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Thread: Things that make you go HUH???

  1. #1
    Regular Member mmdkyoung123's Avatar
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    Little background info first. I run several stores for a company that markets urban apparel in VERY urban neighborhoods. I carry for the safety of myself, my employees, and then my customers.

    On Satruday, I called the police to the store on troost ave in Kansas city. My employee's ex had called the store several times, threatening to kill him. ( I could here her over the phone, she was that loud) She then showed up at the store, and parked across the street. She called the store, told my employee to look outside, and then held up a knife. (looked like a butcher knife). So I called 911, nd the police responded, talked to her, searched her, found the knife, and arrested her. All good right? Nope. now comes the fun stuff.

    The three police officers come over to the store to talk to us, and let us know it is resolved. Police officer number one, see's my gun, and asks if I have a permit for that. (I am almost positive he was foreign as he had a HEAVY accent. I believe Russian) I replied that I do not, but I am carrying it openly in accordance with the law, and further more, I am in my "fixed place of business" and my carrying a gun is not an issue. He tells me that without a permit I am carrying illegally, that I need to put my hands on the counter, so he can disarm me and handcuff me. I asked him to call a supervisor. He then pulls his taser, and tells me the same again. I comply (I have been tased before during training. didn't feel great, and I figured this wouldn't feel any better) So now, I am sitting in my OWN store, handcuffed, waiting on a supervisor. Finally 15 mins later he arrives. He talks with the other officers, appears to tell officer one that he is an idiot, and walks back over. He takes off the hadcuffs and apologizes. I just looked at him.

    He now proceeds to tell me that the foreign guy is new, and just trying to do his job to the best of his ability, and they would instruct him further as to carry laws. HE THEN proceeds to tell me that while I am legal to carry in my home, vehicle, and business, that if I step onto the sidewalk with out a permit, even carrying openly I am in a GREY area and could be arrested. . I explained to this officer, that there was no grey area. I tried my best to NOT talk to him like I would my five year old. I pulled out the paper that I keep in my wallet with the ordinances for KC, Independence, and Raytown, (those are the areas I am in most often.) and showed them to him. He reads them, tells me that is not what they mean. I said I am sorry, I thought that as English is MY first language I read them quite clearly. Please, do tell me what they say then. He "informs" me that if I carry openly, that I am posing a threat to the public, and any officers that arrive on scene, and I will be arrested. (He didn't like it when I laughed) At this point, I should have been home 30 minutes ago, and just want to leave. I tell the officer that I don't have time to "discuss" this with him any further. I ask him if I can have my gun back and if I am free to go. He gives me my gun, and I lock up. I Unload my gun, and take it out to the car and then take out the ammo separate as this guy seems just dumb enough to actually arrest me. So should I write a letter saying that they may need to brush up on their English and the law??

  2. #2
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    Wow, this continual ingnorance among police officers of firearms laws amazes me. Is it not reasonable for police to be trained about gun laws and OC/CC since this is the United States and they are likely to encounter someone lawfully carrying at some point in their career? Or am I totally off base here?

  3. #3
    Regular Member VAopencarry's Avatar
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    mmd, I would say a letter is in order.

    I too find it amazing that so many officers on the street are utterly ignorant of gun laws. I don't expect them to know the intricacy's of law. By words and by action the cops seem very interested when they hear someone has a gun. I really think they would be better trained in gun laws.


    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." - Thomas Jefferson

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    • File a freedom of information act request asking for policy on openly armed individuals, any reports that were filed about the incidents, any radio calls, text messages, phone calls, internal e-mails, or memos about the incident
    • wait for a response
    • Once you get a reply, file a formal complaint. Your complaint should at least cover the fact that you were falsely arrested due to the ignorance of the police officers and that caused you emotional distress and undue embarrasment. Complain about the ignorance of the supervisor regarding open carry as well. Also complain about the rudeness of the first officer and anything else you think is necessary.Also, ask what actions have been taken to remedy the ignorance of both officers and what disciplinary action has been taken against the officer who falsely imprisoned you.Demand a response in writing
    • If you haven't heard back, follow up on the complaint in 2 weeks and find out who is responsible for handling your complaint and talk to that officer
    • if you haven't gotten a call back, call back and follow up.
    • DO NOT let them "resolve this over the phone." Stick to getting a written response
    • When you get a written response, if you don't think it adequately answered your complaint, follow up with another letter demanding another written response and restating your questions.

  5. #5
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    While the first officer's actions may have been due to ignorance, the supervisor's actions are instead a result of usurption of power. If he were truly ignorant, he would have read the laws you provided and said, "Hmm, you're right. I'm very sorry." I doubt training would help. Formal complaints, though, might.

  6. #6
    Regular Member TechnoWeenie's Avatar
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    ama-gi wrote:
    • File a freedom of information act request asking for policy on openly armed individuals, any reports that were filed about the incidents, any radio calls, text messages, phone calls, internal e-mails, or memos about the incident
    • wait for a response
    • Once you get a reply, file a formal complaint.* Your complaint should at least cover the fact that you were falsely arrested due to the ignorance of the police officers and that caused you emotional distress and undue embarrasment.* Complain about the ignorance of the supervisor regarding open carry as well.* Also complain about the rudeness of the first officer and anything else you think is necessary.*Also, ask what actions have been taken to remedy the ignorance of both officers and what disciplinary action has been taken against the officer who falsely imprisoned you.*Demand a response in writing
    • If you haven't heard back, follow up on the complaint in 2 weeks and find out who is responsible for handling your complaint and talk to that officer
    • if you haven't gotten a call back, call back and follow up.
    • DO NOT let them "resolve this over the phone."* Stick to getting a written response
    • When you get a written response, if you don't think it adequately answered your complaint, follow up with another letter demanding another written response and restating your questions.
    [cynical] Then wait for them to write you a nice letter saying their officers acted appropriately, followed all agency guidelines, and no further action will be taken and the matter is closed..[/cynical]

    Evangelical lessons are provided upon request. Anyone wishing to meet Jesus can just kick in my door.

  7. #7
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    TechnoWeenie wrote:
    ama-gi wrote:
    • File a freedom of information act request asking for policy on openly armed individuals, any reports that were filed about the incidents, any radio calls, text messages, phone calls, internal e-mails, or memos about the incident
    • wait for a response
    • Once you get a reply, file a formal complaint. Your complaint should at least cover the fact that you were falsely arrested due to the ignorance of the police officers and that caused you emotional distress and undue embarrasment. Complain about the ignorance of the supervisor regarding open carry as well. Also complain about the rudeness of the first officer and anything else you think is necessary.Also, ask what actions have been taken to remedy the ignorance of both officers and what disciplinary action has been taken against the officer who falsely imprisoned you.Demand a response in writing
    • If you haven't heard back, follow up on the complaint in 2 weeks and find out who is responsible for handling your complaint and talk to that officer
    • if you haven't gotten a call back, call back and follow up.
    • DO NOT let them "resolve this over the phone." Stick to getting a written response
    • When you get a written response, if you don't think it adequately answered your complaint, follow up with another letter demanding another written response and restating your questions.
    [cynical] Then wait for them to write you a nice letter saying their officers acted appropriately, followed all agency guidelines, and no further action will be taken and the matter is closed..[/cynical]

    Yes, that's true, but we in Virginia have learned that they get very, very tired of dealing with the paperwork and will eventually get in line. And if they don't, you've got a record of them refusing opportunities and still breaking the law, which will lay the groundwork of a lawsuit to enjoin them from breaking the law.

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