Raleigh area OC

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woohoo! amonition! I've gotta ask, why the high-priced buckshot and slugs? I was talking to a few guys this weekend, and we came to the general consensus that buckshot is buckshot. I solidified that opinion today shooting at 2-liters filled with water kinda puts things into perspective.

Come to think of it, we had that same conversation regarding pistol rounds. I had been carrying federal hydra-shoks. I went to buy some more this weekend, and they were fresh out, and there aren't any HSTs around here, either. So I ended up buying a box of plain ol' federal hollow-points. Again, the final consensus was a hole is a hole is a hole, and they all make pretty big holes.

Not trying to knock your choice. If money wasn't an issue I'd carry what you've got as well, but that crap gets expensive quick! I'm wondering how much is REALLY gained in performance when you spend that much more, ya know?

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Actually the Federal Tactical Buckshot and Winchester Ranger Slugs weren't too expensive at all. The difference with the Federal Buckshot is their "FliteControl Wad." I've read that people are keeping all 9 pellets within the head of a target sihouette at 17yds with a short barrel (Somewhere in the 18.5" or 20" range) Mossberg 500. You can get an 8 pellet as well, which only comes in low recoil IIRC, which puts it out at ~1150fps. The 9 pellet can be LR or full power, ~1350fps I believe, but these are the LR version @ ~1150fps. I like having fewer buckshot pellets in a denser pattern, less chance of a pellet missing, and with the lower velocity, hopefully a missed pellet wont go as far or get through as much. Both the LR Ranger Slugs and Federal LE Tactical Buckshot have been proven in combat. I was reading a nice article about using them in afghanistan and the consensus seems to be that both of these are top of the line shotgun rounds. The Ranger hollow point slugs, even though they're LR, apparently do some horrific damage to organic targets. I figure I don't need any more power, it will just increase the overpenetration potential. The buckshot was $16/25rds and the slugs were $30/50rds.

The 115gr +P+ Winchester Rangers were $18/50rds and the 124gr Hydra-Shok (+P+) and 124gr HST (+P) were about $20/50rds. I paid way less than what I would have for "Personal Defense" ammo of similar quality. Even a 20rd box of gold dots will run ya $20 these days.

I don't think Federal's HST or any +P or +P+ Hydra-Shoks are sold to the public, these were all the "LE only" rounds. The Winchester Ranger's definitely aren't, they're supposedly the third generation of the "infamous" black talon. I can tell you they are awesome though, this round supposedly puts the 115gr reverse taper jacket HP out at 1335fps, with very little recoil and so little muzzle flash I could barely notice it firing at dusk. The Winchester Ranger is some great ammo IMO. If you find a place to order some for a good price, I'd certainly go for it, but you wont find it in a store. :?


Check out the top left corner of the Federal ammo box and the front of the Winchester.

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Are those .308's as well? Where is your rifle?

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They're 7.62x39mm, so yeah basically the same diameter. It's a box with 500rds of Wolf 122gr JHPs and on top are 20rds of chinese surplus steel core armor piercing on SKS stripper clips (Imported pre-ban). They will be used in an SKS, but it's a friend's. My rifle is a 5.56x45mm "pistol." It usually hangs out with a few 30rd mags of Black Hills 55gr hollow points to keep it company.

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What make of weapon is that ?

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THAT is a Kel-tec PLR-16 Semi-automatic 5.56 pistol. Neat little sucker, ain't she? I'm considering purchasing one myself in the long run. It would be very nice for for Mr. 9mm to bring that to the get together I'm planning .

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Yeah I'm sure I'll bring it along with the G17, if the place we go allows shotguns I'll bring that too. Sometimes they have some different rules about shot and slugs. The range here wants you to put the target at like 70ft to do slugs, which I don't like using nothing but a front bead, I don't want to hit the target holder with a 1oz slug, lol! They want it to be under 25ft when firing shot, which of course is just fine with the short barrel anyway.

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I'd enjoy meeting up with some fellow NC OCDOers too, for a meal and if possible some fun at the range.

Greensboro and Raleigh work equally well.

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Well the range out here in Havelock is pretty awesome when it comes to shotguns and other-than-paper targets. They have a 200 yd target range with a pistol side and a rifle side, and then they have the shotgun area. The shotgun area is off to the side beyond the right lateral limit of the target range, surrounded by trees. There's a clearing for shooting skeet, and a few skeet throwers there. There's also a couple ofsteel knock-downs, random bowling pins, tires, and otherstuff. You can shoot ANY firearms down there, as long as you keep it down range. You can also shoot almost any target you want to bring out there (water bottles, phone books, soda cans, whatever) as long as you clean up after yourself.

Lately I've stayed off the target line and just hid down in the shotgun area away from everyone else, blowing up bottles and shooting steel targets. It's fun to say the least. (and only $8 an hour )

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Yeah that sounds like the ideal situation honestly. That way we can test out all of this ammo on some fun targets.

For example, this phone book isn't talking anymore....

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Almost picked up a PLR 16 this weekend at the show in Charlotte. How's the recoil?

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.40 Cal wrote:

Almost picked up a PLR 16 this weekend at the show in Charlotte. How's the recoil?

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Well maybe if you came out to the get-together you could find out!

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With the AR style muzzle brake/flash suppressor it is just fine. It feels "powerful," and it sounds great (Think BOOOM), but it's a long lasting push rather than a quick snap. It also has almost no muzzle rise, so the push is almost entirely straight back. The AR style brake/flash suppressor seems to completely remove muzzle flash. I've yet to really see any kind of flash with the ammo I'm using. It is highly viable as an interior defensive weapon, just note that it's gonna get loud. I'd prefer it over something like an AR for interior defensive purposes, as it's much shorter, while still being more controllable than your average handgun and it puts out 5.56mm ammo at pretty good velocities. I'd expect maybe 2600-2700fps with most "normal" ammo.

If I need maximum power, the low recoil 9 pellet and/or the 1oz slugs are coming out.

Another nice thing is that with a single point sling, the PLR could feasibly be slung over the shoulder as one sidearm, the G17 can be on the hip, and then you can carry the H&R Pardner. I can't imagine a situation that dire, but if you ever needed to get out fast and carry as much firepower as possible with you, like Katrina or something, it is offers a lot of firepower in a much smaller, lighter package.

Also note that it is piston operated, and doesn't get quite as filthy as quickly.

As gunblast says

While the short barrel does sacrifice some velocity, it does not lose as much as I expected. For example, ball ammo that clocked 3088 feet-per-second (fps) from a sixteen inch barreled AR-15, still achieved a respectable 2670 fps from the short-barreled Kel-Tec.

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Without the muzzle brake it seems to kick a bit and makes some nice flames, but I haven't tried it that way. If you want, check out this video (No muzzle brake in this one):

http://www.gunblast.com/images/Kel-Tec_PLR-16/Kel-Tec.mpg

This video is from the factory, and will show it without a muzzle brake and with Kel-Tec's PLR specific muzzle brake, which seems to almost completely remove any kind of movement when firing. It's very well tuned from what I've seen, although I currently feel no need to upgrade the brake that's on there. Note the fact that it doesn't have the forend upgrade, an absolutely essential item IMO. A "pistol" that long and 3lbs to begin with, is quite hard to hold like a normal handgun, especially with a full 30rd magazine hanging off it. That's why when they use the 30rd mag it says "partially filled." I never understood that until I tried to hold it with one in there. The sling is also something I'd reccomend and I'm going to buy one as soon as they're back in stock at the store here.


http://www.kel-tec-cnc.com/videos/plr1.wmv

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I think it's ugly and you should get rid of it right now. In fact, I'll driv over and take it to the dump for you free of charge.

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Back on thread -
From what I've read (still looking for the source) Cary can be a problem for OCing. Anybody want to confirm that?

Yata hey

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Actually, Cary is not as bad as Chapel Hill. Chapel Hill has a local ordinance that does not permit OC of any firearm shorter than 6" in length.

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We have a thread in here in which someone asked the police (Cheif?) if they could OC in Cary, and the response was "No, and if you do, we're going to charge you with going armed to the terror."

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Weak 9mm wrote:

We have a thread in here in which someone asked the police (Cheif?) if they could OC in Cary, and the response was "No, and if you do, we're going to charge you with going armed to the terror."

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Ok, maybe we should have an OC get together in Cary, then

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Weak 9mm wrote:

We have a thread in here in which someone asked the police (Cheif?) if they could OC in Cary, and the response was "No, and if you do, we're going to charge you with going armed to the terror."

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That is exactly to what I was referring.

You need a law similar to what we are trying to get passed before the General Assembly in Richmond now.

http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?081+ful+HB371

A. No locality shall adopt or enforce any ordinance, resolution or motion, as permitted by § 15.2-1425, and no agent of such locality shall take any administrative action, governing the purchase, possession, transfer, ownership, carrying, storage or transporting of firearms, ammunition, or components or combination thereof other than those expressly authorized by statute. For purposes of this section, a statute that does not refer to firearms, ammunition, or components or combination thereof, shall not be construed to provide express authorization.

Hopefully this will make it all the way. It has strong backing and is off to a good start.


Yata hey