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Thread: Arizona vs. Utah?

  1. #1
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    Wich state has the less restrictions on open carry? To me it seems like resturant carry is off limit in Arizona but not in Utah- where you can also carry on campuses.

    Any other imput on those two states?

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    no one that know anything?

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    I know a lot of things!

    What I don't know is how Arizona compares to Utah. I know Arizona is very open-cary friendly, although there are a few restrictions I'd like to see lifted.

    Since I know nothing about Utah, I cannot compare the two for you. Have you done any reading of the existing threads in both state forums? That may be your best source of information.

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    Well, in Utah your gun has to be more than 2 actions from firing without a permit. I.E. you cannot have a round chambered. Unless you have a CCW.

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    Felid`Maximus wrote:
    Well, in Utah your gun has to be more than 2 actions from firing without a permit. I.E. you cannot have a round chambered. Unless you have a CCW.
    Really? What good is that?

    The Arizona public by and large is quite accustomed to OC. Hardly ever get questioned about it. It's quite common.

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    Dahwg wrote:
    Felid`Maximus wrote:
    Well, in Utah your gun has to be more than 2 actions from firing without a permit.┬* I.E. you cannot have a round chambered.┬* Unless you have a CCW.
    Really?┬* What good is that?

    The Arizona public by and large is quite accustomed to OC.┬* Hardly ever get questioned about it.┬* It's quite common.
    Better than leaving it home! :shock:

    Don't get me wrong it is still a stupid law and since I have my permit it doesn't affect me. With practice, this minor inconvenience would not slow down the draw. That is racking the slide while drawing the gun. My CCW instructor's draw with racking the slide didn't slow him at all. As to arizona being better than utah? I think we could find pros and cons either way.

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    mazellan819 wrote:
    ...As to arizona being better than utah? I think we could find pros and cons either way.
    I agree. We would LOVE to have your school carry laws here. Our state legislature is willing to make the laws a lot more patriotic, it's our governor who is the hold up. She claims to be pro-gun, but c'mon now, it's Janet Napolitano- a Clintonista- who's she trying to kid? She wants McCain's seat in theSenate, she's trying to walk the tight rope as far as AZ gun laws are concerned- let's just see how many bills she vetoes this session.

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    Felid`Maximus wrote:
    Well, in Utah your gun has to be more than 2 actions from firing without a permit. I.E. you cannot have a round chambered. Unless you have a CCW.
    So if I have a CC permit that's recognized in Utah (I have a Wyoming CC permit) I can open or concealcarry a loaded revolverin Utah? I'm asking as I've been uncertain about this.
    "You can teach 'em, but you cant learn 'em."

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    Huck wrote:
    Felid`Maximus wrote:
    Well, in Utah your gun has to be more than 2 actions from firing without a permit.┬* I.E. you cannot have a round chambered.┬* Unless you have a CCW.
    So if I have a CC permit that's recognized in Utah (I have a Wyoming CC permit) I can open or conceal┬*carry a loaded revolver┬*in Utah? I'm asking as I've been uncertain about this.
    Yes you can. Utah recognizes any other states permit. So you can carry open or concealed while in utah fully loaded.

    Edit:

    U.C.A. 76-10-523. Persons exempt from weapons laws.
    [Quote:]
    ...
    (2) The provisions of Subsections 76-10-504(1)(a), (1)(b), and Section 76-10-505 do not apply to any person to whom a permit to carry a concealed firearm has been issued:
    (a) pursuant to Section 53-5-704; or
    (b) by another state or county.
    (emphasis added)

    U.C.A. 76-10-505.5. Possession of a dangerous weapon, firearm, or sawed-off shotgun on or about school premises -- Penalties.

    (1) A person may not possess any dangerous weapon, firearm, or sawed-off shotgun, as those terms are defined in Section 76-10-501, at a place that the person knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is on or about school premises as defined in Subsection 76-3-203.2(1).
    (2) (a) Possession of a dangerous weapon on or about school premises is a class B misdemeanor.
    (b) Possession of a firearm or sawed-off shotgun on or about school premises is a class A misdemeanor.
    (3) This section does not apply if:
    (a) the person is authorized to possess a firearm as provided under Section 53-5-704, 53-5-705, 76-10-511, or 76-10-523, or as otherwise authorized by law;
    ...
    (emphasis added)


    Coalescing what the above two sections reference into a single list, with a CFP, we are exempt from the following subsections:

    U.C.A. 76-10-504(1)(a),1(b). Carrying concealed dangerous weapon -- Penalties.

    (1) Except as provided in Section 76-10-503 and in Subsections (2) and (3):
    (a) a person who carries a concealed dangerous weapon, as defined in Section 76-10-501, which is not a firearm on his person or one that is readily accessible for immediate use which is not securely encased, as defined in this part, in a place other than his residence, property, or business under his control is guilty of a class B misdemeanor; and
    (b) a person without a valid concealed firearm permit who carries a concealed dangerous weapon which is a firearm and that contains no ammunition is guilty of a class B misdemeanor, but if the firearm contains ammunition the person is guilty of a class A misdemeanor.
    ...

    U.C.A. 76-10-505. Carrying loaded firearm in vehicle or on street.

    (1) Unless otherwise authorized by law, a person may not carry a loaded firearm:
    (a) in or on a vehicle;
    (b) on any public street; or
    (c) in a posted prohibited area.
    (2) A violation of this section is a class B misdemeanor.

    U.C.A. 76-10-505.5. Possession of a dangerous weapon, firearm, or sawed-off shotgun on or about school premises -- Penalties.

    (1) A person may not possess any dangerous weapon, firearm, or sawed-off shotgun, as those terms are defined in Section 76-10-501, at a place that the person knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is on or about school premises as defined in Subsection 76-3-203.2(1).
    (2) (a) Possession of a dangerous weapon on or about school premises is a class B misdemeanor.
    (b) Possession of a firearm or sawed-off shotgun on or about school premises is a class A misdemeanor.
    (3) This section does not apply if:
    (a) the person is authorized to possess a firearm as provided under Section 53-5-704, 53-5-705, 76-10-511, or U.C.A. 76-10-523, or as otherwise authorized by law;
    ...
    (emphasis added)[/quote]

  10. #10
    Regular Member Huck's Avatar
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    Thank you Mazellan!
    "You can teach 'em, but you cant learn 'em."

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    Huck wrote:
    Felid`Maximus wrote:
    Well, in Utah your gun has to be more than 2 actions from firing without a permit. I.E. you cannot have a round chambered. Unless you have a CCW.
    So if I have a CC permit that's recognized in Utah (I have a Wyoming CC permit) I can open or concealcarry a loaded revolverin Utah? I'm asking as I've been uncertain about this.
    Mazellan is right.

    I'm also no expert, but even without the permit a revolver would technically I think, be okay, so long as the next firing chamber wasn't loaded (so you had to pull trigger twice)


    Utah law says a loaded gun is:


    (1) For the purpose of this chapter, any pistol, revolver, shotgun, rifle, or other weapon described in this part shall be deemed to be loaded when there is an unexpended cartridge, shell, or projectile in the firing position.
    (2) Pistols and revolvers shall also be deemed to be loaded when an unexpended cartridge, shell, or projectile is in a position whereby the manual operation of any mechanism once would cause the unexpended cartridge, shell, or projectile to be fired.
    (3) A muzzle loading firearm shall be deemed to be loaded when it is capped or primed and has a powder charge and ball or shot in the barrel or cylinders.

    And you cannotcarry without a permit a gun which is loaded.




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    Felid`Maximus wrote:
    I'm also no expert, but even without the permit a revolver would technically I think, be okay, so long as the next firing chamber wasn't loaded (so you had to pull trigger twice)
    With most DA revolvers you'd need two unloaded chambers. The one under the hammer and the next one. The next one being empty accomplishes the "two actions" requirement, and the one under the hammer must be empty to satisfy "no round in firing position".

    Theoretically, you could have a DA that rotates the wheel as you release the trigger, rather than as you pull it, and then you'd only have to have one empty chamber. But I've never heard of such a beast.

    There are some SA revolvers that allow you to rotate the cylinder one-half step, so the hammer rests between chambers, and you can carry those will all chambers loaded, yet still consider the gun to be Utah-unloaded. Unsurprisingly, this odd feature comes from North American Arms, a Utah-based manufacturer.

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