• We are now running on a new, and hopefully much-improved, server. In addition we are also on new forum software. Any move entails a lot of technical details and I suspect we will encounter a few issues as the new server goes live. Please be patient with us. It will be worth it! :) Please help by posting all issues here.
  • The forum will be down for about an hour this weekend for maintenance. I apologize for the inconvenience.
  • If you are having trouble seeing the forum then you may need to clear your browser's DNS cache. Click here for instructions on how to do that
  • Please review the Forum Rules frequently as we are constantly trying to improve the forum for our members and visitors.

Responding to an active shooter...

Mainsail

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 24, 2007
Messages
1,533
Location
Silverdale, Washington, USA
imported post

The right stuff: Responding to an active shooter with limited manpower


By Frank Borelli

When a situation gets ugly, you know you have work to do. The question is, do you have the tools to do it?Choosing theright weapons andammunition will help make every second count. Being properly armed and outfitted is especially critical if you're short on manpower—you'll need all the help you can get.

I recently received an email inquiry from an officer who works an extremely rural area and has limited manpower available for an active shooter response. Having read several articles on the subject, he asked, “Hey; what about those of us who might only have one or two officers to respond at all?” His question started me thinking and I opened a discussion on this topic in a couple of online forums I participate in.


swatdallas.jpg

(AP Photo/LM Otero)My question was, “Any suggestions? If you have to go by yourself or with only one other officer, what would your approach be?” My assumption was that, while recent school shootings have been performed by single shooters, we must be prepared and trained for a minimum of two shooters and a maximum (in a terrorist siege situation) of 20. Of course, it could be more than that; however, Columbine had two shooters, and that’s the model most agencies train on. One active shooter situation, which was circumvented before it could be played out had planned for five shooters.

I was amazed at the commitment shown by the respondents, who put the immediate response first and foremost. The gentleman who sent the original email said (paraphrased), “I have no realistic hope of getting four officers on the scene in anything less than an hour. I’m not going to stand around safe outside and wait. I’m going to take what I’ve got and go do what is called for.”

One of the posts went like this: “Lastly, if you can’t have as many [officers] as you need, man up and go anyway. If all you have is two, two it is. One, OK. One trained now is much, much better than 20 an hour from now.”

Put in a slightly different way, this from another responder: “Remember, each and every round they send in your direction is a round that they did not put into some innocent victim’s head.”

Another comment that I felt was very important and insightful, even if not eloquently worded was: “Screw public perception... I would rather look too aggressive and save the lives of innocent men, women and children than be under prepared and have those lives lost.”

Now that we understand the extreme dedication that has to be the point-of-view we work from, let’s take a look at how to prepare and equip to deal with such an ugly situation.

From here forward, I’m assuming that most law enforcement professionals go on duty with some semblance of the following:

ammoamoa.jpg

(AP Photo/Morry Gash)

- A primary duty handgun: in 9mm, .40S&W, .45ACP, .357Sig, 10mm, or other decent fighting round. This does not include .380ACP, .25ACP, or anything in .22.

- Plenty of ammunition. One thing that becomes abundantly clear is that having plenty of ammo is imperative. Resupply is problematic at best, and running out is just plain unacceptable. The average cop is most likely carrying a handgun fully stoked and two back up magazines. In a Government Model 1911 .45ACP that’s only 22 rounds; in a Glock 22, that’s 46 rounds; a Glock 17 equates to 52 rounds and a Beretta 92F (M9) is 46 rounds. While I know plenty of people who believe that 9mm is not powerful enough when facing multiple opponents, would you rather have 22 rounds of .45ACP’ or 52 rounds of 9mm? The answer is one that you have to be happy with.

- A back up gun, where authorized. For a lot of people this is a Chief’s Special, 5-shot .38 Special. For others it’s a pocket-sized semi-auto (.380ACP, like a Walther). For others still, this is a downsized version of their duty gun: where the duty gun is a Glock 17, the BUG is a Glock 26. They use the same magazines and can shoot the exact same ammo. Functionality is identical. To my way of thinking, this is optimal.

- A good knife, or knives. Heaven forbid the fighting becomes a hand-to-hand issue, however, I’d rather have two good folding lockblades than no edged weapon at all. One is better than none. They don’t have to be fixed blades and they don’t have to be huge. I’m not referring to the stuff that will scare your chief executive officer into a liability coma. However, if you can, carry a decent fixed blade knife.

- Flashlight(s). Parts of every structure can be dark if the power is out. Take the light with you, twice. After all, it’s only your ass on the line.

All right, we know there is plenty of stuff every law enforcement officer carries that I have not listed. Things like handcuffs, OC spray, utility tools, rubber gloves, etc. Why did I leave these out? Because in a close quarters shooting battle, what do they matter? I’ve never heard the words “affect an arrest” used in active shooter training. Active shooter response is about an aggressive and violent response to an aggressive and violent action. “Drop your gun or I’ll shoot,” isn’t an option. Shoot. Stop the threat. Handcuffs are for after the shooter is down and incapacitated. OC spray? Maybe as a distraction when you’re at the hand-to-hand fighting position. Rubber gloves? Assuming a “holy cow, everything has gone to hell in a handbasket” active shooter scenario, rubber gloves won’t be enough to keep the blood off you.

So, what do we add to the list? For active shooter response, even where plenty of manpower is available, there are certain equipment recommendations. These items become more important if you’re in a limited manpower situation:

A Long Gun: Shotgun, Carbine or Rifle
I know a number of experts who believe the shotgun has limited use in an active shooter situation. One comment was, “Why take 200-year old technology into the gunfight?” I understand this outlook, especially as it’s applied to common buckshot ammo. When the enemy is 70 yards away, 00 buck will do you no good, and might spread out far enough to hit an unintended target. Slugs are an option, but are abusive to shoot and inaccurate past 25 yards or so. Today though, an option does exist for law enforcement: PolyShok. Anytime you can fire the equivalent of a slug with the recoil of 8-shot and head-shot accuracy at 50 yards, that’s not 200-year old technology. Further, the energy delivered to the enemy is incapacitating and devastating, even if he’s wearing body armor. To me, this makes the shotgun a viable active shooter option, especially in light of how often one can be found in cruiser trunks.

The carbine is certainly better than going in with only a handgun. It will increase your accurate shot placement distances out to between 50-100 yards; farther if you practice. Still, let’s be realistic: this is a long barrelled handgun. The added range is excellent; the increased accuracy at distances less than 50 yards is magnificent; but this is not a weapon that will penetrate body armor or deliver disabling hits on body armor. In this vein, I like the idea of the Beretta CX4 carbine, used in combination with the Beretta PX4 pistol. Since they are the same caliber, they use the same magazine, making it easier to carry extra loads for both weapons.

Finally, the rifle! The rifle is the weapon that was designed for one of two purposes: To hunt large game (animals that weigh in excess of 150 pounds); and to hunt men.

It never ceases to amaze me that people believe a bullet, fired from a common caliber handgun, will knock a man off his feet. Please! For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. If the bullet coming out the end of the handgun will knock the man it is shot at 15 feet, it must also knock the man shooting it 15 feet backward (assuming equal weight of men - you get the point). That said, rifles are designed to deliver a bullet at much higher speeds, with much greater accuracy, and doing far more damage in terminal ballistics.

If I have to go into an active shooter situation, my preference for long gun is:

- Rifle: with a minimum of six 30-round magazines;

- Shotgun: With an extended mag tube, six on the side shell holder; and as many more as I can carry in my pockets;

- Carbine: With all the appropriate magazines I can carry.

All law enforcement officers should be wearing body armor. Level III is quite common in normal duty cases, but what about going into a known high-risk high-threat area? Upgraded body armor and/or plates are required. Remember, “Every bullet fired at you is one less fired into a victim.” How many rounds can you absorb? You–not so many. Good armor–more. For this reason I recommend having a response vest in your cruiser that incorporates another layer of armor and/or plates. That same vest can hold your extra rifle magazines and extra handgun magazines. I recommend the Rapid Deployment Body Armor Bag. It’s my understanding that P.A.C.A. is now manufacturing that bag. Check it out.

What about armor for your head? How many cops actually have a ballistic helmet in their trunk? If so, how many have put it on? And of those who have put it on, how many have trained with it on? I can tell you from experience that training with the helmet on (especially when prone) isn’t as easy as doing it without any headcover. But shrapnel, flying debris and bullets can present a real threat to your head. Protect it. And as a final option, if you’re strong enough and can train with it, use a body bunker or shield. I find bunkers heavy and cumbersome. However, the Baker Batshield is a folding soft-armor shield that can be used in its carry case or out. It is a Level III armor shield that is easy to train with. One of these in each trunk would be a good idea.

Now that we have basic equipment covered, what about tactics?. One man cannot cover a 360-degree threat environment. Risks have to be taken. In this instance, speed equals security. While we train in active shooter response to go past closed doors, and move through hallway intersections depending on our wing men, how do you accomplish this as a single operator? You have to check open doors and corners. If you hear shots down the hall and around the corner, should you pause to check open doors along the way? This is going to require nerves of steel and a quick analytical ability.

Each door presents more information. Is it open or closed? If open, do you hear voices? screams? shouts? Are the lights on or off? Perhaps most importantly, (if you’ve trained and are on your game) do you feel a threat exists there as you move? If you’re a lone operator going into an active shooter situation, you will have to depend on your instincts in a large way. The more you’ve trained under high stress, the more accurate your instincts will be. Lower levels of training can result in stress overload when it comes to the real deal. When stress overload occurs, all of your instincts and perceptions are suspect. If you’re a lone operator and know that your backup is 10 minutes away, and shots are blasting inside the school, do what you have to do:
- Do take the time to armor up with what you have.
- Do equip yourself as best you can with what you have.
- Do communicate your arrival and intentions. Expect to be ordered not to make entry.
- Do advise what door you are entering, and what intel you can offer before making entry. If you can maintain an open mike as you go, do so. If not, update as circumstances permit.
- Do move as fast toward your target as your instincts and capabilities permit.
- Do engage without hesitation. Every wasted second is potentially another innocent life.
- Do your best to look high and low as you move. Improvised Explosive Devices are common at active shooter scenes. Trip wires can be hard to see.
Below are some direct quotes from posts in response to my questions:

“Bulk up your reserve unit. ...tell them they are only going to assist with school shootings.”

“See if there can’t be a better multi-jurisdiction response.”

“Find some teachers who are willing to take the step of getting trained. At least they can pick up a dead enemy’s gun to get in the fight with.”

“Response needs to be intelligence driven. Dispatch needs blueprints of the schools to assist in the officers’ response.”

“Get a map of the school(s) and grounds, or make one if you have to, and keep it someplace you’ll have it (in your vest?).”

“Train. Re-Train. Train some more. Train to shoot headshots at varying distances and know the capabilities of your weapon and your marksmanship.”

“...you can clear a building with two people. Of course it has to be trained and rehearsed and rehearsed. We use weekends and school holidays for this.”

“The big shootings you hear about with multiple deaths all have one thing in common: Nobody tried to stop them. To me, this argues for fast and violent counter action. Interrupt the plan.”

Remember... If not me, then who?


About the Author
Lt. Frank Borelli is the Training Commander and DHS Co-ordinator for Fairmount Heights Police Department, Washington DC. Pulling on his military service and police experience, Frank develops contemporary training programs. Comments may be sent to: frank@frankborelli.com
 

Legba

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2007
Messages
1,881
Location
, ,
imported post

I would add communications to this list. A cop by himself is just another armed guy with some - possibly inadequate - training and experience. What makes law enforcement formidable is the fact that they can summon a hundred other armed guys on short notice. A cell phone, ham radio, or CB is indispensable in a crisis situation, especially for untrained non-LEO civilians caught in a bad spot. Even most people who "pack" have limited ammo. Not so much a problem these days with most people carrying cell phones, but knowing who to call (911 calls from cell phones can get routed to the wrong jurisdiction or even state, for example)and how to report pertinent info is not something most people have to worry about.

-ljp
 

SouthernBoy

Regular Member
Joined
May 12, 2007
Messages
5,837
Location
Western Prince William County, Virginia, USA
imported post

Very timely. I was just thinking about what I might want to have with me if the SHTF scenario ever actually occurs. I have a very nice collection of weapons from which to chose. But when the crap hits home, the most important things are utter reliability, usability, ammunition availablity, practicality, and effectiveness. I have come down to some basic choices for these criteria. Not that all are the best for accuracy or power, but when everything is considered, they are the best of what I have for the purpose at hand.. survival. They are;

Glock 19
Glock 23
Kahr K9 Elite '03
Ruger Security-Six 4" .357
Armalite M15A2 Carbine
Ruger Mini-30
Winchester 1300 Defender 12 gauge pump action

Each of the above weapons presents its own reason for my preference to use it should the extreme come to pass. Each is valuable for its purpose and dead reliable. And each uses ammo that is more likely to be available should that time ever come.


Incidently, this thread is an excellent piece
 

casullshooter

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2006
Messages
490
Location
Bristow, Virginia, USA
imported post

Another consideration would be how to tell an armed citizen that was already on the scene and trying to take down the perp(s) from the actual BGs. i would not want to get shot by the police while trying to save others. Just a thought........
 

SouthernBoy

Regular Member
Joined
May 12, 2007
Messages
5,837
Location
Western Prince William County, Virginia, USA
imported post

casullshooter wrote:
Another consideration would be how to tell an armed citizen that was already on the scene and trying to take down the perp(s) from the actual BGs. i would not want to get shot by the police while trying to save others. Just a thought........
Amen to that for sure.

Officers answering a call to a hostile situation where shots have been fired are going to be in a very heightened state and a GG could indeed get injured or killed in such a case.
 

Doug Huffman

Banned
Joined
Jun 9, 2006
Messages
9,180
Location
Washington Island, across Death's Door, Wisconsin,
imported post

SouthernBoy wrote:
Officers answering a call to a hostile situation where shots have been fired are going to be in a very heightened state and a GG could indeed get injured or killed in such a case.

Which would you rather; die a sheeple or die a martyr? Then ask, 'a martyr to what?' 'Whose sheeple?'

Either we are equal or we are not. Good people ought to be armed where they will, with wits and guns and the truth. LAB/NRA/GOP KMA$$
 

Mjolnir

Regular Member
Joined
May 17, 2007
Messages
469
Location
, , USA
imported post

casullshooter wrote:
Another consideration would be how to tell an armed citizen that was already on the scene and trying to take down the perp(s) from the actual BGs. i would not want to get shot by the police while trying to save others. Just a thought........
This is true, what is the solution to the problem then??

How do we keep from getting killed if a citizen is running towards the sounds of battle in a mall/school/grocery store ect ect doing what needs to be done cuz the police are not on scene yet.

How can you identify yourself as a "friendly" in the 1st few seconds so you and I do not end up on a cold slab in a refer.
 

Johnny Law

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 6, 2007
Messages
462
Location
Puget Sound, ,
imported post

Mjolnir wrote:
casullshooter wrote:
Another consideration would be how to tell an armed citizen that was already on the scene and trying to take down the perp(s) from the actual BGs. i would not want to get shot by the police while trying to save others. Just a thought........
This is true, what is the solution to the problem then??

How do we keep from getting killed if a citizen is running towards the sounds of battle in a mall/school/grocery store ect ect doing what needs to be done cuz the police are not on scene yet.

How can you identify yourself as a "friendly" in the 1st few seconds so you and I do not end up on a cold slab in a refer.
This is a tough question that I have often thought about. I have came across situations on duty where there have been shots fired and/or someone is being held at gunpoint by a citizen.

Although the good guy may be standing armed near the bad guy (usually on the ground) when Police arrive there is no good way to tell who is who. In these situations EVERYONE will be disarmed (at gunpoint) until it can be sifted out. The reason is that even the good guy who was armed initially,may have been overpowered/disarmed, and may be the one on the ground with the bad guy now standing over him with a gun.

The best advice I can think of is if you (the good guy) calls 911, describe your clothing in detail. If you see someone else calling for you, tell them to tell the dispatcher what you are wearing.

When Police arrive, do exactly as you are told. Making a statement like "this man was burglarizing my house" may help if it applies. If you are told to place your weapon on the ground, make damn sure the muzzle never points toward Officers. You may be initially handcuffed, but don't worry as this is temporary. Be compliant, and you will be fine.

Remember, when Officers arrive the bad guy is now covered, so you no longer need to worry about holding them at gunpoint.

Off duty officers should have a badge in their pocket or wallet and be holding it in the air so that they can be identified in these situations.
 

expvideo

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 8, 2006
Messages
1,487
Location
Lynnwood, WA, ,
imported post

I hate it when people act as though knives are weapons. At this point, if you have level III body armor, a handgun, a BUG, a rifle, and extra ammo, why are we talking about carrying 1-2 knives for hand to hand combat?

A knife is a tool for cutting. I carry a nice kershaw knife. It has a tanto blade, half serated, and it is spring assisted, for easy one handed opening. It has grip-tape style grips, and it is very sharp. I don't carry it because I think I'll end up using it in a fight. I carry it in case I have to cut someone out of their seatbelt, removed bloodsoaked parts of clothing, cut myself out of something, etc. There are perfectly good reasons for carrying a knife, but in conjuction with 3 guns, fighting isn't one of them.
 

compmanio365

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2007
Messages
2,013
Location
Pierce County, Washington, USA
imported post

A knife is better than fists.......a pistol is better than a knife.......a rifle is better than a pistol. If you are out of ammo or you have a jam, and the guy is 10 feet away......what would you rather use? Your fists? Or your fists with knives in them? It's just another tool in your kit.....it can either be a weapon or a tool.......
 

Mjolnir

Regular Member
Joined
May 17, 2007
Messages
469
Location
, , USA
imported post

expvideo wrote:
I hate it when people act as though knives are weapons. At this point, if you have level III body armor, a handgun, a BUG, a rifle, and extra ammo, why are we talking about carrying 1-2 knives for hand to hand combat?

A knife is a tool for cutting. I carry a nice kershaw knife. It has a tanto blade, half serated, and it is spring assisted, for easy one handed opening. It has grip-tape style grips, and it is very sharp. I don't carry it because I think I'll end up using it in a fight. I carry it in case I have to cut someone out of their seatbelt, removed bloodsoaked parts of clothing, cut myself out of something, etc. There are perfectly good reasons for carrying a knife, but in conjuction with 3 guns, fighting isn't one of them.
A knife is a weapon and a deadly weapon at that.

Some people should remain silent instead of showing how little they know.
 

Johnny Law

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 6, 2007
Messages
462
Location
Puget Sound, ,
imported post

Mjolnir wrote:
expvideo wrote:
I hate it when people act as though knives are weapons. At this point, if you have level III body armor, a handgun, a BUG, a rifle, and extra ammo, why are we talking about carrying 1-2 knives for hand to hand combat?

A knife is a tool for cutting. I carry a nice kershaw knife. It has a tanto blade, half serated, and it is spring assisted, for easy one handed opening. It has grip-tape style grips, and it is very sharp. I don't carry it because I think I'll end up using it in a fight. I carry it in case I have to cut someone out of their seatbelt, removed bloodsoaked parts of clothing, cut myself out of something, etc. There are perfectly good reasons for carrying a knife, but in conjuction with 3 guns, fighting isn't one of them.
A knife is a weapon and a deadly weapon at that.

Some people should remain silent instead of showing how little they know.
No one thought twice about boxcutters before September 11th either.
 

Springfield45

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 17, 2007
Messages
299
Location
South Central Pennsylvania
imported post

Johnny Law wrote:
Mjolnir wrote:
expvideo wrote:
I hate it when people act as though knives are weapons. At this point, if you have level III body armor, a handgun, a BUG, a rifle, and extra ammo, why are we talking about carrying 1-2 knives for hand to hand combat?

A knife is a tool for cutting. I carry a nice kershaw knife. It has a tanto blade, half serated, and it is spring assisted, for easy one handed opening. It has grip-tape style grips, and it is very sharp. I don't carry it because I think I'll end up using it in a fight. I carry it in case I have to cut someone out of their seatbelt, removed bloodsoaked parts of clothing, cut myself out of something, etc. There are perfectly good reasons for carrying a knife, but in conjuction with 3 guns, fighting isn't one of them.
A knife is a weapon and a deadly weapon at that.

Some people should remain silent instead of showing how little they know.
No one thought twice about boxcutters before September 11th either.
 

openryan

State Researcher
Joined
Apr 18, 2007
Messages
1,602
Location
, Indiana, USA
imported post

Johnny Law wrote:
Mjolnir wrote:
expvideo wrote:
I hate it when people act as though knives are weapons. At this point, if you have level III body armor, a handgun, a BUG, a rifle, and extra ammo, why are we talking about carrying 1-2 knives for hand to hand combat?

A knife is a tool for cutting. I carry a nice kershaw knife. It has a tanto blade, half serated, and it is spring assisted, for easy one handed opening. It has grip-tape style grips, and it is very sharp. I don't carry it because I think I'll end up using it in a fight. I carry it in case I have to cut someone out of their seatbelt, removed bloodsoaked parts of clothing, cut myself out of something, etc. There are perfectly good reasons for carrying a knife, but in conjuction with 3 guns, fighting isn't one of them.
A knife is a weapon and a deadly weapon at that.

Some people should remain silent instead of showing how little they know.
No one thought twice about boxcutters before September 11th either.
Are you saying nobody ever thought of the idea that a box cutter could be used as a weapon? Well, techincally... I'll bet the terrorists came up with the idea at least on 9/10... so that would make you incorrect:?.

A knife could be a good weapon in hand to hand combat, but how do you suppose you are going to be in hand to hand combat in a shooter scenario? I'm sure someone will come up with some type of scenario where a knife would be useful...

You would have to run out of ammo at the same time, otherwise you are shooting him, or he is shooting you.
 

Mjolnir

Regular Member
Joined
May 17, 2007
Messages
469
Location
, , USA
imported post

I should go back and find the threads here about the Omaha shooter and where it was said that you would be a fool to engage a hostile shooter with a AK when all you have is a pistol.

However, just a couple days later a armed CCWing female Warrior engaged a active shooter in a Church with a pistol when the shooter had some kind of semi automatic rifle.

Oh and the female won & the active shooter lost.

Mindset and training goes a long way............................................
 

expvideo

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 8, 2006
Messages
1,487
Location
Lynnwood, WA, ,
imported post

Mjolnir wrote:
I should go back and find the threads here about the Omaha shooter and where it was said that you would be a fool to engage a hostile shooter with a AK when all you have is a pistol.

However, just a couple days later a armed CCWing female Warrior engaged a active shooter in a Church with a pistol when the shooter had some kind of semi automatic rifle.

Oh and the female won & the active shooter lost.

Mindset and training goes a long way............................................
If you are talking about my comment on engaging an ak shooter with a pistol, you are taking it WAY out of context. The question was whether you would shoot him in the back, and I said that waiting for him to turn around when he has an AK and you have a pistol is bad tactics. I never said that you shouldn't engage the shooter, I said that in a head-on fight between an AK and a pistol, the AK has much better odds. I never said anything about running away, I said that you have to use tactics to your advantage or you will lose.
 

Marco

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2007
Messages
3,905
Location
Greene County
imported post

she was at the right place at the right time and was willing to do what was needed.
 

Johnny Law

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 6, 2007
Messages
462
Location
Puget Sound, ,
imported post

Agent19 wrote:
she was at the right place at the right time and was willing to do what was needed.
There is another fact that everyone here seems to have forgotten. She was a former cop. For several years now there has been a nationwide active shooter training program in place that all agencies are sopposed to be participating in. For the last four years my agency has had an outstanding training program in place, and I will wager that Assam had been through active shooter training herself. She may not have been a cop at that point in time, but she still had the training and skills learned. Mindset is also ahuge part of it, as some have mentioned earlier.

Going up against a rifle, armed with only a pistol is far less than ideal, but using good tactics, the job can be accomplished.
 
Top