. but I don't walk around with my dog tags out (actually, Idon't even know where they are), and flashing my military ID around like I'm hot ****. I'd rather not even mention that I'm military, there's no point.

    Btw, about the use of vulgar language, he's a soldier, it's pretty common. I curse all the time in normal conversation (not excessively), and sometimes you just can't help it. It's a military thing, ya know, "curse like a sailor"?

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    HMDGLOCK wrote:
    i noticed the last guy was in the military because he had on a ARMY tee on and had his dog tags out.

    Everyone knows that an ID card doesnt do squat for you, unless your in the process of your duties adn there would be no reason for any military to carry off base in uniform in the process of thier duties (cept like hurrican katrina stuff).

    And i can tell you from being AD for 4 years that usually only guys who didnt have the balls to go AD and went National Guard or something wear their dog tags, especially out. I bet this guy was talking alot of stuff about how he did this or that one of the weekends which was just like the game. Wehn i got out of boot my tags came off and i have worn them maybe once since, just to be funny. Most REAL military guys wear whatever civillian clothes they can, whenever they can, i only wear military shirts when i work out for the most part. This guy sounds like a weekend warrior who thinks he knows everything about anything. id start busting his balls about what he does and what he knows. lol

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    HMDGLOCK wrote:
    Army guy: (pulls out an Military ID) this says i can carry a gun when ever the **** I want.
    I'm guessing his testosterone had an alcohol booster additive.


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    PackinVB,

    I would have to disagree with you on the part about the is NO need for any military personnel to be carrying off base in line with their duties.

    I carried off base when I was Brig Chasing. The MP's carry off base all the time going to pick up military personnel that might have been detained in the local jails, or to investigate crimes involving military people who may be involved or be victims of crimes.

    I know it's not something that happens to much to day. But there were times when we got paid in cash so the payroll officer and several NCO's with sidearms and M-16's would go pick up the payroll.

    We would carry our sidearms and rifles when we were transporting out 50 cals and other weapons over to El Toro for level 1 & 2 maintance. So there are many times when military personnel may be called on to wear or carry weapons in the line of duty while off base.

    Just thought I should point that out.

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    Lthrnck wrote:
    PackinVB,

    I would have to disagree with you on the part about the is NO need for any military personnel to be carrying off base in line with their duties.

    I carried off base when I was Brig Chasing. The MP's carry off base all the time going to pick up military personnel that might have been detained in the local jails, or to investigate crimes involving military people who may be involved or be victims of crimes.

    I know it's not something that happens to much to day. But there were times when we got paid in cash so the payroll officer and several NCO's with sidearms and M-16's would go pick up the payroll.

    We would carry our sidearms and rifles when we were transporting out 50 cals and other weapons over to El Toro for level 1 & 2 maintance. So there are many times when military personnel may be called on to wear or carry weapons in the line of duty while off base.

    Just thought I should point that out.
    OK maybe goin to find some people or take some weapons to get fixed. Its alot easier now that there are no payroll checks too. But my main point was that this guy acted like he could carry simply because he was in the military, and everyone knows that only military on duty, doing a certain job can carry. And i dont know how long ago you were in but there are not very many times that the military needs to carry off base. Not too many, and if they need to, they usually have local police with them to cover the locals asses.

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    as a former MP i know that your military id is only for issued weapons and while on duty. even as a MP i still need aLTCH for off duty carry.

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    Just for him to bring out his military card like that shows you how low he is. He now thinks hes all high and mighty and cool since he did that. Just my opinion hes a DICK for doing that plain and simple. Yea thanks for serving out country but it doesnt me your beter than me just bc you have a military card. Hes a joke! Great job of controlling yourself nicely!!!

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    He would actually have a point about you being a "threat" if you were going around flaunting your gun, or talking trash about how you'd shoot somebody, or just otherwise being a jerk. Obviously, you weren't doing any of this; this guy apparently is one of the anti OC people we have heard stories about. The only difference between him and the typical anti OC person we read about is that he's a member of the military. That goes to show us that antis can be found anywhere and all we can do is not allow them to deter us and use OC as an opportunity to educate them. If they can't be ecucated, as obviously this guy can't be, then it's best to just leave them be and continue carrying.

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