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Thread: LEO's Reaction to Concealed Carry

  1. #1
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    Chief P-

    My name is D [deleted] and I live in Cape Girardeau Missouri with my wife and three children. I operate our family business, am a member of the Army Reserves and am generally well regarded within the community of Cape. Several times a year, we visit the St Louis area and in particular the City of Crestwood to shop and enjoy many of the retail opportunities unavailable to us in Cape. On average, we probably spend $1000 + per year in Crestwood. Although this is obviously not a large sum of money, it is making a positive impact on your local economy. People from outside your area help provide jobs and needed tax revenue to the city.

    First of all, I want you to understand that I am not one to complain about the actions of law enforcement officials. As a matter of fact, the two times I have ever observed my local police department in action, I called a first line supervisor to personally commend his officers for acting in a very professional manner. Unfortunately, the purpose of this letter is not to commend your officers, but ask you spend some time better educating them on public interaction and knowledge of State statutes concerning the concealed carry of firearms. I do not wish to name the officers involved as this will not accomplish anything.

    On 30 March 2008 (Sunday) my wife and children were shopping in the Crestwood Mall as we have done many times before. The entrance we accessed the mall from was not posted showing that concealed carry was prohibited. To my knowledge, none of the entrances meet the state requirement of having an 11” X 14” sign with 1” high lettering stating that weapons were not allowed. I personally have a concealed carry permit from the states of Utah and New Hampshire which are perfectly legal in the State of Missouri (Missouri recognizes any state’s permit).

    I carry nearly every time I walk out the door of my house and a handgun is near me 24 hours a day. My family deserves to not only have me as a father and provider; they have the right to expect me to protect them 24 hours a day. I provide that protection on a daily basis and take pride in knowing that I will NEVER be cowering in a corner praying that a crazed criminal does not bring harm to my family or those around me. I have an utmost respect for the law and always will, but quite frankly, law enforcement is not proactive when it comes to violent crimes. They only arrive AFTER there has been a violent crime committed. They work to bring the criminals to justice but can do nothing to bring back lost or torn lives.

    Apparently at some point during our time at the mall, someone observed my weapon (not sure how that happened as I carry in the small of my back with an un-tucked shirt) and contacted mall security. Mall security called your police department to respond. I was approached by an officer as I waited outside a store for my wife to exit and was asked if I was carrying a weapon. I promptly responded that yes I was carrying and I have a legal permit to do so. At this same time my wife approached and asked what the problem was. She was rudely told to “wait a minute” in a loud voice and the officer pushed his hand in front of her face. She was concerned for our children who were with me and witnessing this situation and was only trying to tend to them. In the end, she was highly upset with the way the officer treated her. He approached her later and offered an apology but she was not interested in listening to what he had to say.

    I was then told to raise my hands and was asked if the officer behind me could disarm me, at which time I complied but told him to be careful as there was a round in the chamber. The officer in front allowed me to retrieve my wallet to show him my state issued driver’s license and concealed carry permit from Utah. I was asked why I didn’t have a Missouri permit (absolutely none of their business, as I was in full compliance with the law) and I began to explain I was not obligated to have a Missouri license and chose the Utah license because it was a better monetary value. He made the statement that I was “going around the system”. Quite the contrary, as I did exactly what the “system” allowed me to do; obtain a non-resident permit from another state. He then proceeded to tell me it was not legal to carry a weapon in the mall and I once again had to inform said officer that the mall was not in compliance with the state law regarding the posting of signs at all entrances.

    He then stated it was probably posted at the entrance to the parking lot (which it is not and would still not be in compliance with state law). I promptly informed the officer once again of the law concerning the posting of any place of business. In addition, carrying a weapon with a proper permit in a facility which is properly posted does not carry any type of criminal penalty which I believe your officer was unaware of. You can only be asked to leave the premises and if you refuse, fined $100 per the state statute. If asked to leave, I would have fully complied but was NEVER told by any of the officers to leave at any point.

    In my opinion, the proper way to handle the situation would have been to have me show my identification and permit, run a MULES check and send me on my way once it was determined I was not a threat in any way. The whole event was embarrassing and made your officers look ignorant when it was determined by me that they had no clue about the state statutes concerning concealed carry.

    I am not interested in any administrative action to be carried out hence the reason I am not naming the officers involved. I only ask that you take the time to properly train your officers in the laws regarding state firearms preemption and the statutes concerning concealed carry so this will not be repeated in the future. I have enclosed a brochure produced by the Missouri State Highway Patrol concerning concealed carry and transportation of weapons in the State.

    As far as my family visiting the City of Crestwood in the future, we have made a decision to never visit again as this was a very negative experience for not only me but my wife and children who observed the whole situation. In addition, there are several Missouri state forums concerning the carrying of firearms and this incident will be posted for others to view and come to their own conclusions as to whether or not they visit Crestwood.

    A copy of this letter has been sent to all eight Aldermen, the Mayor and the City Administrator.



    I closed the letter with my full name, phone number and e-mail address.

  2. #2
    Regular Member mmdkyoung123's Avatar
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    "Mr. Gambini? That is a lucid, intelligent, well thought-out objection. Overruled. "

    Sorry, on a movie quote kick at work lately. I think that is an excellent, profesional, respectful letter. I hope you will post any response that you recieve on here also.


  3. #3
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    mmdkyoung123 wrote:
    "Mr. Gambini? That is a lucid, intelligent, well thought-out objection. Overruled. "

    Sorry, on a movie quote kick at work lately. I think that is an excellent, profesional, respectful letter. I hope you will post any response that you recieve on here also.
    Oh believe me, I am waiting for a response with baited breath.

    (At least ONE of the 11 folks I sent the letter to better respond!)

  4. #4
    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    Most interesting. Glad you took the time to write such a cogent, well-worded letter to the appropriate parties. Unfortunate to see that St. Louis County/City continue to live up to the low expectations we have for them.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

  5. #5
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    Crestwood huh........ Well I try and stay away from that side of the sate anyways, unless traveling through it. It is shameful to have to educate those that should know better. Sorry your family had to go through that.

  6. #6
    Regular Member mmdkyoung123's Avatar
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    Hey Drur,

    Just checkign to see if you have recieved any kind of response yet. Keep us updated



  7. #7
    Regular Member Smurfologist's Avatar
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    Drur,

    You did great. I hope you do get a response (although, it may not come in the form of a letter, but, as you suggested, training for the department). Keep us posted.

    2nd Amendment........Use it.........Or, lose it!!:X
    The 2nd Amendment... brought to you by Beretta and the number 1791!!

  8. #8
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    Any responce from the PD?

  9. #9
    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    Still hoping for an update.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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