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Thread: Mall Shooting

  1. #1
    Regular Member Smurfologist's Avatar
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    Has anyone seen this story?!?

    http://www.ketv.com/news/14782867/detail.html

    2nd Amendment.........Use it..........Or, lose it!!:X
    The 2nd Amendment... brought to you by Beretta and the number 1791!!

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    State Researcher lockman's Avatar
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    Another sad day when a nut job takes the lives of Innocent people, seems to be a pattern that has been going on for the last 20-30 yrs that i can remember as i am only 45, where arethe police ? seems to be only after the fact. At least he offed himself would have been better if he would have done that first

    It is a sad day, again my heart goes out to victims families.

    On another note does that Mall have the no firearm signs ???

    NICE if someone could take a look and post the results if there are signs?

    Have seen several Malls in Mich, ohio, etc i personally will go somewhere else to shop when i or my family see those signs. Will also call or leave a do not spend my dollars...


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    Well, that just sucks. May have to not download the TnT podcast tomorrow, I just know they will have all sorts of rational, insightfull remarks just sure to put me in a good mood.

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    Once again the shooter was on prescription anti-depressants, it looks like a strong relation between violence and these drugs is repeating itself.

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    casullshooter wrote:
    Once again the shooter was on prescription anti-depressants, it looks like a strong relation between violence and these drugs is repeating itself.
    It goes back a good ways.

    Type "psychiatric drugs" into the search tool on YouTube. I saw at least four documentary-seeming thumbs.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    casullshooter wrote:
    Once again the shooter was on prescription anti-depressants, it looks like a strong relation between violence and these drugs is repeating itself.
    I would say you are on to something ther as many people whohave violently suicidal tendencies first seek help usually involving anti-depressants and other forms of treatment. Unfortunately the treatments don't always work and they go ahead with thier plans. If they had not tried to seek any treatment then it would probably have happened much earlier. I would say that their is a definite link between people who take anti-depressants and commit suicide. They have also found that over 90% of allAmericans diagnosed with colon cancer use toilet paper.

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    PT111 wrote:
    casullshooter wrote:
    Once again the shooter was on prescription anti-depressants, it looks like a strong relation between violence and these drugs is repeating itself.
    I would say you are on to something ther as many people whohave violently suicidal tendencies first seek help usually involving anti-depressants and other forms of treatment. Unfortunately the treatments don't always work and they go ahead with thier plans. If they had not tried to seek any treatment then it would probably have happened much earlier. I would say that their is a definite link between people who take anti-depressants and commit suicide. They have also found that over 90% of allAmericans diagnosed with colon cancer use toilet paper.
    Short verson: Correlation =/ Causation.

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    So, does anyone know...did the mall have a sign posted "No guns" ?

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    timf343 wrote:
    So, does anyone know...did the mall have a sign posted "No guns" ?
    Dunno, but I went on the von maur website, as well as the malls website, neither mentions any type of bans on firearms or weapons in general.



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    I know the majority of the sheeple at the mall when this happened will probably turn to gun grabbing... [sarcasm]after all, if assault rifles were illegal and if 'high' capacity magazines were illegal, there's no way this would have happened... right?[/sarcasm]

    From the article...
    African Americann said every available officer in the city was sent to the mall, and it took six minutes from the time of the call for the first officers to arrive.
    I wonder if that first officer went into the mall or waited outside a few minutes for other officers to arrive. I can't blame him if he did the latter.

    This incident illustrates three important points:
    1. Self defense situations can happen anywhere at any time.
    2. When seconds count, the cops are just 6 minutes away.
    3. Long guns may be necessary in a self defense situation.
    <Edited to add point 3>
    Participant in the Free State Project - "Liberty in Our Lifetime" - www.freestateproject.org
    Supporter of the CalGuns Foundation - http://www.calgunsfoundation.org/
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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Virginian’s Response to Omaha Tragedy
    I’m sorry Omaha. My heart goes out to you. I feel your pain, I really do. I am a native son. I experienced the Virginia Tech aftermath emotions. Anger, frustration, raw emotions and bitterness well up in me. The absolute devastation, the stupidity of Robert Hawkins and pain to the families at the injury and death wrought on the defenseless souls.

    Yet again when seconds count, the police are only minutes away…..in this case only six (6) minutes away!

    I’ve read that a common thread from survivors was “I didn’t know what to do!” You could not conceive of this happening there and nobody was prepared or trained to stop it. As a result of this tragedy, you can probably expect a knee jerk reaction to ban defensive handguns in shopping centers there too - even though the shooter used a long gun. Makes sense to me - NONSENSE.

    http://www.wowt.com/home/headlines/12163196.html

    No ban or law against weapons would/could have prevented this - criminals like Robert Hawkins will still violate the law and their fellow man. What will it take to wake up Americans? You must take responsibility for your own lives - nobody else can! If you are not prepared to defend your life and that of your loved one and neighbor, who will? Do not be deceived by feel safe laws. It is up to you to be prepared and personally react to the best of your ability and judgment. Too soon to hear this? No it is not! It is late, but not too late to prepare for the next time…..and there will be a next time.

    Again, my heart goes out to you. Respond to this tragedy with a positive reaction - vow to never become a passive victim.

    Take heed. Protect your rights. Learn from adversity.

    Yata hey

    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    The most effed up part of the whole story is that he was showing off this SKS to his family a day or two prior and mom said she though "it was too old to work anymore."

    If your lil precious is on Anti-Depressants you shouldn't even let him around a squirt gun let alone full on Russian SKS

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    My son(now 18), was on these drugs after I separated from my Ex. She insisted he was depressed and with the "help" of the Psyc community forced these drugs on him. It made things worse, as he was found at school with a Shotgun/Hit list in his possesion (Mom at top of list). The Ex had been a Psyc major(no degree) in College and bought into all the psycobabble BS.

    I was able to gain custody and do a slow weaning away and all is OK to this day. He was depressed because he was living with a head case that would be enough to make anyone want to kill themself to escape. The thoughts of harming others only surfaced after the "medication" began.

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    Regular Member XD40coyote's Avatar
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    Hmm how strange, I have been on an antidepressant for 14 years, since I was 21, and I have yet to kill anyone, hurt anyone, have police called on me, go to a hospital...



    Get the picture?

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    XD40coyote wrote:
    Hmm how strange, I have been on an antidepressant for 14 years, since I was 21, and I have yet to kill anyone, hurt anyone, have police called on me, go to a hospital...



    Get the picture?
    Yes. Google anti-depressants and suicidal ideation (PC term meaning you start thinking about killing yourself), violence, adverse reactions, etc.

    There is a reason European regulators are coming down on anti-depressants. Ditto, black box warnings on the labels in the US.

    I've come across more than one recorded interview with a parent or professional who said that the violence didn't start until the drug was involved.

    And this goes way back. Wasn't it valium or something that was supposed to be the new wonder drug for some condition, perhaps not depression, but eventually the pharmaceutical industry had to recognize that it caused violence because some people who had no real history of violence went berserk?
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  17. #17
    Regular Member XD40coyote's Avatar
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    I was pointing out that you shouldn't lump everyone into the" gets violent on antidepressants" category. I was having some violent thoughts and urges as part of being clinically depressed 14 years ago and the stuff I take stomped it totally out within weeks. NowI was at first on prozac and it worked very well for a few months, but thenI started feeling a lil weird again, but no violent urges or anything. So I got switched to zoloft and was ok again.

    I don't like being lumped in with these shooter maniacs.

    I feel I will someday be discrimated against unfairly due to these events ( such as a ccw application process and eventually gun buying and ownership). I have as much right to defend myself against these f-upped maniacs as anyone else does. This latest guy had a big history of being in hospitals, being messed up, committing crimes, a felon, etc. Cho was stalking women and went before a judge who made him go to a hospital, and got lost in some clerical error or something that let him buy guns. I have NO history of crime, violence, hospitalizations, adjudications,etc.

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    XD40coyote wrote:
    SNIP I was pointing out that you shouldn't lump everyone into the" gets violent on antidepressants" category.
    This I can understand.

    The other side of the coin is that many of these young shooters were on psychiatric medications. Something is up with these drugs.Andthe failure of psychiatric treatment methods.

    I can't immediately recall a school/mall shooter type who was not either being treated or had been treated.

    It seems to me that if something wasn't up, we'd see a fair percentage with no psychiatric history represented.


    Of course, all the ones that had a psychiatric treatment history or psychiatric drug history opens the door to the question, "Why didn't the treatment or drugs work?"
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  19. #19
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    Citizen wrote:
    Of course, all the ones that had a psychiatric treatment history or psychiatric drug history opens the door to the question, "Why didn't the treatment or drugs work?"
    One of the reasons why is in the history of depression treatment. When the drugs were introduced they were used in conjunction with talk therapy and with great success. But the therapist is expensive! The cost/benefit judgement was made to minimize the therapist use and expense and get 'acceptable' results from primarily the drug.

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    Doug Huffman wrote:
    SNIPThe cost/benefit judgement was made to minimize the therapist use and expense and get 'acceptable' results from primarily the drug.

    Thanks for reminding me.

    The pharmaceutical industrysells billionsof dollars ofthese drugs.

    How in the world did mankind suddenly develop the vast and numerous need for these things in just a couple generations?You'd have to go how far back the genetic tree for the start of the mutation?


    Also,the doctor can make a lot more money seeing a person for 15 minutes and writing a prescription. In this manner he can see lotsmore patients inday. I think the cost/benefit judgement wasnot so much to delete the therapist because he was expensive, but to focus on the more lucrativeway of doing it. Many psychiatrists are in private practice, soany judgement to minimizetalk therapy would be made by the doctor himself.


    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  21. #21
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    This is sad.

    I have come to know the father over the last 6 months. His father is a great man, and avid supporter of second amendment rights, and civil liberties!! This is a sad event, that can not easily be explained away.

    What must be remembered is that it was not just the families of the victims that were hurt. The shooters family was also sorely hurt.

    Remember to be kind, and thoughtful, as incidents like this damage to all involved...

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