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Thread: Bad Military Discharge....CCW?

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    Does anyone on this fourm know of anyone that has gotten a ccw permit in N.C. that had a bad military discharge? My brother in law went into the army when he was seventeen and had to have is parents sign for him to join at that age. He didn't stay in but a year, and was kicked out for going awol. He did not receive a dishoronable his papers say "other than honorable". He has no criminal record and is 55 year old now. I told him I don't think he can get a ccw permit in N.C. with this military record. So I told him I would ask you guys if any of you know how he can get this cleared up so he can get his ccw. Any help would be appreciated.

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    Perhaps a post to the NC sub-forum would attract a knowledgable response.

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    brk240, welcome to OCDO!

    Both Federal and NC law state that only someone that is discharged under DISHONORABLE CONDITIONS is ineligible to own, posess or purchase a firearm.

    While an OTH isn't Honorable, it's not DISHONORABLE but rather the grey area in between. Unless otherwise inelligible, he should be fine.

    Attached is the pdf from NC and here's a great website:
    http://www.nccrimecontrol.org/Index2...,000935,000942


    Attached Files Attached Files

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    I'm a civilian, but I had understood that it was possible to get such discharges changed to "honorable" status after a time, with the recommendation of your congressman and approval of the DOD. (This was anecdotal and may well be wrong). This may not be necessary, however. A "dishonorable" discharge imposes a full firearms disability, but I'm not aware of other categories having such problems (except maybe a so-called "section 8" psych discharge).

    -ljp

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    Hey Legba, not sure how the other services do it, but I'm pretty sure it's very similar. The folks that do that for the Navy are the BCNR - Board of Correction of Naval Records and they're basedout of the Washington Navy Yard, in DC.

    There is a lot of paperwork but IIRC no congressional recommendations required, each case is taken on it's own merit. I retired at the WNY asthe Command SCPO of Naval Support Activity Washington and my formerXO (still a dear friend)served on that board after she left NSAW.

    It's a "sea story" that OTH's get automatically changed to Honorable after time, but it is possible after a review and it can take up to a year to get to each case. It all depends on the situation. According to my XO,they reject an awful lot or those requests. AWOL is pretty much AWOL, not much room to say he was singled out, mistreated or unjustly discharged.



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    IANAL but here is how I have come to understand it:

    In general, the law disqualifies anyone convicted of a crime punishable by MORE than one year imprisonment. While there are numerous military offenses punishable by more than one year only a General Court Martial has the authority to mete out more than a six month sentence. Any punishment by a lesser court (even for the exact same UCMJ violation) might be comparable to a misdemeanor conviction in most states.

    As others have observed "other than honorable" is not equal to "dishonorable" and does not result in the same sanctions.

    IMHO your B/L should be able to clear things up. If he applies and is denied, use the appeal process.



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    Moved to NC forum!

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    ne1 wrote:
    IANAL but here is how I have come to understand it:

    In general, the law disqualifies anyone convicted of a crime punishable by MORE than one year imprisonment. While there are numerous military offenses punishable by more than one year only a General Court Martial has the authority to mete out more than a six month sentence. Any punishment by a lesser court (even for the exact same UCMJ violation) might be comparable to a misdemeanor conviction in most states.

    As others have observed "other than honorable" is not equal to "dishonorable".

    IMHO your B/L should be able to clear things up. If he applies and is denied, use the appeal process.

    A SC judge (Cottingham or Eggleston) went to great lengths lecturing that disability stems from the mere liability for incarceration for more than a year.

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    Doug Huffman wrote:
    A SC judge (Cottingham or Eggleston) went to great lengths lecturing that disability stems from the mere liability for incarceration for more than a year.
    Mypoint is that a summary or special court martial DOES NOT have the authority to punish for more than one year, thus there can be no disability. Military courts are different from other courts in that the grade of crime is not determined by statute but by the level of court convened.

    You are free to disagree but I suggest you doyour own research on the subject first.

    With regards to the original poster, I suggest obtaining whatever records may be available from the National Personnel Records Center in advance to better prepare for his appeal.Depending on the nature of the AWOL offense, it may not have been punishable for even a year.



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    I have an idea.

    Try contacting the authority that issues the carry permits and ASK THEM!!!!!!!!!!!!WTF!


    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." - Thomas Jefferson

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    VAopencarry wrote:
    I have an idea.

    Try contacting the authority that issues the carry permits and ASK THEM!!!!!!!!!!!!WTF!

    Temper, temper. :P

    Not everyone is as savvy on these things as we are. He saw a place that might be able to help, and he asked. And for his brother, not himself. At least his heart is in the right place.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    More than likely he got non-judicial punishment article 15 proceedings. They are not a court conviction and would not be on any criminal record.

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    VAopencarry wrote:
    I have an idea.

    Try contacting the authority that issues the carry permits and ASK THEM!!!!!!!!!!!!WTF!


    Far too many "issuing authorities" are pompous low level servants whom find it easy to get through their nine-to-five existance by presuming that only a select few members of the public deserve their blessing. Occasionally it is possible to break this inertia when someone comes along with higher authority. This is why knowing your rights and taking full advantage of the appeal process is recommended.

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    Regular Member thnycav's Avatar
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    Well the VA application asks if you have been discharged under Dishonorable conditions, Which would mean being convicted of a crime. If it is other than honorable and not a dishonorable discharge he is fine. Your state may be different but I doubt it.

    The best thing to do is get the papaerwork and read it



    They can not say yes he can have it if you do not ask them.

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    More than likely he got non-judicial punishment article 15 proceedings. They are not a court conviction and would not be on any criminal record.
    I agree. It is unlikely that he would have been tried by general court martial if AWOL was the only offense, though it is certainly possible.

    BTW, I think this topic is broad enough in scope that it probably should have remained under "general discussion".

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