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Thread: NJ Recipe for "Instant Criminal"

  1. #1
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    Being that I'm a NJ native (not very proud of that), I thought I'd throw this little ditty out for your perusal and opinion.

    Talk amongst yourselves, I'm getting a little farklempt....

    http://www.njleg.state.nj.us/2006/Bi...00/2431_I1.PDF


  2. #2
    State Researcher dng's Avatar
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    And NJ moves closer to socialism... Isn't that a great piece of legislation? Punish the law abiding, that makes sense!

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Sounds a like like Natzi Germany to me!
    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Care to explain the difference between this law and previous? It prohibits carrying of guns in public. In New Jersey. So what's new about that?

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    I think they redefined "illegal weapon" to include ALL handguns, even the legally owned ones. And then they added if the legally owned handgun was ANYWHERE in your private vehicle it's considered an "illegal weapon" The way that this act reads is that although you're permitted to own a handgun legally, if you're caught with it you're dogmeat.

    1. a. As used in this section:

    “Prohibited firearm” means any handgun, sawed-off shotgun,

    assault firearm or machine gun.

    “Public place” means any place to which the public has access,

    including but not limited to a public street, sidewalk, bridge, alley,

    plaza, park, boardwalk, driveway, parking lot or transportation

    facility, educational institution, public library, shopping center or

    mall or the doorways and entrance ways to any building which

    fronts on any of these places, or a motor vehicle in or on any such

    place.

    18 b. Unless otherwise permitted by law, a person commits a crime

    19 of the second degree if, while in or on a public place, he knowingly

    20 carries a prohibited firearm on or about his person, or otherwise

    21 possesses the prohibited firearm within his immediate reach or in

    22 any portion of a motor vehicle in which he is traveling.

    Now the tricky part: What is "otherwise permitted by law"? Carry permit? Police/Military only? Who knows!

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    Regular Member Bubba Ron's Avatar
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    I'd love tocross paths with a NJ LEO while he or she was visiting in Virginia, the look on their face from seeing a lowly citizen with a GUN on their side would belike an E-ticket at Disney World

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    Regular Member Decoligny's Avatar
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    U.S. CODE Title 18, Part I, Chapter 44, §926A. Interstate transportation of firearms
    Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver’s compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console.


    The above referenced US Code trumps any and all State, County, City, Town, or Village Laws. If you are legally allowed to have a firearm at place A, and want to go to place B, and want to take your gun, then follow the above.

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    Are you willing to test that theory? Here's one guy who did...

    http://www.anjrpc.org/ANJRPC-vs-PortAuthority.pdf

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    Evil Ernie wrote:
    Are you willing to test that theory? Here's one guy who did...

    http://www.anjrpc.org/ANJRPC-vs-PortAuthority.pdf
    HOLY CRAP. I just read the first paragraph thinking it'd be boring, and got sucked it. I used to be not 5 miles from the Essex County Jail in Newark, and not much farther from the Airport. I can't believe all the b.s. this guy got put through, and in the end of it all he still hasn't received his firearm or ammunition back.
    -Unrequited

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    Regular Member Decoligny's Avatar
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    Evil Ernie wrote:
    Are you willing to test that theory? Here's one guy who did...

    http://www.anjrpc.org/ANJRPC-vs-PortAuthority.pdf
    I see that he filed. I don't see any results of his filing. From what is shown here, he well may have been awarded damages, but without any other documentation all we have here is someone filing against the Port Authority for violating U.S. Code under color of law.

    Just because a cop arrests you for something doesn't mean that thing is illegal. And that's what my original post was meant to show. The U.S. Code is SUPPOSED to trump N.J. Code.

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    And you are correct in saying that it's "supposed" to trump it. And it does! But at what cost? Sure there's avenues of recourse and redress, but this poor fellow got screwed! This is one of the reasons I left NJ, too many bad militaristic LEO's that don't even have the common courtesy to return a "good morning" at the coffee shop. In the 17 yrs that I lived there, not one officer replied in kind to a simple greeting. It was always an immediate move to a combat ready stance. If you locked eyes in passing, they would shake you down. Didn't matter what age, color, or gender.


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    I was and am friends with many cops in Bergen County where I grew up, and they were friendly to a T. Of course yes you had the high on a horse type guys, but that wasn't the majority. Most were small-town cops making $70k+ after 3 years sitting in a car all day making sure kids on bikes didn't cross the street without looking.

    ...I then went to college in Newark, where it was a bit different. The cops used to come over to give us noise violations to the fraternity house, but honestly, and there are pictures, we'd use to invite the cops in at the end of the night and they'd play a game or two of Beirut (Beer Pong). The girls were old enough, the cops were young enough, and we all had a fun ass time. I can remember on two separate occasions where the cops had to leave mid-game because of a shooting. Newark's a hell of a place.

    The only guys I ever had a problem with were the State Troopers, but ironically enough, most of the cops I still talk to in Jersey are troopers.
    -Unrequited

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    Regular Member Decoligny's Avatar
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    Evil Ernie wrote:
    And you are correct in saying that it's "supposed" to trump it. And it does! But at what cost? Sure there's avenues of recourse and redress, but this poor fellow got screwed! SNIP
    As I mentioned, it doesn't say what the final outcome was, so we don't know he got screwed. If he wins his suit, then NJ screwed itself to the tune of 3.1 MILLION Dollars.

    Enough of these kind of settlements and NJ might just get their heads out of ....the dark.

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    Evil Ernie wrote:
    Are you willing to test that theory? Here's one guy who did...

    http://www.anjrpc.org/ANJRPC-vs-PortAuthority.pdf
    I just read that...this is OUTRAGEOS.

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    Campaign Veteran Dutch Uncle's Avatar
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    New Jersey is a socialist toilet. The state government is notoriously corrupt and mob-influenced. It should come as no surprise that rogue cops can get away with outrageous behavior with little or no consequence.

    The entire government should be investigated for being a RICO violator.

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    WOW :what:



    IfI ever fly that way it, I wont be stopping in NJ

    I hope he gets/got $3.1M


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    All this sounds eerily familiar...

    -ljp

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    Regular Member Thundar's Avatar
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    IANAL but, If the supreme law of the land is the constitution and the Supreme Court has recognized immediate access to firearms for legitimate self defence, would access to a handgun for self defence be permitted by the supreme law of the land, thus negating most charges based upon the " unless otherwise permitted by law clause?
    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitable–and let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come …………. PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

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    Regular Member Sonora Rebel's Avatar
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    New Jersey (et al) has been in violation of the US Constitution since prob'ly the end of the Revolution. It's a blatent denial of a citizens Right to self defense. You vote these people into office over and over again expecting a different result?

    New Jersey tourists 'n newcomers here freak out when they see somebody (like me) with a gun on their hip. :what:Welcome to the WILD WEST pard!

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    Campaign Veteran Bookman's Avatar
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    Evil Ernie wrote:
    Are you willing to test that theory? Here's one guy who did...

    http://www.anjrpc.org/ANJRPC-vs-PortAuthority.pdf
    It would be interesting to know how this one turned/turns out. I tried to find out, but the most recent thing I could find was a ruling on a motion from August of last year.
    "All that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke


    "I like people who stand on the Constitution... unless they're using it to wipe their feet." - Jon E Hutcherson

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    NoGunNJ wrote:
    Evil Ernie wrote:
    Are you willing to test that theory? Here's one guy who did...

    http://www.anjrpc.org/ANJRPC-vs-PortAuthority.pdf
    I just read that...this is OUTRAGEOS.
    +1

    i hope he can bankrupt NJ

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    New Jersey is a toilet. I know, I was a subject of the state for almost 40 years. I luckly found enough riches there and escaped to the Independent Republic 5 years ago and have never looked orgone back. Years ago I was traveling the turnpike and was stopped for speeding. I was on my way to a pistol match in north jersey and had my gear properly stored as per jersey law. At the stop the trooper was given my documentation and informed by me about my gear and why I was transporting it. With no field sobriety test he arrested me for DUI, impounded my car and confiscated my gear. At the turnpike state police building I had the oportunity to blow the box and vindicate my sobriety as beingcompletely clean. I was charged then with weapons offenses. After an overnight incarseration I was released OR and given a court date. Having no criminal history and a clean driving record my lawyer was able to get the DA and judge to agree to enroll me in the states PTI program which lasted for one year. Othe than the programs restrictions the only other condition I had to agree to was to surrender my brand new Colt Double Eagle .45 to the state, or face five years in prison. I hope the judge liked it. I never did the prison time, and I never saw my Colt again. No words can describe how I enjoy a smooth mellow life here in South Carolina with my cwp and soon to be able to open carry! I really don't think there can be many places worse than zoo jersey.

    Carry All:celebrate

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    Regular Member Sonora Rebel's Avatar
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    What is a PTI program? BTW... you were 'victimized' royally! You did the right thing by gettin' OUT! Man... I'd be pissed. I'll NEVER go east again... for any reason.

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    PTI is short for "Pre-Trail Intervention". It is used to keep first time offenders out of the criminal justice system. As I had never, and still do not have any criminal convictions to this date, I was eligible for this program. I was 35 years oldwhen this occurred. AfterI had completed the year of probation I applied for a nj permit to purchase, because a friend of mine had a relative pass away and he was executor of the will. The deceased family member had a precursor to the Browning 1911. He had a model 1905. AsI collect historicmilitary firearms he knew I would want this for my collection. My local chief of police denied methe permit and I appealed to the u.s. superior court in camden nj. The judge upheld the police chief 's ruling based upon my arrest without conviction of the earlier charges. But in order to due so the judge also had todeclare that his decision was based upon him determining me to be a threat to the general welfare and safety of society. So here I now live in SC and have a cwp and the state of SC has never had a problem with me, nor did zoo jersey. zoo jersey just wanted to keep an antique firearm out of one of it's subjects hands.
    Carry All

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    A buddy of mine in the Marine Corps Reserve was heading home to Medford, NJ, from drill one Sunday afternoon. He was wearing his uniform utilities, and had a bunch of 782 gear in his car, which we were all issued, including a cartridge belt, H-harness, helmet, etc.

    He also had an empty pistol holster, his M9 being in the armory at the drill center where it belongs.

    He got pulled over and when the cop saw the holster he demanded to know where the pistol was. My buddy tried to tell him it was in a government armory in Pennsylvania, and that he was coming home from drill (see the uniform, duh?), but the cop used the holster as an excuse to search the car and fish around for something. Fortunately he didn't find anything.

    That was back in the mid-90s. Secondhand story, of course, but it agrees with other NJ stories I have heard, although I don't know if this was state police or local.

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