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Competency - Responsibility, Legal Competency and Demonstrated Ability With a Handgun

How Often Do You Practice With Your Carry Weapon?

  • More than once per week

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Weekly

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Bi-Weekly

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Monthly

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Yearly

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • What is a Firing Range?

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    0

Euromutt

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Lacey, Washington, USA
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ODA 226 wrote:
I would bet my next paycheck that less than 10% of the membership of this board have EVER fired a weapon, be it rifle, pistol or shotgun, with their weak hand.
I'm not a particularly experienced shooter, but being a southpaw, I have had to operate a rifle (FN FAL), submachinegun (Uzi) and pistol (Glock 17) with my off-hand, and by "operate" I mean (re)loading, clearing malfunctions, the lot. Actually, in the case of the Uzi, I'm not sure I ever got to operate it with my strong hand at all...

Now that I shoot on my own time (and dime), I do continue to make sure I can operate the weapons I own adequately with either hand. You know, shooting off-hand really shouldn't be that a difficult; in my experience, which eye you have to use plays a larger role than which hand.

-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-

To address the questions in the OP, I'm not as good as I could be, and I know it. I've read extensively and I think I'm thoroughly versed in the theory of shooting technique and laws governing use of lethal force by a private citizen, but I know I would benefit from taking a few classes.

That said, I do think my skills and knowledge are sufficient that I am not, on balance, a public safety hazard when I carry, provided I bear in mind my own limitations. There are shots that I cannot reliably make (yet), and therefore it would be extremely irresponsible of me to try to make them, as doing so would likely result in stray rounds. When I carry, I try to remain aware of which directions would be hazardous to shoot in.

I acknowledge I don't practice with my carry ammo; not much, anyway. However, part of the reason I selected Speer Gold Dots as my defensive round is because Speer manufactures the Lawman training round to (notionally) exhibit the same ballistics as the Gold Dot in the same caliber and bullet weight. Early on, I've tested this as best I could by loading a few magazines with a mix of Gold Dots and Lawmen to see if there was any variation in performance from round to round, and I couldn't observe any.

And I am punctilious about keeping my weapons clean. Any weapon that gets taken to the range gets cleaned that evening, after the rest of the familiy has gone to bed so can I set myself up on the kitchen table with the window open and a fan going without the smell of solvent or the cold air bothering anyone else.
 

deepdiver

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I have practiced with my weak hand a bit. When I was a lad I used to practice with the BB-gun, .22 rifle and shotgun weak side. On my list of practice goals this year (after fixing the flinch) is weak side shooting.
 

deepdiver

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Pointman wrote:
It's kind of a dangerous topic. We know that this information can be scanned by prosecutors, and if someone had a defensive shooting it could be a mess in court. If you don't shoot well then it's negligence. If you do, you were looking for a fight. If you used the word "is" you're a lier.
I'm not so sure. I doubt that anyone on the forum is simply an awful shot. And being proficient with your firearm can easily be argued as just being responsible firearm owners or active sport shooters. Neither have anything to do with fighting or harming any living being.
 

ODA 226

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Etzenricht, Germany
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Huck wrote:
Sweet shooting Oda! Nice pistol too. But why are you doing head shots? In the Mech Infantry we were trained to shoot center of mass which is a much larger target area than the head. My dad, who was a Paratrooper in WWII and a cop on LAPD for a few years,taught my brothers and I to do the same.

Snow permitting I go out to a place in theboondocks on public land and shoot about once a week.There aint no indoor ranges around here so that kinda limits me on practicing in the winter.
Thanks Huck! In Special Forces, we are trained to shoot at a 2 inch band around the eyes. It is the most positive way to drop your target. We called it "surgical shooting" down at Mott Lake.
 

ODA 226

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Pointman wrote:
It's kind of a dangerous topic. We know that this information can be scanned by prosecutors, and if someone had a defensive shooting it could be a mess in court. If you don't shoot well then it's negligence. If you do, you were looking for a fight. If you used the word "is" you're a lier.


You're absolutely correct! This is a dangerous topic! And this is EXACTLY the reason why I started it!

Virtually everyone here can operate a handgun with a reasonable degree of proficiency. The INTENT of this thread was to promote responsible gun ownership/ OC & CC carrying by encouraging all of us to constantly strive to improve our shooting proficency andto know our shooting limitations.

Regular practice with your carry weapon and ammunition WILL IMPROVE your demonstrated shooting ability and keeping a record of your sessions WILL ASSIST YOU IN COURT if you are ever unfortunate enough to be involved in a shooting. This is the reason all record firings for qualification with my former department was recorded with the actual target being put on permanent file. All of our sessions in the kill house in Special Forces was videotaped and likewise put on file.

WhatI strongly feel is more dangerous than this topic are folks that DON'T know precisely what their level of technical or tactical ability with their carry weapon/ ammo combination is.

The sole purpose of this thread is to encourage our membership to put a primium on marksmanship on a personal and group level. To ensure that we know and understand laws regarding self-defense and to make us more responsible to ourselves and our OC community.

Craig
 

ODA 226

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danbus wrote:
I need to practice more.

Problem I have is with my sights (which can and will be changed) and also a flinch of anticipation.
You can go with me to the range when I return from Germany if you want. I can help you with that problem for sure. ;)
 

Pointman

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Dan, if I remember you have a .45, and at least started out with a smaller one. Even large body .45s can give a person a flinch.
 

rocknsnow

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Oct 22, 2007
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Layton, Utah, USA
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i shoot almost twice a week at Rangemasters in Springville, UT. I have a membership there and anyone is welcome to join me. Won't cost you anything to get in if you go with me.

Drill are great. I have had the chance to play with a lot of Special Forces guys (here in utah with the 19th) and with shooting with the National Guard team you learn a lot of good drills.

Mentioned above was using blanks within your magazine. I know this works. I was shooting okay (i will get some pictures of soon) and my grouping went to the size of about a fist at 10 yards and i can hit with in a persons head at 25 yards.

Practice makes perfect.
 

ODA 226

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Pointman,

Excellent shooting! If your not satisfied with it, all the better! You are striving to improve on an otherwise EXCELLENT shot group! If you know that you can improve your marksmanship, you WILL make a commitment to yourself to increase your accuracy and speed!

Obviously, you are an advanced shooter who knows his level of competancy with your carry weapon and shows that you have a willingness to improve your already keen marksmanship skills! Kudos to you sir!

BTW: What distance or distances were you shooting from?
 

Loneviking

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Apr 11, 2008
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Carson City, Nevada, USA
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ODA 226 wrote:
Pointman wrote:
It's kind of a dangerous topic. We know that this information can be scanned by prosecutors, and if someone had a defensive shooting it could be a mess in court. If you don't shoot well then it's negligence. If you do, you were looking for a fight. If you used the word "is" you're a lier.
You're absolutely correct! This is a dangerous topic! And this is EXACTLY the reason why I started it!

Virtually everyone here can operate a handgun with a reasonable degree of proficiency. The INTENT of this thread was to promote responsible gun ownership/ OC & CC carrying by encouraging all of us to constantly strive to improve our shooting proficency andto know our shooting limitations.

Regular practice with your carry weapon and ammunition WILL IMPROVE your demonstrated shooting ability and keeping a record of your sessions WILL ASSIST YOU IN COURT if you are ever unfortunate enough to be involved in a shooting. This is the reason all record firings for qualification with my former department was recorded with the actual target being put on permanent file. All of our sessions in the kill house in Special Forces was videotaped and likewise put on file.

WhatI strongly feel is more dangerous than this topic are folks that DON'T know precisely what their level of technical or tactical ability with their carry weapon/ ammo combination is.

The sole purpose of this thread is to encourage our membership to put a primium on marksmanship on a personal and group level. To ensure that we know and understand laws regarding self-defense and to make us more responsible to ourselves and our OC community.

Craig
Craig, help me understand what your point is. I can't imagine records of your range scores helping you much in court. The circumstances between a casual day at the range and a 'fight for your life' encounter areobviously very different.The experts all say that marksmanship goes to heck in a gunfight, so what difference does it make as to how good yourrange scores were?
I wish I would have seen this thread before I tossed out todays targets. They weren't the bestas I was sighting in one gun (a CZ 82)and sight checking the 357--but I put 12 rounds of 20 (from the 357)in the middle diamondof one thoseC n C targets at75 ft. I havehad folks make fun of my 'big 'ol hogleg'---but I can hit better with that gun than anything else I've found.
 

ODA 226

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Loneviking wrote:
Craig, help me understand what your point is. I can't imagine records of your range scores helping you much in court. The circumstances between a casual day at the range and a 'fight for your life' encounter areobviously very different.The experts all say that marksmanship goes to heck in a gunfight, so what difference does it make as to how good yourrange scores were?

LV,

Most of those "experts" have never been in a gunfight. They can expouse "theory" and not much more.....

If you train as you fight, your marksmanship skills during the real deal are not diminished. I've found that through intensive training, my senses and marksmanship ability were actually heightened when the fight went down.

Record firing and filing scores/ weapon and ammo combos, I believe are SOP for most police departments. IT DOES HELP IN COURT IF YOU ARE INVOLVED IN A SHOOTING INCIDENT! This why records are kept on file. Can only other LEOs/ former LEOs chime in here?
 

Felid`Maximus

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Nov 12, 2007
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Reno, Nevada, USA
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Huck wrote:
Sweet shooting Oda! Nice pistol too. But why are you doing head shots? In the Mech Infantry we were trained to shoot center of mass which is a much larger target area than the head. My dad, who was a Paratrooper in WWII and a cop on LAPD for a few years,taught my brothers and I to do the same.
Torso is easier to hit but aren't headshots a bit more effective?
 

CRF250rider1000

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Apr 17, 2008
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Herndon, VA & Martinsville, VA
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I went to the NRA range today from 11 to 12 and put 100 more rounds through my Glock 19. Here is my last target. Most of it was 2 shot bursts at 30 feet. The top two were attempted head shots and then I concentrated on center of mass. Today was more about learning how to quickly load, get on target, and get the important shots off. I think I did ok for only having 250rds total under my belt. I can't wait to go to the range again I really loved going this time. I went with a friend who has a Beretta 9mm. Not sure what model it is. Anyways here is a pic for you guys. I eliminated my flinch completely from fry fire practice last week. I was very happy with that. I also found out that I wasn't squeezing hard enough on my trigger hand and that was causing my bullets to go left some.:banghead: I am working on correcting that and will continue to work on that next time I go.:) Also forgot to mention that I need to work on my follow up shots. That seems to be my big downfall right now. I'm sure the more I practice the better I will get:lol:
n1572900686_30333495_3565.jpg
 

Sheriff

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May 19, 2008
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Virginia, USA
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I had to vote, "What is a firing range?"

Our city and county has grown so large and so fast there simply is no place left to shoot. Even the local range is not an option now. The local police agencies have pretty much taken over the one private range we do have for their qualifications.They pretty much make the rest of the members feel unwelcome, in my opinion.
 

ODA 226

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Feb 26, 2008
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Etzenricht, Germany
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Sheriff wrote:
I had to vote, "What is a firing range?"

Our city and county has grown so large and so fast there simply is no place left to shoot. Even the local range is not an option now. The local police agencies have pretty much taken over the one private range we do have for their qualifications.They pretty much make the rest of the members feel unwelcome, in my opinion.

That really is shameful! Police agencies should encourage citizens that carry to practice in order to improve their shooting proficency and not discourage them by becoming "range hogs" and bullies!

Perhaps an organizedCitizen vs. PD shooting match would put them in their place?
 
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