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Thread: Open Carry Poll *please vote*

  1. #1
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    http://www.publicopiniononline.com/index.html

    About halfway down on the Left Side...

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    Regular Member zoom6zoom's Avatar
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    Should it be legal in Pennsylvania to openly carry a handgun everywhere except schools and government buildings?
    Hard to know whether to vote yes or no on this one. I mean, I guess the answer we're looking for is yes, but the question needs to end before the "except".

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    zoom6zoom wrote:
    Should it be legal in Pennsylvania to openly carry a handgun everywhere except schools and government buildings?
    Hard to know whether to vote yes or no on this one. I mean, I guess the answer we're looking for is yes, but the question needs to end before the "except".
    I agree, but for right now we're just affirming that the current laws in PA that don't prohibit OC should remain intact.

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    OH GOD!!!!!
    The more important thing is the "Opinion" artical on that same page.. I copied and pasted it below... are you kidding me he actaully called it a piece...
    GO Greg GO! I hope he wins his appeal....


    OUR VIEW: Armed voting pushes limits of civility, common sense
    Just because we have the right to do something doesn't mean it's wise to exercise that right in every circumstance.
    Consider the recent dust-up between Sheriff Robert Wollyung and Chambersburg resident Greg Rotz, who showed up to vote Nov. 6 at a New Franklin polling place wearing a gun in a side holster.
    A constable at the polling place -- unarmed in accordance with the law -- cautioned Rotz against carrying his piece to the voting booths. Rotz declined the constable's suggestion that he leave his gun in his vehicle.
    Wollyung notified Rotz in a Nov. 7 letter that he was required to surrender his license to carry a firearm, according to court documents.
    Rotz has not been charged with any crime. He was technically within his rights to wear a gun while voting.
    As Americans and Pennsylvania residents, we claim many rights. We also have an obligation to make sure exercise of our rights does not infringe upon our neighbors.
    We have a right to free assembly, but not if it blocks public roads. We have a right to practice our religious beliefs, but not if such prevents others from doing the same.
    And we have the right to vote. If we do so in a manner that discourages free exercise of others' political will -- or makes them anxious doing so -- we may expect trouble.
    If government agents are barred from carrying guns at polling places to avoid the appearance of coercion upon the electoral process, citizens should be mindful that wearing their guns to vote may have the same effect.

    This is a matter of civility and respect for others.
    Regardless of whether it's warranted, the sight of a firearm in a crowded public place will make people nervous, especially if they do not know the person carrying.
    And while some who carry like to think they will be prepared if some monster shoots up a mall, just as many will lack the skills required to assess and deal with a threat while ensuring the safety of the innocent.
    Training can sharpen aim and technical skills, but nothing substitutes for experience, judgment, and level-headedness.
    In short, training cannot impart common sense.
    -- By Matthew Major, on behalf of Public Opinion's editorial board

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    southmedic wrote:
    OH GOD!!!!!
    The more important thing is the "Opinion" artical on that same page.. I copied and pasted it below... are you kidding me he actaully called it a piece...
    GO Greg GO! I hope he wins his appeal....
    My response to the editorial that cnan be read in the comments (You may have to refresh several times to get the "comments" link to appear):

    Lots of people do things that make lots of other people uncomfortable. So according to your logic, becasue people of Middle Eastern decent make people nervous these days (however unwarranted that reaction) they should be prevented from having the RIGHT to assemble and the RIGHT to travel?

    Because the sight of a young American dressed in ripped up clothing with piercings and tattoos and a wild hairstyle makes people nervous, they should be denied the RIGHT to express themselves?

    Because the sight of two men holding hands in public makes someone uncomfortable, homosexual people shoudl be denied the RIGHT to pursue happiness through a relationship of their choice?

    And last, but not least, becasue I am offended by your opinion, should you be denied the RIGHT to express it?

    It is Mr. Rotz's RIGHT to keep and BEAR arms. In the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, it is NOT ILLEGAL to carry a firearm openly. In our own constitution, in Section 21 it states simply "The right of the citizens to bear arms in defense of themselves and the State shall not be questioned."

    Like myself and many other people, Mr. Rots chooses to carry a firearm for Self Defense.

    It has been said before that "common sense" should tell you where you should and should not carry... One of the places mentioned was Churches. But that is easily proven wrong by recent events at the New Life Church in Colorado Springs, CO. Indeed Schools are also mentioned, but what you don't hear about is the incident at the Appalachian School of Law in 2002 where two armed students subdued a recently flunked student who decided to exact revenge on the school by coming onto campus and shooting.

    I carry my firearm, like Mr. Rotz, for Self Defense. I carry it Openly most of the time not becasue I want to make a statement, but becasue concealing it is physically uncomfortable for me. I carry it wherever I am allowed to by State Law. This includes Malls, Grocery Stored, Barber Shops, Drug Stores, Banks, Polling Places, Restaurants... Only once have I ever been confronted by Law Enforcement about my firearm, and that was due to a lack of understanding of the carry laws of the officers involved - very much like Mr. Rotz's encounter, except that I did not have my License to Carry Firearms revoked.

    And the most ironic thing of all - by revoking Mr. Rotz's License to Carry Firearms (LTCF), the Sheriff Wollyang has FORCED Mr. Rots to carry openly - for according to State Law AND Case Law: Com. V. Ortz 1996: "...in all other counties of Pennsylvania, weapons may be carried openly without a license, 18 Pa.C.S. section 6106."

    The only time a License to Carry is required is when the firearm is Concealed on or about your person, when the firearm is in a vehicle in a LOADED condition, OR when carrying openly "in a City of the First Class" of which the state has only one, Philadelphia.

    Not only has Sheriff Wollyang violated Pennsylvania State Law by revoking Mr. Rotz's LTCF, he has violated Mr. Rotz's Civil Rights both as defined by the State Constitution and the United States Constitution. Sheriff Wollyang should be the one going to court here, Not Mr. Rotz. To quote one of my firends "[Officials] should not editorialize against [lawful] open carry by private citizens in any way shape or form, or in any way suggest that a person should conceal their firearm. Suggestions and editorializing against lawful open carry may be interpreted as “commands” by civilians who are lawfully open carrying and may subject officers to complaints filed against them, as well as possible legal action against themselves and the department. The significance of this is borne in PA Code Title 18 §5301."

    Pa.C., T18, § 5301 reads: A person acting or purporting to act in an official capacity or taking advantage of such actual or purported capacity commits a misdemeanor of the second degree if, knowing that his conduct is illegal, he: subjects another to arrest, detention, search, seizure, mistreatment, dispossession, assessment, lien or other infringement of personal or property rights; or denies or impedes another in the exercise or enjoyment of any right, privilege, power or immunity.

    Now you tell me who was right or wrong.



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    Just added my vote - 80.67 percent are yes - 238 for yes.
    57 no votes making up 19.32 percent.

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    Hammering online polls is fun!

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    Regular Member Springfield45's Avatar
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    Just casted my vote

    Out of 471 Votes,

    364 votes or 77.28% said YES
    107 votes or 22.71% said NO


    ~~Springfield



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    lildobe wrote:
    http://www.publicopiniononline.com/index.html

    About halfway down on the Left Side...
    I think the wording is way off. It assumes that there is no right to do so at this point and the poll is asking for a change. Proper wording should let the reader know that the right exists already. Maybe like, "Do you agree or disagree with the existing law that allows citizens to carry weapons of self defense?"

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    Apparently, Censorship is alive and well, they seem to have cut off access to thecomments for that Opinion. I can't seem to get the link to appear on the page. Pravda anyone?

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    PavePusher wrote:
    Apparently, Censorship is alive and well, they seem to have cut off access to thecomments for that Opinion. I can't seem to get the link to appear on the page. Pravda anyone?

    A known issue with their page. Keep refreshing it and it will show up

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    "Training can sharpen aim and technical skills, but nothing substitutes for experience, judgment, and level-headedness."

    I'm glad to see when the BG gives-up, lays on the ground spread eagle and then 5 cops pounce on the guy kicking him, sluging him and taking out all their aggression on the BG is defined as level-headedness.

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    Regular Member Thundar's Avatar
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    zoom6zoom wrote:
    Should it be legal in Pennsylvania to openly carry a handgun everywhere except schools and government buildings?
    Hard to know whether to vote yes or no on this one. I mean, I guess the answer we're looking for is yes, but the question needs to end before the "except".
    +1

    I voted no. I mean do you want me to vote for victim disarmament zones?
    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitableand let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come . PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

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    Thundar wrote:
    zoom6zoom wrote:
    Should it be legal in Pennsylvania to openly carry a handgun everywhere except schools and government buildings?
    Hard to know whether to vote yes or no on this one. I mean, I guess the answer we're looking for is yes, but the question needs to end before the "except".
    +1

    I voted no. I mean do you want me to vote for victim disarmament zones?
    :quirky

    The poll was about whether the current open carry law in PA should be restricted or not...While poorly worded, a no vote just looks like you think no one should be allowed to open carry and the purpose of voting in these polls is to show people that there's support for OCiing

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    Founder's Club Member Tess's Avatar
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    Thundar wrote:
    zoom6zoom wrote:
    Should it be legal in Pennsylvania to openly carry a handgun everywhere except schools and government buildings?
    Hard to know whether to vote yes or no on this one. I mean, I guess the answer we're looking for is yes, but the question needs to end before the "except".
    +1

    I voted no. I mean do you want me to vote for victim disarmament zones?
    It's exactly for this reason they word poll questions the way they do. Better to leave this one alone.
    Laws alone can not secure freedom of expression; in order that every man present his views without penalty there must be spirit of tolerance in the entire population. -Albert Einstein

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