The recent issues in Oly

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Again, I would like to thank all for their support. Now that considerable venting has gone on, I would like to ask everyone to take a deep breath. We're all angry, very angry but this is also creating an impression that a bunch of angry guys with guns are going to descend upon Olympia and wreak havoc.

I am taking sufficient steps to ensure the protection of my rights, and to address the disturbing issues that were raised. Suffice it to say I am not planning to let this go unchallenged. Wheels move slowly, and as I am moving into my work week somewhat slower. To make things more fun my laptop monitor died on my and I have to lug a big 17" CRT up to the laundry room to get a Wi-Fi signal. Yes, I know some techincal fixes and am also getting a new laptop this week (I hope) My phone is out of airtime until I get paid again Thursday. So between work and communication issues, I am a bit sluggish. The OPD and the entire city have been swamped by the reactions from the Port Protests. Sadly I have gotten tossed up on top of the heap with all the other complaints, this is a hurdle I will have to overcome.

As I have mentioned, I have requested a meeting. I don't know when this will happen, but I will do everything I can to ensure that it can. Right now the whole dang city government knows what is going on. What happens next depends on how well I can "pitch" my side. I am a sales professional, so this comes easy. I just have a more interesting audience, and I'm not playing for commission this time.

If needed, I will get a lawyer. Right now, a little bit of relaxtion is good for the soul. I'm still pretty pissed, but I have a few more cards I haven't played.

I read in a book somewhere, that the favored weapon of the West was not the sixgun, but the lawsuit. I hope my carrying one will not lead to the other.

Thanks again for the solidarity and support. I look forward to a dinner meeting. I am wondering if we should invite a cop?

Steve

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O'neil will probably be there invited or not.

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I think that is a great idea, it might go a long way to building bridges to invite some of the rank and file to the lunch.

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Just make sure there is someone there with a Video Camera recording the whole event!

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Look, I would love to get all warm and fuzzy with OPD but I would rather have Lunch/dinner with a bunch of OC'ing dudes for BBQ and argue the merits of auto vs. revolver. Let's leave the Police love fest till we have our ducks in a row, legally. I will bring a camcorder too in case OPD wants to talk to us. I do note that we were asked in the letter to both not come to Olympia and not to talk to the OPD about Open carry. If we at least obey one and talk to them later. Frankly, I think the only answer is a lawsuit, but who knows. Let's just have lunch/dinner and talk guns.

Glocks are revolvers that jam.:celebrate

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If you get a meeting take a lawyer with you. The meeting should be civil and polite. But your lawyer should explain that you will not tolerate repeated threatening stops by police who are supposed to be there to protect you. You are after all entitled to as much protection as anyone else. He might also explain that while other people have rights those rights are not superior to yours.You should be afforded equal protection under the law. Making these points yourself is not sufficient. For them to have any weight you will need to have an attorney present. If they feel threatened ask them how you must have felt having a gun pulled on you and being threatened with the full weight of the Olympia Police Department.

I do not have a lot but I would be willing to donate some money to help pay for the attorney to attend such a meeting.



irfner

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Wheelgunner wrote:

Look, I would love to get all warm and fuzzy with OPD but I would rather have Lunch/dinner with a bunch of OC'ing dudes for BBQ and argue the merits of auto vs. revolver. Let's leave the Police love fest till we have our ducks in a row, legally. I will bring a camcorder too in case OPD wants to talk to us. I do note that we were asked in the letter to both not come to Olympia and not to talk to the OPD about Open carry. Let's just have lunch and talk guns.

Glocks are revolvers that jam.:celebrate

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I'm not getting all warm and fuzzy here, but if there is an impression a bunch of angry armed guys with grudges and chips on their shoulders (Yeah, I know I'm describing OPD ) then I'm going to get the brunt of the backlash. I am simply trying to show we are a bunch of decent guys. Besides, I am genuinely curious if a cop will show up and play nice. They already know what we are doing, so I figure rather than have one sneak around and watch us, to play Mr. Nice guy and put a burden on them.

I'm not finished yet, but I have a couple of chores to do tomorow, and they involve speaking with people where I work...

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irfner wrote:

If you get a meeting take a lawyer with you. The meeting should be civil and polite. But your lawyer should explain that you will not tolerate repeated threatening stops by police who are supposed to be there to protect you. You are after all entitled to as much protection as anyone else. He might also explain that while other people have rights those rights are not superior to yours.You should be afforded equal protection under the law. Making these points yourself is not sufficient. For them to have any weight you will need to have an attorney present. If they feel threatened ask them how you must have felt having a gun pulled on you and being threatened with the full weight of the Olympia Police Department.

I do not have a lot but I would be willing to donate some money to help pay for the attorney to attend such a meeting.



irfner

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Thanks for the offer of help, I believe I will be fine. I'm not talking about everything I am doing behind the scenes, but suffice it to say I am taking a lot of advice.

This is more a lunch or dinner get together. I think the OPD is not happy with us stuffing our faces with good food and having a BS session. Honestly, the last thing I want to do while matching faces to the names I have seen here is talk about this crap much. Some, but I think we can all relax and just talk. I extended an olive branch to the OPD, mainly to throw the ball in their court. They are probably going to watch us, I hope to bring it out into the open.

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sv_libertarian wrote:

Wheelgunner wrote:

Look, I would love to get all warm and fuzzy with OPD but I would rather have Lunch/dinner with a bunch of OC'ing dudes for BBQ and argue the merits of auto vs. revolver. Let's leave the Police love fest till we have our ducks in a row, legally. I will bring a camcorder too in case OPD wants to talk to us. I do note that we were asked in the letter to both not come to Olympia and not to talk to the OPD about Open carry. Let's just have lunch and talk guns.

Glocks are revolvers that jam.:celebrate

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I'm not getting all warm and fuzzy here, but if there is an impression a bunch of angry armed guys with grudges and chips on their shoulders (Yeah, I know I'm describing OPD ) then I'm going to get the brunt of the backlash. I am simply trying to show we are a bunch of decent guys. Besides, I am genuinely curious if a cop will show up and play nice. They already know what we are doing, so I figure rather than have one sneak around and watch us, to play Mr. Nice guy and put a burden on them.

I'm not finished yet, but I have a couple of chores to do tomorow, and they involve speaking with people where I work...

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Funnier would be:

20 to 30 guys open carrying at various locations though-out Olympia at the same time, on the same day. All at very public street corners, all with a tea in their hand, all acting peacefully.

Each person has 1 friend with them, who has a video recorder and a disposable cash-pre-paid cell phone.

The friend calls in a 'man with gun' call to the police, then moves 30 or 40' away, flips on the camera and waits.

Gee, imagine 30 or 40 cops scurrying to 30 or 40 different street corners all at once to investigate a bunch of tea drinkers.

Morons. Tax money wasters.

*The above is of course all satire. I would of course not suggest or endorse civil disobediance over such a petty and meaningless thing as our CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS.

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I completely agree with your assesment of the situation at present. But, as an after thought, why not invite a reporter from the local rag. He / she need not oc but could be a voice from the wilderness if things were to go sour.

I can see the headlines now:

Jim

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I'm not angry, I just love BBQ.

I like the police. I respect them, depend on them, pray for them in the terrible and at times thankless job they have.

They are wrong in this harassment, however. As wrong as Bull Conner putting the fire-hoses to blacks who wanted to go to school, or as wrong as when they tried to block Concealed carry reform here in Washington state.


But this will not be won tomorrow, or in a year. We need to settle into a long termprogram of educationand reform.

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Funnier would be:

20 to 30 guys open carrying at various locations though-out Olympia at the same time, on the same day. All at very public street corners, all with a tea in their hand, all acting peacefully.

Each person has 1 friend with them, who has a video recorder and a disposable cash-pre-paid cell phone.

The friend calls in a 'man with gun' call to the police, then moves 30 or 40' away, flips on the camera and waits.

Gee, imagine 30 or 40 cops scurrying to 30 or 40 different street corners all at once to investigate a bunch of tea drinkers.

Morons. Tax money wasters.

*The above is of course all satire. I would of course not suggest or endorse civil disobediance over such a petty and meaningless thing as our CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS.



Damn it, That was going to be my suggestion!! Don't CALL the police though, that is a total no no. It ties up Police resources and is illegal. Fake calls to the cops is would prove everything OPD believes, plus land us in jail with no way out.

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Trigger Dr wrote:

I completely agree with your assesment of the situation at present. But, as an after thought, why not invite a reporter from the local rag. He / she need not oc but could be a voice from the wilderness if things were to go sour.

I can see the headlines now:

Jim

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Local rag? Hey! My jacket has the name of said local rag embroidered on it.:celebrate

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Dave_pro2a wrote:

Funnier would be:

20 to 30 guys open carrying at various locations though-out Olympia at the same time, on the same day. All at very public street corners, all with a tea in their hand, all acting peacefully.

Each person has 1 friend with them, who has a video recorder and a disposable cash-pre-paid cell phone.

The friend calls in a 'man with gun' call to the police, then moves 30 or 40' away, flips on the camera and waits.

Gee, imagine 30 or 40 cops scurrying to 30 or 40 different street corners all at once to investigate a bunch of tea drinkers.

Morons. Tax money wasters.

*The above is of course all satire. I would of course not suggest or endorse civil disobediance over such a petty and meaningless thing as our CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS.

Click to expand...

LOL! I could see the reaction:what:

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Wheelgunner wrote:

Funnier would be:

20 to 30 guys open carrying at various locations though-out Olympia at the same time, on the same day. All at very public street corners, all with a tea in their hand, all acting peacefully.

Each person has 1 friend with them, who has a video recorder and a disposable cash-pre-paid cell phone.

The friend calls in a 'man with gun' call to the police, then moves 30 or 40' away, flips on the camera and waits.

Gee, imagine 30 or 40 cops scurrying to 30 or 40 different street corners all at once to investigate a bunch of tea drinkers.

Morons. Tax money wasters.

*The above is of course all satire. I would of course not suggest or endorse civil disobediance over such a petty and meaningless thing as our CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS.



Damn it, That was going to be my suggestion!! Don't CALL the police though, that is a total no no. It ties up Police resources and is illegal. Fake calls to the cops is would prove everything OPD believes, plus land us in jail with no way out.

Click to expand...

How do you figure that reporting a "man with a gun" would be illegal if there really is a "man with a gun"?

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Bear 45/70 wrote:

Wheelgunner wrote:

Funnier would be:

20 to 30 guys open carrying at various locations though-out Olympia at the same time, on the same day. All at very public street corners, all with a tea in their hand, all acting peacefully.

Each person has 1 friend with them, who has a video recorder and a disposable cash-pre-paid cell phone.

The friend calls in a 'man with gun' call to the police, then moves 30 or 40' away, flips on the camera and waits.

Gee, imagine 30 or 40 cops scurrying to 30 or 40 different street corners all at once to investigate a bunch of tea drinkers.

Morons. Tax money wasters.

*The above is of course all satire. I would of course not suggest or endorse civil disobediance over such a petty and meaningless thing as our CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS.



Damn it, That was going to be my suggestion!! Don't CALL the police though, that is a total no no. It ties up Police resources and is illegal. Fake calls to the cops is would prove everything OPD believes, plus land us in jail with no way out.

Click to expand...

How do you figure that reporting a "man with a gun" would be illegal if there really is a "man with a gun"?

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Like I said, I would never endorse...

But anattorney might even say it could be legal.

And frankly, I care exactly as much about tying up 'valuable police resources' as the police do themselves.

If they value their resources so little, as to continually harass a tea drinking man, then I value their resources at that exact same level.

They sent a message all right.

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Dave_pro2a wrot

Like I said, I would never endorse...

But anattorney might even say it could be legal.

And frankly, I care exactly as much about tying up 'valuable police resources' as the police do themselves.

If they value their resources so little, as to continually harass a tea drinking man, then I value their resources at that exact same level.

They sent a message all right.

Click to expand...

Last time it was grasshopper cookies and a sci fi novel
I agree, fun satire to think about but not something to endorse or actually do.
A friend of mine I believe has found a solution. She said I am acting too normal for Olympia. I think she is right. I have decided to tie dye my holster and refinish my P89 in psychedelic colors with the Grateful Dead bears on the slide, and carry around an incoherent protest sign with me. They got swamped by all the port protesters and couldn't deal with them. One law abiding citizen with a gun drinking tea? Holy cow! Call the SWAT team, something bad is going down!
Blockade a military cargo shipment? Get charged with pedestrian interference. Legally and peaceably carry a gun? Get threatened and have weapons drawn. I'm about ready to give up and throw in with the hippies and anarchists:lol:

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As a counter-example to the OPD "debacle", I was studying at Sheri's on Aurora in Shoreline and OC'ing (as normal) when 4 state troopers walked in. Admittedly, I only saw three sit down, but when I went to the restroom, I passed right by the fourth and nary a word was said. Maybe he saw it, maybe he didn't, but I didn't attempt to conceal and they had more than enough chances to see it with me needing to go out to my car to grab a textbook. All they had to do was look out the window at me.

The manager there once talked to me and gave me the "are you LE?" line of questioning, but when I said I wouldn't conceal and wouldn't put it in my car, he allowed me to continue OC'ing and asked that I bring in the documentation I had referenced off the top of my head (the two documents we have of training bulletins and RCW's, plus the first article of the WA State Constitution). I brought those in for him and he was happy. I've OC'd there without issue ever since. Same thing with the Denny's in Redmond that we had issue with one time. Ryan, the manager there that talked to Lonnie, now has that same documentation and is happy tohave his policy in linewith state laws.

It's amazing how a little common sense, calm logic and a pleasant demeanor can ease a situation like that.