Its shaping up to start losing rights here folks

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Its shaping up from everyting I'm seeing that Barrack or Hilary might make it into office,..We gotta do what we can to stop this! More people need to take stands, campaign actively, tell friends,get friends to tell friends,get friends friends to tell freinds. If we all put our all into this,we can make a major impact, I'm a firm believer.

For instance:

I told my fiancee about Ron Paul along time ago,..I also told my roommate,best friend,and other various friends (alot of whom now have stickers on their cars,my roommate now has all his friends I see from time to time gung-ho,and have been telling me stories about their friends now being gung-ho,..)

She has now told 4 people about him,...

Those 4 people actively campaign and do what they can to actually save this country and our rights to bear and keep arms,...and they've roughly told 2-5 people each,..

Who have then told more people each,...

We can make a difference,there is still hope yet. We can't give up this early.

Get off yer tails and lets make this happen!

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I aggree that we need to more outgoing with out Dr. Paul support. And I truly believe that he will win PA because of all of the flair he has here. But on that note even if he doesn't win the nomination I'm just going to write in his name. If he is as truly popular I wish than he could still win.

However on a last note...

I am a little tired of the constant whinning about this election. Everyone has already consented to a Dem win for the oval office, but yet we haven't even gotpast the primaries. Everyone wanted to call Mcanable the winner after NH. I hear nothing but liberal this and commie that but yetI don't here enough people say anything more than RonaldReagan was the best.

Honestly people? RR was as good as it gets? I don't see how someone can demand to have their liberties tended to but betray another by demanding that theirs be outlawed. And yes I am specifically talking about gay rights and abortion. I hear a million to one people say they can have their firearms when they pry them from... (you know phrase) But in the same breath demand that mariage be kept to only straight couples. Its sickening to see people so easily trample the liberties of others while crying that their own is being taken away.

I can honestly say that I'm just about at the point where I hope people get whats coming to them....:cuss:

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I wouldn't get to upset if Clinton or any Dem wins. Remember what happened in 1994, it is a very big stick we hold and I believe we can hold the line. This is not to say we shouldn't work to get our people elected but lets not go off the deep end if the stupid party loses.

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I'm seeing more shades of 1976 if either of the dem leaders wins. It will be 4 very hard years, maybe even 6-7 very hard, lean years and a lot of what we love will be destroyed, but it could be the awakening the GOP needs for a truly conservative, freedom loving leader to step forward.

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While i understand that ron paul would be the best Candidate for president, i will not waste a vote on him. My whole family thinks he would be great, but they wont vote for him. They put it like this, a vote for Ron Pual, is one more vote that will help get a democrat into office. If you vote for someone who is non electable you will take votes away from those who stand a chance of being elected. A Macain/huckabee (cant spell johns last name lol HELP) might not be the best solution, but it is A hell of a lot better then Clintion/Osama.

We have to face the facts, we have to elect someone who is the least evil, and John Macain is least evil. Ron Pual can not be elected, he wasnt even a factor in the super tuesday, or any prior events. He Stands no chance of getting the republican nomination, and will not get any Ad time sponcered by the GOP party, Which will require his own personal money to run his Independent campaign. Which i doubt he has the cash to make a decent campaign all over the US with out the money of the GOP. Which means he stands a snowballs chance in hell of being elected.

I would love to have him be president, but i know that if i vote for him, thats one less vote for a viable republican who may get elected. Sure its not voting my heart, but its the best we can hope to do. We have to get a republican in office, at this point I dont think it matters who. Any repbulican is better then Clintion/Osama.

I just dont understand this and other gunforums hangup with wanting ron paul in office. If yestarday told you anything, you guys need to support a candidate who actually has a chance, so no votes get wasted and end up helping a democrap.

THis is exactly what the democraps want. They want us to be divided, and for a sizable amount of people to vote for non electable candidates which diverts much needed votes from those who are electable. Thus helping to ensure a democrap victory.

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Mordis wrote:

While i understand that ron paul would be the best Candidate for president, i will not waste a vote on him. My whole family thinks he would be great, but they wont vote for him. They put it like this, a vote for Ron Pual, is one more vote that will help get a democrat into office. If you vote for someone who is non electable you will take votes away from those who stand a chance of being elected. A Macain/huckabee (cant spell johns last name lol HELP) might not be the best solution, but it is A hell of a lot better then Clintion/Osama.

We have to face the facts, we have to elect someone who is the least evil, and John Macain is least evil. Ron Pual can not be elected, he wasnt even a factor in the super tuesday, or any prior events. He Stands no chance of getting the republican nomination, and will not get any Ad time sponcered by the GOP party, Which will require his own personal money to run his Independent campaign. Which i doubt he has the cash to make a decent campaign all over the US with out the money of the GOP. Which means he stands a snowballs chance in hell of being elected.

I would love to have him be president, but i know that if i vote for him, thats one less vote for a viable republican who may get elected. Sure its not voting my heart, but its the best we can hope to do. We have to get a republican in office, at this point I dont think it matters who. Any repbulican is better then Clintion/Osama.

I just dont understand this and other gunforums hangup with wanting ron paul in office. If yestarday told you anything, you guys need to support a candidate who actually has a chance, so no votes get wasted and end up helping a democrap.

THis is exactly what the democraps want. They want us to be divided, and for a sizable amount of people to vote for non electable candidates which diverts much needed votes from those who are electable. Thus helping to ensure a democrap victory.

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No offense, but it's the attitude you have that has caused much of the problem in today's society. Nobody votes for who they want in office anymore, it's who they DON'T want in office. That's a losing game if you ask me, and it's why I will be voting for Ron Paul; if that's "throwing my vote away", then so be it. At least I can hold my head up high and say "I tried my damndest". There really isn't any other candidate that I can put my hat into the ring for......even Huckabee, while he seems strong on 2A issues, his economic plan for this country just plain sucks.

If a Dem or McCain gets voted into office next time, and suddenly our lives go into the shitter more than they already are because of the economic crisis in this country and our rights are stripped away one by one, I have earned the right to bitch loud and hard because I tried to get the person I believed would solve these problems into the office; into a position where that person could do what they told us they would when running for President. If everyone did the same, as is SUPPOSED to happen in this country with the system of government we have in place, we would truly be a free people. Instead we let ourselves be enslaved to "the system" and the few that DO vote, either vote along party lines, vote how they think their friends, family, bosses, whatever, think they should, or vote AGAINST someone else, instead of voting FOR who they want in the office.

If Clinton or Obama gets into office in 09, there is plenty of blame to go around. None of it belongs to myself, or people like me who are voting for Ron Paul and going to the caucuses.

Again....I don't mean any offense....it's just a difference of opinion and something that gets me heated when I hear "don't throw your vote away!" No vote cast is a bad one.......if more people voted with their "heart" instead of their head, this country would be a lot more like what we are striving for.

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Don't vote for the personality (as you did in HS) but vote for the party and its principles.

The GOP is dead (Bush-41) dead (Bush-43) dead (McLame=sKerry).

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I will vote my Consience and my Constitution.

I'm tired of the same old same old and the parties doing business as usual. If theres any chance of real honest meaningful change that I believe to be right and just I will vote for it.

When it comes to "rights" remember they are not granted by man law or government. The Bill of Rights talks about natural inherent rights. I do not wish to trample others but let's face it the higher power that grants us the right to defend our lives and property is fairly moot on a lot of so called rights people think we have. This includes the definition of marriage. Special rights IS the problem. Everone wants something special.

If I kill a cop I'm punished differently than if i killed another "lesser" human. If I punch you in the nose because we've had an argument over a football game it's now a hate crime because your gay or a minority. This is simple murder and assault and theres no difference in the crime itself.

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Your missing my point, i agree with you. But if you vote for ron paul your basicly guarunteeing that a democrat wins. Ron paul has only him self to blame for not garnering any attention from the masses. I have yet to see any ads, tv or other wise for him anywere in the tri state area. Hell i wouldnt have known he existed if it wernt for the gun forums. He made an attemp to run for president with out the funds, or the support to do so. Now all he has done is succsessfully steal votes from electable candidates and ensure a democratic win.

I shouldnt have said it was wasting a vote, but sadly thats what it is. If you vote for ron paul, your might as well just sign up for the democratic party becuase you just helped get Clinton/Obama eleceted and thats a hell of a lot worse then any of the rebulican candiates.

We have to take what we can get, any republican is better then getting the clinton/obama supergroup into the oval office. Id love to vote for ron paul, but sadly i know that if do so, ill be helping the democratic party get the white house. At this point we have to take what we can get.

Why anyone would knowingly want to help the democrats get into office by voting for ron paul is just crazy. Sure he is the best man, but unfortunately time money and the universe and his inability for him to get any media attention or get his word out to the masses beyond the small gunforums online is what will prevent him from winning, and ensure a democratic victory.

The best way to ensure we have the best chance of maintaining what rights we have, with out gutting our millitary and 1st 2nd and 4th rights, is to elect any republican, and hopefully one that will veto all the junk the democratic controlled congress will spew out.

The last thing we need is for the democratic party to controll all three, the house senate and presidency. Any electable republican is better then that fate.

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I'm sorry, but I think you are totally wrong. Have you researched into exactly how much Ron Paul has made since he started campaigning for office? A hell of a lot. How can you say he doesn't have the funds, or the support? Funds, for sure. $20 million in ONE day? C'mon!

Do I agree it's getting down to the wire here? Yes. Is it going to be a tough fight to get Ron Paul into office? You're damn right; there are a LOT of parties that don't want his message to get out, to see him in office. Hence why you have seen NO TV ads, radio ads, etc. Why you haven't really seen him on CNN, Fox News, etc. The MSM doesn't want him in office because he represents a threat to their interests as a big business that profits on the scandalous things happening in our government today. What kind of entertainment (and I'm sorry, but the news is NOT about the news anymore, it's now ENTERTAINMENT) would it be if all the sudden the government did what the hell it was supposed to? What scandals could they blow out of proportion then; what would they report on? Many people using the downfall of our country as a way to get rich quick while the rest of us suffer would suddenly have to find real jobs as honest American workers. God forbid.

That's OK, you go ahead and vote for McCain or Huckabee.......when this country is bankrupt and owned by the Chinese, andour rights are a fond memory, there will be much blame to go around, and some of it will rest on the shoulders of those who touted to "not throw away your vote!" and those they've convinced of the same.

Thepeople of thiscountry will get EXACTLY the Presidentthey deserve in the next election.

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The fact that he only got 42 delegates, and mccain has over 200, should be a indicator that he has not campained very well at all. I just dont see how the chinese can own us. Not like they will try to invade us, our navy is alot stronger then theirs.

Sure id love to vote for ron paul, but fact of the matter is, he may have the money, but he sure as hell isnt getting his name out in any meaningfull way. i talked to alot of people here in IN, and almost none of them have heard of him. that should tell you something about the quality of his campaing.

We got to get what we can get. If we throw away our votes to minor candidates who'sonly going to get enough votes tohelp get hillary elected, and steal valuable votes from other electable candidtates, how the hell are we helping the country?

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Lets say you vote your mind and vote for ron paul. Good for you, but guess what, you accomplished nothing. In the end the democrats still won. Mccain would have had a shot, but to many voters went with ronpaul and in the end none of the republican candidates had enough to compete with the Hillary/Obama supergroup.

In that situation, which is more likely then one can imagine, alot of the blame rests on ron paul, and his supporters. First on ron paul for not doing everything he can to get into more of the debates, and then not getting any national media(tv news papers, magazine) coverage. Secondly i blame the ron paul supporters, cuase when it came down to it, twords the end they knew he couldnt be elected. Yet they voted for him anyways. Sure he may have gotten nearly 13% of the vote, but thats 13% that would have prevented Hillary/Obama from getting the whitehouse. Thank you Ron Paul supporters for electing Hillory/Obama, your voting your consious has allowed the democrats to win.

The above is a hypothetical situation that, IMHO is very likely to play out in the elections.

We need to get behind on candidate and ensure its a republican in the white house, not a democrat.

Sure, what i want is a President like Ron Pual, but what we as a country want, and what we can get are 2 vastly different things, we need to go after what is attainable not flights of fancy thinking a minor candidate has any real chance.


Its like all the morons and there SHTF threads on all the other forums. They ask whats the best gun. Everyone says, oh oh oh get the AR15/ak47/insert fav assult rifle here!!! When a good decent calibered Lever gun will more then suffice for any situation... but thats not the topic here...

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If you don't vote for Ron Paul it means you are afraid to be free and would rather have whatever else the system offers you. It is my understanding that hewas not even interested in running for the presidency but agreed to do so only after much pressure from grassroots enthusiasts- basically he was drafted.

I do not understand his campaign strategy either and the numbers have been disappointing but if he is the only one givingus choices, rather than telling us what he/she wants, thenwe should not let him down. Perhaps he isjust usingthe republicanparty as a stepping stone and banking his funds for the general election further down the line. Let's keep him in it for the long haul.

On another note, have you seen that Hillary was generous enough to lend her campaign $5 million to get over some bumps. I say, if she has that much money laying around, why doesn't she just finance her own run instead of leaching money from the public?

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Mordis wrote:

The fact that he only got 42 delegates, and mccain has over 200, should be a indicator that he has not campained very well at all. I just dont see how the chinese can own us. Not like they will try to invade us, our navy is alot stronger then theirs.

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No offense, but this is one of the most naive statements I've ever heard. Let me break a few things down for you, so that you can get a clear understanding of what our relationship with china is:

- We owe them several trillion dollars. If they call up that debt, our country will be completely bankrupt.
- We are borrowing even more from them to fund the Iraq war. Do you think they're going to fund our war with them?
- China has the largest population in the world and the fastest growing economy.
- China and Russia have both threatened to retaliate against us in the last year. Russia threatened us if we invaded Iran, and China threatened us if we invade Pakistan.
- We have tanked our economy and depleted our forces to the point of being ridiculous over a little country like Iraq.
- Russia and China have been training troops together for the last two years.
- Russia continually says threatening things to us, such as when we were arguing with them about us building a missile defense system in Poland, and our president responds by condescending them and saying that they are not a powerful country anymore.
- Russia and China have good reasons to allie together against us.
- Russia is helping Venezuela to create an AK47 manufacturing plant.
- Venezuela is the closest South American country to us, and is only separated from us by Cuba, which I don't think I need to comment on.
- The only thing that makes a land battle against the US a problem is the fact that we are on the western hemisphere and Russia and China's military supplies are on the eastern hemisphere. This is no longer a disadvantage, since Venezuela is manufacturing arms for them (note: "for them" is speculation on my part, but not far fetched)


You really think that our military, as broke and undermanned as they are, can hold off China? They're having enough trouble holding off Al Qaida! We've got a really bad superiority complex in this country. There is no way that we could hold off a Chinese invasion, especially since Russia would probably be tagging along.

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exp, What about our navy, surely all our battleships and such arnt in the middle east now. The chinease and russians still have to transport there troops here somehow. I feel our navy is strong enough to prevent there navy from every reaching our shores. I have a hard time believing that our entire navy is tied up in iraq. Surely we have a few thousand ships floating around some were?

Bottem line, they have to get there troops here first. Which means going through the best navy on earth.


Besides, no matter who we elect, there gonna pull us out of the war, and our boys will be home.

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Mordis wrote:

exp, What about our navy, surely all our battleships and such arnt in the middle east now. The chinease and russians still have to transport there troops here somehow. I feel our navy is strong enough to prevent there navy from every reaching our shores. I have a hard time believing that our entire navy is tied up in iraq. Surely we have a few thousand ships floating around some were?

Bottem line, they have to get there troops here first. Which means going through the best navy on earth.


Besides, no matter who we elect, there gonna pull us out of the war, and our boys will be home.

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Actually, McCain, who is looking like he will be the GOP presidential nominee, said that the Iraq war could last 100 years. Hillary wants to invade Iran, and Obama has a beef with Pakistan. the ONLY candidate who wants to bring our troops home is Paul. Don't mistake Democrats to be anti-war candidates. They are anti-IRAQ-war. Not anti-war.

And why would anyone invade our country from the sea? Millions of people cross our border illegally every year. Only a handful of them are caught. That is our strategic weakness and China knows it. Besides, a modern Airforce will always defeat a modern Navy in a head to head battle. The fact of the matter is that missilescan be accurately launched fromhundreds of miles away, and a navy ship does not have the ability toout manuversuch an attack, like a fighter jetcould. And China has one of the most powerful airforces in the world. Besides, I agree that a naval war against the US is a bad idea, but I doubt there will be one. It would be much easier to get into the country via air and land. Remember that this is not the 1700's. A naval assault is not the only way to get troops into the country anymore. Did you ever see Red Dawn? Granted, that was just a movie, but that doesn't mean that they didn't make a good point about being able to enter the country by means other than a Naval assault.

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compmanio365 wrote:

........Thepeople of thiscountry will get EXACTLY the Presidentthey deserve in the next election.

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I am afraid you are right on that one. The last moderate, Mitt Romney, who I didn't like but would prefer to McCain, just dropped out.

McCain and who ever he chooses to run with him will hand the election to his fellow Democrats. I will not vote for any of the current crop of Democrats, which means that I will not vote, rather than vote for McCain.



Tarzan

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expvideo wrote:

Besides, a modern Airforce will always defeat a modern Navy in a head to head battle.

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Dude, we'd kick the living crap out of the Chinese Air Farce P) before they knew what hit 'em.

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USAF_MetalChris wrote:

expvideo wrote:

Besides, a modern Airforce will always defeat a modern Navy in a head to head battle.

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Dude, we'd kick the living crap out of the Chinese Air Farce P) before they knew what hit 'em.

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If we can still afford jet fuel by then

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EXP i have never seen red dawn. I have a close friend in the navy, he is advancing ranks pretty quickly. Ill send him a letter asking his opinion on this very topic.(military strength that is).

Now, i have read alot of stuff about Ron Pual, and i support alot of what he says. But my concience says, that if i vote for him, ill just be helping the democrats. For me its a loose loose situation no matter how i vote. I vote my heart and go ron paul, and dems win. I vote mccain/huckabee and people still vote for R.P and dems still win.

Looking back on this discuss, it seems that no matter which path i choose, the outcome will suck either way.