Results 1 to 25 of 25

Thread: CWP and ID Check

  1. #1
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Dumfries, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    243

    Post imported post

    It's sad to say but I believe it's getting a little too cold for me to refuse to wear my jacket/coat any longer in order to OC so I'm thinking about switching to CC until it warms back up. I have a class that I'm attending on Sunday and I'm pretty stoked about it.

    Now, after taking the course and applying for my permit. My understanding is that if I'm CC and asked by LEO to show my permit and my ID I am required by law to do so. Does that go for when I OC? Am I required to show papers even if I'm not CCing?

    Silly question but civil disobedience is a healthy thing.

    -X

  2. #2
    Campaign Veteran roscoe13's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Catlett, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    1,134

    Post imported post

    Only required if you're CCing. Of course, if you're CCing correctly, the LEO should never know to ask...
    "The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good." - George Washington

  3. #3
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    7,607

    Post imported post

    You NEVER have to show your ID unless.....

    Operating a car you have to produce your license



    ยง 18.2-308. Personal protection; carrying concealed weapons; when lawful to carry.

    Section H

    The person issued the permit shall have such permit on his person at all times during which he is carrying a concealed handgun and shall display the permit and a photo-identification issued by a government agency of the Commonwealth or by the United States Department of Defense or United States State Department (passport) upon demand by a law-enforcement officer.

  4. #4
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Dumfries, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    243

    Post imported post

    Thanks guys.. This makes my quest to become a test case for the Immigration resolution in PWC all the more fun! :celebrate



    Seriously, good information. Thank you.

    -X

  5. #5
    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    13,580

    Post imported post

    229 is correct and I would like to point out (I point this out quite often) that a Drivers License is not ID. It is a license to drive. Some people accept it as ID bit it is simply a license.

    The Commonwealth does sell an ID if one were so inclined to want one. I can't imagine why anyone would be so inclined though.

  6. #6
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    7,607

    Post imported post

    peter nap wrote:
    229 is correct and I would like to point out (I point this out quite often) that a Drivers License is not ID. It is a license to drive. Some people accept it as ID bit it is simply a license.

    The Commonwealth does sell an ID if one were so inclined to want one. I can't imagine why anyone would be so inclined though.
    Actually.. It is a dual purpose item.

    Itis an State issued identification card AND a license to operate a motor vehicle all rolled into one.

    You CANNOT have both a State operators license and a State ID card at the same time.

    The State ID card and License are virtually the same with the exception that one identifies you can operate a motor vehicle.

    Both have your photo, name, address, physical description, and signature.

    BOTH identification cards.

  7. #7
    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    13,580

    Post imported post

    BOTH identification cards.
    I'm looking at my renewal notice now and it says Drivers License.

    Just like the bank said when I wouldn't show it to them..."We accept it as ID"...Maybe so, but I don't show it as ID!:P

    That's why they make ATM's I guess!

  8. #8
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    7,607

    Post imported post

    peter nap wrote:
    BOTH identification cards.
    I'm looking at my renewal notice now and it says Drivers License.

    Just like the bank said when I wouldn't show it to them..."We accept it as ID"...Maybe so, but I don't show it as ID!:P

    That's why they make ATM's I guess!
    The DMVindicates that a Driver's Licenseis a primary document for proof of identity.

    http://www.dmv.state.va.us/webdoc/pdf/dmv141.pdf

    One should not confuse the terminology used to describe the documents.

    A Photo ID is equal to a Driver's License when it comes to establishing identity. The only difference is one costs more and allows you to drive a motor vehicle.

  9. #9
    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    13,580

    Post imported post

    It just says they accept it as proof of identity. So does everyone else. It's still just a Drivers License that they accept.

    I don't have official Government issued ID......and never will!

  10. #10
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    7,607

    Post imported post

    peter nap wrote:
    It just says they accept it as proof of identity. So does everyone else. It's still just a Drivers License that they accept.

    I don't have official Government issued ID......and never will!
    And there you go....

    It serves as proof ofyour identify....

    It is a card....

    Therefore..... It is and always be.. an "ID card"

    Enjoy!

  11. #11
    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    13,580

    Post imported post



    LA..LA..LA..LA..LA

  12. #12
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    7,607

    Post imported post

    peter nap wrote:


    LA..LA..LA..LA..LA
    You arereading... you need to cover your eyes!!!

  13. #13
    Regular Member Neplusultra's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Christiansburg, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    2,228

    Post imported post

    LEO 229 wrote:
    peter nap wrote:


    LA..LA..LA..LA..LA
    You arereading... you need to cover your eyes!!!
    He reads out loud !

  14. #14
    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    13,580

    Post imported post

    Oh,,,,,,,Your right! Cyber confusion

  15. #15
    Regular Member Marco's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Greene County
    Posts
    3,844

    Post imported post

    in 22yrs i've never been stopped by LE and asked to produce my permit/ID.
    if they noticed my CC'd firearm they ignored it.
    the one time I knew the officer saw my gun (a strong wind blew open my shirt) he looked at me,I said "good day officer" and continued on with no problems.



    If you think like a Statist, act like one, or back some, you've given up on freedom and have gone over to the dark side.
    The easiest ex. but probably the most difficult to grasp for gun owners is that fool permission slip so many of you have, especially if you show it off with pride. You should recognize it as an embarrassment, an infringement, a travesty and an affront to a free person.


    ~Alan Korwin

  16. #16
    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    13,580

    Post imported post

    in 22yrs i've never been stopped by LE and asked to produce my permit/ID. if they noticed my CC'd firearm they ignored it. the one time I knew the officer saw my gun (a strong wind blew open my shirt) he looked at me, I said "good day officer" and continued on with no problems.
    Same here but it's been 29 years.

  17. #17
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Virginia, ,
    Posts
    242

    Post imported post

    If you seriously think that A. Prince William Immigration statute is bad B. It requires ID at all times and C. Legal open carry is going to get you become a test case, your severly mistaken.

    PWC immigration resolution does alot of things but main thing it does is require officer to turn over to ICE anyone they arrest or summon (Requiring you to do something illegal) where they have Probable Cause to believe your immigration status is in question. If you need a lesson in Probable Cause, I'm sure LEO229 will be more then happy to go over it with you. So for you to test said resolution you need to commit a crime, get arrested/summoned and provide them with enough bogus information that ends up causing them to turn you over to ICE under suspecision of being an illegal alien. If you want to be that big of a tool, by all means, go ahead and do it. I'll let PWC know to be on the look out for a tool with open carried firearm.



    Peter Nap, VA ID card is useful, having a picture ID does make life much easier in many circumstance and it'sno larger invasion of privacy then having a VA DL.

  18. #18
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Dumfries, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    243

    Post imported post

    rabbit994 wrote:
    If you seriously think that A. Prince William Immigration statute is bad B. It requires ID at all times and C. Legal open carry is going to get you become a test case, your severly mistaken.

    PWC immigration resolution does alot of things but main thing it does is require officer to turn over to ICE anyone they arrest or summon (Requiring you to do something illegal) where they have Probable Cause to believe your immigration status is in question. If you need a lesson in Probable Cause, I'm sure LEO229 will be more then happy to go over it with you. So for you to test said resolution you need to commit a crime, get arrested/summoned and provide them with enough bogus information that ends up causing them to turn you over to ICE under suspecision of being an illegal alien. If you want to be that big of a tool, by all means, go ahead and do it. I'll let PWC know to be on the look out for a tool with open carried firearm.



    Peter Nap, VA ID card is useful, having a picture ID does make life much easier in many circumstance and it'sno larger invasion of privacy then having a VA DL.
    You assume everyone, including the police follow the law. If being a tool means exerting my rights and verifying that the police are doing what they're supposed to be doing - I'll admit it, I'm a tool. But, I'm a tool that loves and appreciates his freedom rather than a person that blindly believes that the government will do everything perfect 100% of the time.

    If I need to be locked up for a few hours to prove that a law is unjust or a law enforcement officer is wrong/dirty than so be it. I will be willing to endanger my life or freedom so that you may enjoy your freedom.

    And, no thanks are neccessary.

    But, feel free to put a bumper sticker on your car that says 'Support Our Troops' or 'I Love America'. Action > Words

  19. #19
    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    13,580

    Post imported post

    Peter Nap, VA ID card is useful, having a picture ID does make life much easier in many circumstance and it's no larger invasion of privacy then having a VA DL.
    Yeah and Hillary Clinton would make a great President

  20. #20
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Fairfax, VA, ,
    Posts
    1,244

    Post imported post

    rabbit994 wrote:
    Peter Nap, VA ID card is useful, having a picture ID does make life much easier in many circumstance and it'sno larger invasion of privacy then having a VA DL.
    Ever notice how people always argue for a tiny bit more government intrusion in your life by simply pointing out that the government "already does x, y and z"? It's kinda like when you have a frog in a cold pot of water and start to turn up the heat little by little...

    Assuming we give in and trade just a LITTLE more liberty for security, the next time around, the same people will be like "well, we ALREADY did THIS so why not just take it a half step further?"

    Anyone who trusts government not to abuse it's power - even a tiny little bit of power - is a fool (sorry if that sounds a little harsh).

  21. #21
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    7,607

    Post imported post

    People argue for the smallest of things that to me are so insignificant to the larger picture at play.

    They make a huge deal over it and then people point out... x,y, and z to show that there are bigger things to worry about that severely trump this small irritation.



  22. #22
    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    13,580

    Post imported post

    People argue for the smallest of things that to me are so insignificant to the larger picture at play.
    I'm a little like you 229. Sometimes I argue just for the fun of it.

    OTOH, as far as ID goes, I am serious about not needing it and not giving it unless absolutely necessary.
    I don't suppose I need to remind you that LEO's are exempt from many of your records showing personal information. I also don't have any major problems with that.....but

    Considering the abuses of information, I have to shuck and jive to obtain the same annomonity. One very good example I know of is an officer in Henrico County. Many officers keep their own personal contact databases. This Officer's wife works for Capital One and when he has an interesting contact, he'll have her run credit on the person for him. He even brags on it. I know about it because he asked me to repair a corrupted file once.

    Most information requests can be dealt with by lieing. Bad phone number and address works well. Unfortunately, that's illegal when dealing with banks, government or Leo's. IN those cases, just say NO!

    My banks hate me! I had one that I had a CD that exceeded the FDIC limit by a little. I got a new teller once that insisted on ID to cash a check. They knew me in the bank and had never asked for it before. I wrote a check for the amount in the account and told her to close the CD and I would be back the following week to pick up the CASH. Despite a number of calls from both the branch manager and the investment department, I still closed them out and opened an account with another bank.

    The point is that sometimes I have to show ID but not often. It's not a small thing!

  23. #23
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Virginia, ,
    Posts
    242

    Post imported post

    Xeni, If you want to go fight the man on this immigration thing, I'll completely help you out. Let me give you a step by step on how to "fight the man".

    1. Wear firearm openly (completely optional)
    2. Commit a crime causing an officer to decide to write you a summons or arrest you. Probably will accomplished at gun point if you decided to do Step 1.
    3. Refuse to provide officer any information or give him false information (rack up obstruction charges if you give him false information)
    4. At the jail, continue to provide false information stating your so so and your birth place is overseas. Watch as they call ICE.
    5. Once ICE gets there, provide real information which proves your legal citizenship or residence status.
    6. Come post on OCDO and ACLU message boards about how your rights were violated. Wearing tie dye shirt for extra bonus points.

    I know several PWC officers. Every one of them has stated Open Carry is legal and they are aware of said fact. Most of them don't like it. Many OCDO members have extremely positive reactions with PWCPD. I think Open Carry "problem" (there isn't one) has been "fixed". Your welcome to try them on immigration resolution. Since you have to commit a crime to even worry about it cause me to not care. Oh yes, I've decided to take your advice about being a good little sheeple. I've added TWO yellow support the troop ribbons to my car. Go me.



  24. #24
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    7,607

    Post imported post

    peter nap wrote:
    People argue for the smallest of things that to me are so insignificant to the larger picture at play.
    I'm a little like you 229. Sometimes I argue just for the fun of it.

    OTOH, as far as ID goes, I am serious about not needing it and not giving it unless absolutely necessary.
    I don't suppose I need to remind you that LEO's are exempt from many of your records showing personal information. I also don't have any major problems with that.....but

    Considering the abuses of information, I have to shuck and jive to obtain the same annomonity. One very good example I know of is an officer in Henrico County. Many officers keep their own personal contact databases. This Officer's wife works for Capital One and when he has an interesting contact, he'll have her run credit on the person for him. He even brags on it. I know about it because he asked me to repair a corrupted file once.

    Most information requests can be dealt with by lieing. Bad phone number and address works well. Unfortunately, that's illegal when dealing with banks, government or Leo's. IN those cases, just say NO!

    My banks hate me! I had one that I had a CD that exceeded the FDIC limit by a little. I got a new teller once that insisted on ID to cash a check. They knew me in the bank and had never asked for it before. I wrote a check for the amount in the account and told her to close the CD and I would be back the following week to pick up the CASH. Despite a number of calls from both the branch manager and the investment department, I still closed them out and opened an account with another bank.

    The point is that sometimes I have to show ID but not often. It's not a small thing!
    I argue for the fun of it all the time on here! Just don't tell anyone!! OK?

    I would not wear my ID on my neck for all to see... But when it is required.. I am adult enough to know when it is necessary and when it is not. Often times... if you want something... you need to give something... I want to cash a check at my bank.... I have to give up my ID.

    Do I think the bank is going to use my ID for bad? No... this is not a common problem. If you really want to worry... Think about your credit card the server took around the corner. They will skim your numbers and use it later.

    You cannot remain anonymous anymore. As hard as you might try..... computers and data are out there and there is nothing you can do about it. I can be found if you search for me. I have taken a few steps to make it a little harder... But I can be found by everyday citizens.

    Most businesses are not interested in you or your identity.... They want your business and that brings in profits.

  25. #25
    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    13,580

    Post imported post

    You cannot remain anonymous anymore. As hard as you might try....
    Your right and I don't have any illusion that I am or could be. I am going out kicking and screaming though.

    Your also right about credit card fraud. If people knew how often the cards are illegally scanned, they'd cut them all up. As it is, I only have one card and only use it onc or twice a year. I have a check card that I only use at ATM's and for internet purchases, I use Visa gift cards.

    The point is to make demanding ID, as unpleasant and unprofitable as possible.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •