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Thread: Open carry on a boat, an snowmobile, motorcycle??

  1. #1
    Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter Venator's Avatar
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    I writing an article for an outdoor publication and was wondering what the law was on openly carrying without a CPL on a fishing boat, Snowmobile, or motorcycle. I have heard comments that you can't open carry on a motorcycle as it's considered a vehicle, but what about the other two. You have to have a license for both, so I ask the question. Can ya?

    I will also be looking into it, but if someone has some citations I would appreciate it.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    This particular law says it's legal.

    750.227d Transporting or possessing firearm in or upon motor vehicle or self-propelled vehicle designed for land travel; conditions; violation as misdemeanor; penalty.

    Sec. 227d.
    (1) Except as otherwise permitted by law, a person shall not transport or possess in or upon a motor vehicle or any self-propelled vehicle designed for land travel a firearm, other than a pistol, unless the firearm is unloaded and is 1 or more of the following:
    (a) Taken down.
    (b) Enclosed in a case.
    (c) Carried in the trunk of the vehicle.
    (d) Inaccessible from the interior of the vehicle.
    (2) A person who violates this section is guilty of a misdemeanor, punishable by imprisonment for not more than 90 days, or a fine of not more than $100.00, or both.
    History: Add. 1981, Act 103, Eff. Mar. 31, 1982
    © 2007 Legislative Council, State of Michigan
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

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    Boat-must be unloaded until vehicle comes to a stop...

    ORV-Cycle-Snowmobile- Are considered a vehicle, must be unloaded in case ect.







    Motorcycle is under vehicle laws ..Plus can fall under ORV rules if used as such.

    ORV-324.81133 Operation of ORV; prohibited acts

    k) While transporting on the vehicle a bow unless unstrung or encased, or a firearm unless unloaded and securely encased, or equipped with and made inoperative by a manufactured keylocked trigger housing mechanism.

    --------------------------------------------------------

    Long gun catch all ----

    750.227c Transporting or possessing loaded firearm in or upon vehicle; violation as misdemeanor; penalty; applicability to person violating § 312.10(1)(g).



    Sec. 227c.

    (1) Except as otherwise permitted by law, a person shall not transport or possess in or upon a sailboat or a motor vehicle, aircraft, motorboat, or any other vehicle propelled by mechanical means, a firearm, other than a pistol, which is loaded.

    (2) A person who violates this section is guilty of a misdemeanor, punishable by imprisonment for not more than 2 years, or a fine of not more than $2,500.00, or both.

    (3) This section does not apply to a person who violates section 10(1)(g) of chapter II of Act No. 286 of the Public Acts of 1929, as amended, being section 312.10 of the Michigan Compiled Laws.


    History: Add. 1981, Act 103, Eff. Mar. 31, 1982

    ------------------------------------

    Allunder DNR rules......

    (4)"Vehicle "means every device in,upon,or by which any person or property is or may be transported,except devices exclusively moved by human power.

    324.40111 transporting or possessing .firearm in or upon vehicle;

    (2)Except as otherwise provided in this part or in a department order authorized under section 40107,a person shall not

    transport or have in possession a .firearm in or upon a vehicle,unless the .firearm is unloaded in both barrel and magazine and enclosed in a case,carried in the trunk of a vehicle,or unloaded in a motorized boat.

  4. #4
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    Michigander wrote:
    This particular law says it's legal.

    750.227d Transporting or possessing firearm in or upon motor vehicle or self-propelled vehicle designed for land travel; conditions; violation as misdemeanor; penalty.

    Sec. 227d.
    (1) Except as otherwise permitted by law, a person shall not transport or possess in or upon a motor vehicle or any self-propelled vehicle designed for land travel a firearm, other than a pistol, unless the firearm is unloaded and is 1 or more of the following:
    (a) Taken down.
    (b) Enclosed in a case.
    (c) Carried in the trunk of the vehicle.
    (d) Inaccessible from the interior of the vehicle.
    (2) A person who violates this section is guilty of a misdemeanor, punishable by imprisonment for not more than 90 days, or a fine of not more than $100.00, or both.
    History: Add. 1981, Act 103, Eff. Mar. 31, 1982
    © 2007 Legislative Council, State of Michigan
    THANKS! you are the best. This seems to cover open carry of a handgun. Seems to apply to bikes, snow mobiles, motorcycles, and boats.


    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    Ruger001 wrote:
    Boat-must be unloaded until vehicle comes to a stop...
    APPLYS TO LONG GUNS. YOU CAN HAVE A LOADED SHOTGUN WHILE DUCK HUNTING IN A MOVING BOAT. YOU JUST CAN"T SHOOT UNTIL THE FORWARD MOVEMENT CAUSED BY MOTOR OR SAIL OF THE BOAT HAS STOPED. YOU CAN DRIFT INTO A FLOCK OF DUCKS AND SHOOT.
    ORV-Cycle-Snowmobile- Are considered a vehicle, must be unloaded in case etc.


    NOT PISTOLS

    Motorcycle is under vehicle laws ..Plus can fall under ORV rules if used as such.

    ORV-324.81133 Operation of keylocked trigger housing mechanism.

    Long gun catch all ----

    750.227c Transporting or possessing loaded firearm in or upon vehicle; violation as misdemeanor; penalty; applicability to person violating § 312.10(1)(g).

    NOT PISTOLS

    Sec. 227c.

    (1) Except as otherwise permitted by law, a person shall not transport or possess in or upon a sailboat or a motor vehicle, aircraft, motorboat, or any other vehicle propelled by mechanical means, a firearm, other than a pistol, which is loaded.

    (2) A person who violates this section is guilty of a misdemeanor, punishable by imprisonment for not more than 2 years, or a fine of not more than $2,500.00, or both.

    (3) This section does not apply to a person who violates section 10(1)(g) of chapter II of Act No. 286 of the Public Acts of 1929, as amended, being section 312.10 of the Michigan Compiled Laws.


    History: Add. 1981, Act 103, Eff. Mar. 31, 1982
    Allunder DNR rules......

    (4)"Vehicle "means every device in,upon,or by which any person or property is or may be transported,except devices exclusively moved by human power.

    324.40111 transporting or possessing .firearm in or upon vehicle;

    (2)Except as otherwise provided in this part or in a department order authorized under section 40107,a person shall not

    transport or have in possession a .firearm in or upon a vehicle,unless the .firearm is unloaded in both barrel and magazine and enclosed in a case,carried in the trunk of a vehicle,or unloaded in a motorized boat.
    EXCEPT PISTOLS

    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    YOU CAN HAVE A LOADED SHOTGUN WHILE DUCK HUNTING IN A MOVING BOAT. YOU JUST CAN"T SHOOT UNTIL THE FORWARD MOVEMENT CAUSED BY MOTOR OR SAIL OF THE BOAT HAS STOPED. YOU CAN DRIFT INTO A FLOCK OF DUCKS AND SHOOT.

    You can not have a loaded shotgun in a movingboat!!!!!!! Section posted

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    Michigander wrote:
    This particular law says it's legal.

    750.227d Transporting or possessing firearm in or upon motor vehicle or self-propelled vehicle designed for land travel; conditions; violation as misdemeanor; penalty.

    Sec. 227d.
    (1) Except as otherwise permitted by law, a person shall not transport or possess in or upon a motor vehicle or any self-propelled vehicle designed for land travel a firearm, other than a pistol, unless the firearm is unloaded and is 1 or more of the following:
    (a) Taken down.
    (b) Enclosed in a case.
    (c) Carried in the trunk of the vehicle.
    (d) Inaccessible from the interior of the vehicle.
    (2) A person who violates this section is guilty of a misdemeanor, punishable by imprisonment for not more than 90 days, or a fine of not more than $100.00, or both.
    History: Add. 1981, Act 103, Eff. Mar. 31, 1982
    © 2007 Legislative Council, State of Michigan

    Meaning:

    Car, Motorcycle (on or off road), Boat and Snowmobile, with or without CPL, rifles and shotguns must be unloaded and, see Sec. 227d. With CPL loaded pistol is OK.

    Edit To Add: From MCRGO;







    To search Michigan Compiled Laws (MCL), visit:
    Michigan Compiled Law Search

    Q:
    I’m an avid boater living in Grand Haven, MI. It’s not unusual to be confronted by Coast Guard Personnel in full combat uniform. Once while having a conversation with a blue shirt I disclosed the fact that I had a concealed weapons permit and was in fact carrying a Colt Mustang 380. He looked shocked and asked if he could see it. I carefully complied. A friend of mine insists that I did not have to disclose the fact that I was carrying. I believe I had to because the Coast Guard is the only armed service of the United States that has arresting power and the fact that he had a sidearm (he had just stepped off his zodiac patrol craft). Am I correct?

    A:
    You asked a great question that I never thought about. It is really two questions.

    1. Are coast guard personnel “peace officers” so that you have to immediately disclose that you are carrying concealed, and;
    2. Can a person legally carry concealed in a motorized boat in Michigan?

    The carry concealed statute requires you to disclose that you have a concealed weapon “immediately” when you are stopped by a “peace officer”. A peace officer includes “… an individual who is employed as a law enforcement officer… by …the United States, and who is required to carry a firearm in the course of his or her duties as a law enforcement officer.” The armed Coast Guardsman was a ‘peace officer’ and you had to disclose the fact that you were armed immediately upon being stopped by him. The definition of stopped has not been clarified by the courts. Clearly if you are operating a watercraft are and stopped by a patrol boat you have to disclose. If you fishing off one of the large perch boats and the boat is stopped, you do not have to disclose. The breakpoint is someplace in the middle and I don’t know where it will be drawn by the courts. If on the dock and in casual conversation, I think it is wise to disclose to the officer that you have a concealed weapon, even if not legally required to do so. It is more difficult to say whether it is legal to carry concealed in a boat. Your CPL authorizes you to carry a concealed pistol anywhere in the state, “except as otherwise provided by law”. Michigan law, MCL 324.40111(2) states, “Except as otherwise provided in this part or in a department order authorized under section 40107, a person shall not transport or have in possession a firearm in or upon a vehicle, unless the firearm is unloaded … in a motorized boat.” Similar statutes outlaw the carrying of a loaded firearm in an ORV (MCL 324.81133) or in a snowmobile (MCL 324.82126(1). These statutes were designed to stop poachers from shooting game from a motor vehicle, motor boat, ORV or snowmobile. But, their terms do not limit enforcement to that situation. The DNR has issued a written guidance to its officers not to enforce the above statutes against anyone with a Concealed Pistol License unless the person is using the handgun to hunt from a motor vehicle, boat, ORV or snowmobile. This has not been formalized into a “department order” so it does not control anyone but Conservation Officers. There is no such barrier for any other peace officer. A police officer or deputy sheriff could arrest you for violation of the motor vehicle, motor boat, ORV or snowmobile statute. I believe that the carry concealed statute was intended to supercede these laws. But it did not do so explicitly. Hopefully the legislature will correct these contradictions.


    Based on the above "written Guidance", openly carrying should be OK. IMHO.

    And,

    28.425c
    Sec. 5c.

    (2)
    Subject to section 5o and except as otherwise provided by law, a license to carry a concealed pistol issued by the county

    concealed weapon licensing board authorizes the licensee to do all of the following:

    (a)
    Carry a pistol concealed on or about his or her person anywhere in this state.

    (b)
    Carry a pistol in a vehicle, whether concealed or not concealed, anywhere in this state.



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    The original question was "without a CPL"

    All of the info from MCRGO is if you have a CPL......



  9. #9
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    SpringerXDacp wrote:
    Michigander wrote:
    This particular law says it's legal.

    750.227d Transporting or possessing firearm in or upon motor vehicle or self-propelled vehicle designed for land travel; conditions; violation as misdemeanor; penalty.

    Sec. 227d.
    (1) Except as otherwise permitted by law, a person shall not transport or possess in or upon a motor vehicle or any self-propelled vehicle designed for land travel a firearm, other than a pistol, unless the firearm is unloaded and is 1 or more of the following:
    (a) Taken down.
    (b) Enclosed in a case.
    (c) Carried in the trunk of the vehicle.
    (d) Inaccessible from the interior of the vehicle.
    (2) A person who violates this section is guilty of a misdemeanor, punishable by imprisonment for not more than 90 days, or a fine of not more than $100.00, or both.
    History: Add. 1981, Act 103, Eff. Mar. 31, 1982
    © 2007 Legislative Council, State of Michigan

    Meaning:

    Car, Motorcycle (on or off road), Boat and Snowmobile, with or without CPL, rifles and shotguns must be unloaded and, see Sec. 227d. With CPL loaded pistol is OK.

    The above law makes an exceptionfor PISTOLS. So even without a CPL you can carry openly on the above vehicle.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    But is a not legal according to this law... Did not locate definition of "Vehicle" as used in this section.....

    750.227 Concealed weapons; carrying; penalty.



    Sec. 227.

    (1) A person shall not carry a dagger, dirk, stiletto, a double-edged nonfolding stabbing instrument of any length, or any other dangerous weapon, except a hunting knife adapted and carried as such, concealed on or about his or her person, or whether concealed or otherwise in any vehicle operated or occupied by the person, except in his or her dwelling house, place of business or on other land possessed by the person.

    (2) A person shall not carry a pistol concealed on or about his or her person, or, whether concealed or otherwise, in a vehicle operated or occupied by the person, except in his or her dwelling house, place of business, or on other land possessed by the person, without a license to carry the pistol as provided by law and if licensed, shall not carry the pistol in a place or manner inconsistent with any restrictions upon such license.

    (3) A person who violates this section is guilty of a felony, punishable by imprisonment for not more than 5 years, or by a fine of not more than $2,500.00.

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    Ruger001 wrote:
    But is a not legal according to this law... Did not locate definition of "Vehicle" as used in this section.....

    750.227 Concealed weapons; carrying; penalty.



    Sec. 227.

    (1) A person shall not carry a dagger, dirk, stiletto, a double-edged nonfolding stabbing instrument of any length, or any other dangerous weapon, except a hunting knife adapted and carried as such, concealed on or about his or her person, or whether concealed or otherwise in any vehicle operated or occupied by the person, except in his or her dwelling house, place of business or on other land possessed by the person.

    (2) A person shall not carry a pistol concealed on or about his or her person, or, whether concealed or otherwise, in a vehicle operated or occupied by the person, except in his or her dwelling house, place of business, or on other land possessed by the person, without a license to carry the pistol as provided by law and if licensed, shall not carry the pistol in a place or manner inconsistent with any restrictions upon such license.

    (3) A person who violates this section is guilty of a felony, punishable by imprisonment for not more than 5 years, or by a fine of not more than $2,500.00.
    The law covers this in regards to a car. I was asking about vehicles that are not cars...boats, snowmobiles, etc.

    But I'm still researching the subject.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    Venator wrote:
    SpringerXDacp wrote:
    Michigander wrote:
    This particular law says it's legal.

    750.227d Transporting or possessing firearm in or upon motor vehicle or self-propelled vehicle designed for land travel; conditions; violation as misdemeanor; penalty.

    Sec. 227d.
    (1) Except as otherwise permitted by law, a person shall not transport or possess in or upon a motor vehicle or any self-propelled vehicle designed for land travel a firearm, other than a pistol, unless the firearm is unloaded and is 1 or more of the following:
    (a) Taken down.
    (b) Enclosed in a case.
    (c) Carried in the trunk of the vehicle.
    (d) Inaccessible from the interior of the vehicle.
    (2) A person who violates this section is guilty of a misdemeanor, punishable by imprisonment for not more than 90 days, or a fine of not more than $100.00, or both.
    History: Add. 1981, Act 103, Eff. Mar. 31, 1982
    © 2007 Legislative Council, State of Michigan

    Meaning:

    Car, Motorcycle (on or off road), Boat and Snowmobile, with or without CPL, rifles and shotguns must be unloaded and, see Sec. 227d. With CPL loaded pistol is OK.

    The above law makes an exceptionfor PISTOLS. So even without a CPL you can carry openly on the above vehicle.
    SpringerXDacp is correct... Must have CPL to carry pistol in above vehicle.

    The law was written to prevent long guns, thus the handgun exception.

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    ORV-324.81133 Operation of ORV; prohibited acts

    k) While transporting on the vehicle a bow unless unstrung or encased, or a firearm unless unloaded and securely encased, or equipped with and made inoperative by a manufactured keylocked trigger housing mechanism.

    ----------------------------------------------------------------

    MCL 324.82126(1)(g).

    • A person shall not operate a snowmobile while transporting a

    firearm, unless unloaded in both barrel and magazine and securely

    encased.
    Id.

    --------------------------------------------

    Both come from Judges traffic benchbook and are very clear.. States firearm and that includes a pistol unless stated in statute... Back to work.....

  14. #14
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    Ruger001 wrote:
    ORV-324.81133 Operation of ORV; prohibited acts

    k) While transporting on the vehicle a bow unless unstrung or encased, or a firearm unless unloaded and securely encased, or equipped with and made inoperative by a manufactured keylocked trigger housing mechanism.

    ----------------------------------------------------------------

    MCL 324.82126(1)(g).

    • A person shall not operate a snowmobile while transporting a

    firearm, unless unloaded in both barrel and magazine and securely

    encased.
    Id.

    --------------------------------------------

    Both come from Judges traffic benchbook and are very clear.. States firearm and that includes a pistol unless stated in statute... Back to work.....


    It is more difficult to say whether it is legal to carry concealed in a boat. Your CPL authorizes you to carry a concealed pistol anywhere in the state, “except as otherwise provided by law”. Michigan law, MCL 324.40111(2) states, “Except as otherwise provided in this part or in a department order authorized under section 40107, a person shall not transport or have in possession a firearm in or upon a vehicle, unless the firearm is unloaded … in a motorized boat.” Similar statutes outlaw the carrying of a loaded firearm in an ORV (MCL 324.81133) or in a snowmobile (MCL 324.82126(1). These statutes were designed to stop poachers from shooting game from a motor vehicle, motor boat, ORV or snowmobile. But, their terms do not limit enforcement to that situation. The DNR has issued a written guidance to its officers not to enforce the above statutes against anyone with a Concealed Pistol License unless the person is using the handgun to hunt from a motor vehicle, boat, ORV or snowmobile. This has not been formalized into a “department order” so it does not control anyone but Conservation Officers. There is no such barrier for any other peace officer. A police officer or deputy sheriff could arrest you for violation of the motor vehicle, motor boat, ORV or snowmobile statute. I believe that the carry concealed statute was intended to supercede these laws. But it did not do so explicitly. Hopefully the legislature will correct these contradictions.

    I know Venators OP was without CPL, however, according to the above, carrying a loaded pistol in or on car, motorcycle, boat and snowmobile, etc. is going to require a CPL. I don't see how the above can be clearer on the subject.

    Ruger, in Michigan we are not going to find a law that specificallystates OC is legal in or on a boat, snowmobile.


    In Michigan, motorcycles are considered vehicles, therefore, CPL is required to CC or OC, same as a car.

    At this time the only thing we have to go by is what the DNR stated.





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    Iagree ....100 %

    I am sure the DNR will iron out the statutes due to CPL conflict.....





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