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Thread: Another sad story from our northern neighbor.

  1. #1
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    Wow! Look at what things have come to! A kid (14) trying to honor his uncle, not trying to commit mass murder. When is somebody going to ban Louisville Slugger Bats, what with all the beatings and killings that transpire in today's society with them. You don't see the victims families going after the manufacturers of these bats or trying to outlaw them. Will they then ban people from wearing Major League Baseball shirts?

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080310/...us/t_shirt_gun

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    But an attorney for the school district said school must create a safe environment for students in the post-Columbine era, and bringing even the image of a gun to school violates the district's policy.
    Those are two different statements.

    Yes, they should have a safe environment, and yes, the t-shirt is against policy.

    But does the image of a gun create an unsafe environment? I hope they don't show a picture of the mushroom cloud over Hiroshima in history class, or everyone will get radiation poisoning.

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    DocDaddy wrote:
    Wow! Look at what things have come to! A kid (14) trying to honor his uncle, not trying to commit mass murder. When is somebody going to ban Louisville Slugger Bats, what with all the beatings and killings that transpire in today's society with them. You don't see the victims families going after the manufacturers of these bats or trying to outlaw them. Will they then ban people from wearing Major League Baseball shirts?

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080310/...us/t_shirt_gun
    No doubt. I've seen the news where people have gotten beaten to death in Fairfax, why not make people walk around with their hands in their pockets. Unreal. I'm glad to live in Va.:celebrate

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    I had a nice browning shirt I wore in high school, and amazingly I never went on a gun rampage. Im sure glad I went to school in VA

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    If this were in Maryland, the judge would rule the 14 y/o citizen would not be protected by the constitution. The protection he is afforded 1A, 2A, etc is trumped by "protecting public safety" a vague reference to the fact that police can claim any situation is dangerous, and they are within their rights to violate your constitutionally protected freedoms any time they claim said danger exists.

    Cite: http://www.mddailyrecord.com/article...&type=UTTM

    Look, I am not advocating people stand by and do nothing to stop a real danger to public safety, but there has to be oversight! Waving off constitutional rights as mere guidelines is a serious issue! If the constitution can't protect your rights, what law can?

    Frankly....all these terrorism laws, etc. If I had to choose whether to die at the hands of a terrorist, or live in a world where I have no freedoms, but I am "safe" I shall choose the former. Hopefully, there is middle ground somewhere between me dying and me being a prisoner, living the life the government chooses is safest for me.

    Tim

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    nitrovic wrote:
    DocDaddy wrote:
    Wow! Look at what things have come to! A kid (14) trying to honor his uncle, not trying to commit mass murder. When is somebody going to ban Louisville Slugger Bats, what with all the beatings and killings that transpire in today's society with them. You don't see the victims families going after the manufacturers of these bats or trying to outlaw them. Will they then ban people from wearing Major League Baseball shirts?

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080310/...us/t_shirt_gun
    No doubt. I've seen the news where people have gotten beaten to death in Fairfax, why not make people walk around with their hands in their pockets. Unreal. I'm glad to live in Va.:celebrate
    They might be concealing something dangerous in their pockets, I guess that's why they have a problem with you to putting your hands in your pocket at the courthouse.

    You don't think this would happen in VA? I honestly do. Our society has become so Politically Correct, some actually think you can pick up a **** from the clean side...


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    Been through this onve already here in my hometown. Precedent set anyone??

    http://tinyurl.com/2xyjc

    This to me would set legal precdent, I met the kid once, through his brother in high school. I asked him what the settlement was and he said that he couldn't talk about it but that Albemarle County Public Schools would not make the same mistake again.

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    In High School I was a member of the JROTC Rifle Team, was issued a rifle at school andon days we had a match brought it with me on the bus!!! Granted this was WV things are a little different there. Guess I was lucky I didnt get one of those guns that just starts shooting people.

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    smccomas wrote:
    SNIP
    Guess I was lucky I didnt get one of those guns that just starts shooting people.
    Well said! +1
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    What was I just saying at the beginning of this thread? This story proves it happens! I would like to see the victims family sue the crap out of the manufacturer's of the baseball bat, just like they would do if it was a "gun"!!! Oh wait, they won't, it isn't the "cool" thing to do!

    http://hamptonroads.com/2008/03/man-...ll-bat-slaying

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    timf343 wrote:
    If this were in Maryland, the judge would rule the 14 y/o citizen would not be protected by the constitution. The protection he is afforded 1A, 2A, etc is trumped by "protecting public safety" a vague reference to the fact that police can claim any situation is dangerous, and they are within their rights to violate your constitutionally protected freedoms any time they claim said danger exists.

    Cite: http://www.mddailyrecord.com/article...&type=UTTM

    Look, I am not advocating people stand by and do nothing to stop a real danger to public safety, but there has to be oversight! Waving off constitutional rights as mere guidelines is a serious issue! If the constitution can't protect your rights, what law can?

    Frankly....all these terrorism laws, etc. If I had to choose whether to die at the hands of a terrorist, or live in a world where I have no freedoms, but I am "safe" I shall choose the former. Hopefully, there is middle ground somewhere between me dying and me being a prisoner, living the life the government chooses is safest for me.

    Tim
    That is a very scary news story. So they can search your house without a warrant even after you're in custody, and getting you to spill the combo to your safe "under pressure" is just A-OK.

    BTW, this thread belongs in the PA forum.

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    Tomahawk wrote:
    That is a very scary news story. So they can search your house without a warrant even after you're in custody, and getting you to spill the combo to your safe "under pressure" is just A-OK.
    The thing to do is get the actual court opinion.

    News stories always screw it up somehow.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Regular Member Thundar's Avatar
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    Citizen wrote:
    Tomahawk wrote:
    That is a very scary news story. So they can search your house without a warrant even after you're in custody, and getting you to spill the combo to your safe "under pressure" is just A-OK.
    The thing to do is get the actual court opinion.

    News stories always screw it up somehow.
    Here is a link to the opinion:

    http://pacer.ca4.uscourts.gov/opinion.pdf/062158.P.pdf


    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitable–and let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come …………. PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

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    Tomahawk wrote:
    timf343 wrote:
    If this were in Maryland, the judge would rule the 14 y/o citizen would not be protected by the constitution. The protection he is afforded 1A, 2A, etc is trumped by "protecting public safety" a vague reference to the fact that police can claim any situation is dangerous, and they are within their rights to violate your constitutionally protected freedoms any time they claim said danger exists.

    Cite: http://www.mddailyrecord.com/article...&type=UTTM

    Look, I am not advocating people stand by and do nothing to stop a real danger to public safety, but there has to be oversight! Waving off constitutional rights as mere guidelines is a serious issue! If the constitution can't protect your rights, what law can?

    Frankly....all these terrorism laws, etc. If I had to choose whether to die at the hands of a terrorist, or live in a world where I have no freedoms, but I am "safe" I shall choose the former. Hopefully, there is middle ground somewhere between me dying and me being a prisoner, living the life the government chooses is safest for me.

    Tim
    That is a very scary news story. So they can search your house without a warrant even after you're in custody, and getting you to spill the combo to your safe "under pressure" is just A-OK.

    BTW, this thread belongs in the PA forum.
    I had it posted in the PA Forum. LOL

  15. #15
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    timf343 wrote:
    If this were in Maryland, the judge would rule the 14 y/o citizen would not be protected by the constitution. The protection he is afforded 1A, 2A, etc is trumped by "protecting public safety" a vague reference to the fact that police can claim any situation is dangerous, and they are within their rights to violate your constitutionally protected freedoms any time they claim said danger exists.

    Cite: http://www.mddailyrecord.com/article...&type=UTTM

    Look, I am not advocating people stand by and do nothing to stop a real danger to public safety, but there has to be oversight! Waving off constitutional rights as mere guidelines is a serious issue! If the constitution can't protect your rights, what law can?

    Frankly....all these terrorism laws, etc. If I had to choose whether to die at the hands of a terrorist, or live in a world where I have no freedoms, but I am "safe" I shall choose the former. Hopefully, there is middle ground somewhere between me dying and me being a prisoner, living the life the government chooses is safest for me.

    Tim
    I don't think the OP is related to the above linked matter. Having now read the decision, essentially the problem for Mora became jumping the gun into federal court before taking care of business in state court. I think it was a unique situation that does not generalize in most regards. And I'm not sure that in this case LE wasn't reasonable up to the point of refusing to return everything as soon as he had a clean bill of health. Unless Mora refiles in state court though, we will not know the answer to how this really plays out.

    Mora making a comments that a reasonable person could consider a threat is MUCH different from even an implied threat argument from an arguably ambiguous message on a t-shirt. As there are still a few reasonable jurists left in this nation, I doubt that one is going to have any judicial impact on the other.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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