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Thread: AZ OC Log

  1. #1
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    Copying others from different states, I intend to record my thoughts on OC and anything interesting that happens when I OC on this thread. It will be somthing of an open journal. Criticism and comments (non-grammar... please please please) would be great.

    Edit: I may not record instances where people do not notice or nothing notable happens... thus these posts will reflect a much higher than average rate of people noticing.

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    OC'd my FN 5.7 in Blackhawk cqc serpa holster to Best Buy in east tucson az to get "sins of a solar empire" game for PC (fun by the way, if you like space combat or the old game homeworld). Had several high school age kids gawk and murmur too quietly for me to hear in the pc game isle. Check out girl was very distracted, but eventually noticed and was startled.
    Asked if carrying a gun like that was legal, I said its not only legal its protected by name in the AZ constitution. she says she sees random people carrying guns sometimes but assumes they are cops (I am obviously not a cop). I say that most off duty cops carry concealed and wish her a nice day.

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    OC'd FN 5.7 to a cheesesteak reastaurant (no alcohol served... damn that law by the way) in central/midtown tucson. noticed several police cars on the way in, turned recorder on just in case (never had a negative with PD, but you never know).

    Girl taking orders notices but clearly does not care. As I sit down I see 4 Tucson PD officers seated strait ahead of me. Youngest of them notices and points... other three look. I ready myself for a negative (doesnt one of them just have to show off?). Sargent waves his had dismissively in towards me and makes and "eh" sound. Either mocking me or dismissing me as a threat/concern for the seated group. I think the latter as the rookie slowly looks away from me and they all go back to talking/eating (institutionalizing level headedness... is it too much to hope for?).

    I get my food...eat and read the rag/alternitive newspaper Tucson weekly... including and anti-campus carry column. PD starts to file out... Sargent hangs back (oh no?)...

    says 'what are you carrying? is that the new FN pistol?'.

    I respond... 'yea its an FN 5.7'

    He says 'a lot of cops are scared sh*tless by that gun and dont like it very much... some want it banned, do you find that the round penetrates really well?

    I respond "maybe with the right ammo, or ammo you load yourself, but why go to that trouble when you can just by an AR-15 pistol or cabine and have a better round, longer barrel and much more ammo selection and penetration?"

    He says "no kidding. but most crimminals dont think that hard and are going for concealability. Isn't that (points at FN) like an AR-15 in your pocket?

    I respond "it really is. The loads i use do 2300-2400 feet per second, but I use hollowpoints (elite ammo)."

    He says "well lets hope the round doesnt catch on with the wrong people. you have a good one".

    he leaves... I leave...

    ** I was impressed that he was willing to discuss for a couple minutes... it was nice of him after it was obvious that the police were eyeballing me earlier****



  4. #4
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    bbvk05 wrote:
    OC'd FN 5.7 to a cheesesteak reastaurant (no alcohol served... damn that law by the way) in central/midtown tucson. noticed several police cars on the way in, turned recorder on just in case (never had a negative with PD, but you never know).

    Girl taking orders notices but clearly does not care. As I sit down I see 4 Tucson PD officers seated strait ahead of me. Youngest of them notices and points... other three look. I ready myself for a negative (doesnt one of them just have to show off?). Sargent waves his had dismissively in towards me and makes and "eh" sound. Either mocking me or dismissing me as a threat/concern for the seated group. I think the latter as the rookie slowly looks away from me and they all go back to talking/eating (institutionalizing level headedness... is it too much to hope for?).

    I get my food...eat and read the rag/alternitive newspaper Tucson weekly... including and anti-campus carry column. PD starts to file out... Sargent hangs back (oh no?)...

    says 'what are you carrying? is that the new FN pistol?'.

    I respond... 'yea its an FN 5.7'

    He says 'a lot of cops are scared sh*tless by that gun and dont like it very much... some want it banned, do you find that the round penetrates really well?

    I respond "maybe with the right ammo, or ammo you load yourself, but why go to that trouble when you can just by an AR-15 pistol or cabine and have a better round, longer barrel and much more ammo selection and penetration?"

    He says "no kidding. but most crimminals dont think that hard and are going for concealability. Isn't that (points at FN) like an AR-15 in your pocket?

    I respond "it really is. The loads i use do 2300-2400 feet per second, but I use hollowpoints (elite ammo)."

    He says "well lets hope the round doesnt catch on with the wrong people. you have a good one".

    he leaves... I leave...

    ** I was impressed that he was willing to discuss for a couple minutes... it was nice of him after it was obvious that the police were eyeballing me earlier****


    Outstanding interaction. TPD deserves a cookie for that one.


  5. #5
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    bbvk05 wrote:
    Edit: I may not record instances where people do not notice or nothing notable happens... thus these posts will reflect a much higher than average rate of people noticing.

    bbvk05,

    +1 for starting this thread. Although I would have to disagree with you that you shouldn't post non-incidences. Simply for the fact that an establishment that you go to where you dodn't encounter any problems would recieve a +1 for being gun-friendly. Anywhere that you encounter a negative response (from the establishment, not other people) would recieve a -1 for being anti-gun and other posters/viewers would know that they do not believe in the right to self-protection. And obviously add encounters with people so that everyone can learn from your experiences. IMHO

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    perhaps you are right. time is a constraint, but i will likely broaden it.... thanks for the suggestion!

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    Bad news to report:

    OC'd my Glock 17L to boston market and wal mart. While I was at boston market a man claimed to be a police officer (claimed department redacted) came up to my table and told me that carrying like that was illegal unless I had a CCW permit (its not, but I have one anyway). He seemed well versed, so he might have actually been a deputy, but I intend to find out.

    Paraphrase conversation (we'll call him john):

    John: I dont want to alarm you but I am a police officer (department redacted) and the way that you are carrying that is illegal unless you have a CCW permit.

    Me: What is your name and badge number and may I see some identification?

    John: Why do you want that?

    Me: So I can file a complaint with your department for lying to me about the legality of open carry, or so I can call the police because you are fasely identifying yourself as a police officer.

    John: Well you are wrong about the legality. the way you are carrying that is illegal because your shirt folded down over the top of your handgun and that makes it partially concealed, which is illegal without a CCW permit

    Me: Partial concealment is not illegal so long as it is in a belt holster and the gun are holster are still clearly visable, which they are. Can I see identification?

    John: I dont want arrest you so you dont need to see that, but other cops will arrest you for what I just saw because it violates the law.

    Me: If you feel I violated that law isn't it your duty to call the police or arrest me or something? I would like the police to tell you that you are wrong anyway.

    John: I am done with this but you are absolutely wrong and you could get arrested. *starts to walk away*

    me: can I at least get your name?

    John: Yeah sure its john (real first name redacted, no last name) *walks away*



    So I am calling the department that he claimed to be a part of tommorrow to file a complaint against a john doe officer, or to try to get them to investigate somebody masquerading as a cop. I think that hes a cop because he seemed to know a little bit about what he was talking about.

    This whole thing really saddended me because I have had 7 months now of peacful and well recieved OC, including several positive interactions with police.


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    Doesn't sound like a real cop to me, but I could be wrong.

    He might sound like he knows what he is talking about, but so do you and you're not a cop are ya?

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    bbvk05 wrote:
    Well you are wrong about the legality. the way you are carrying that is illegal because your shirt folded down over the top of your handgun and that makes it partially concealed, which is illegal without a CCW permit
    He may actually be right thanks to State of Arizona v Adams.

    Stupid activist judges legislating from the benchin that 1994 Appellate court decision held it has to be obvious to ordinary observation that you're carrying a weapon.

    So LEOS are being told to interpret that as meaning open means both weapon and holster"out dar flappin'".


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    At the most the top inch of my glock was covered by a fold in my shirt. Still 8 or 9 inches was visible.

  11. #11
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    So did he turn out to be a legit cop or some crazy running around impersonating an officer?

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    Still waiting on that. PD is giving me the run around. will update.

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    Dahwg wrote:

    Stupid activist judges legislating from the benchin that 1994 Appellate court decision held it has to be obvious to ordinary observation that you're carrying a weapon.

    So LEOS are being told to interpret that as meaning open means both weapon and holster"out dar flappin'".
    Sounds likethe officerrecognized it as a weapon without any problem, so I guessit was "obvious to ordinary observation." So what was his problem?
    A. Gold

    Failure to comply may result in discipline up to and including termination.
    The free man is a warrior. - Nietzsche "Twilight of the Idols"

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    bbvk05 wrote:
    At the most the top inch of my glock was covered by a fold in my shirt. Still 8 or 9 inches was visible.
    Then I guess this guy just had a point to prove. There always seems to be those judges willing to erode our rights, so when a peabrain like the one you encountered decides to make life difficult those same judges are just waiting around to jump on the opportunity.

    Luckily some of the legislators are trying to re-word the law to take it out of the judges' hands. No luck this year, but I know they're hammering away. Good luck with that and let us know what you hear back from PD.

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    Dahwg wrote:
    Luckily some of the legislators are trying to re-word the law to take it out of the judges' hands. No luck this year, but I know they're hammering away. Good luck with that and let us know what you hear back from PD.
    Actually, the legislators are only doing it because AzCDL presented the proposed language to them (HB 2630), rounded up co-sponsors, testified at committee hearings and worked behind the scenes to get it through the legislature.

    Fred

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