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Thread: Ocean carry?

  1. #1
    Regular Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    So, last week somebody gets killed by a Great White and now this...

    Ok, so I have heard all the stories on other forums and blogsabout "we are intruding on their environment" and "they don't know any better", etc. That would be like me walking into the woods on a hike and being chowed by a Mountain lion or a bear and giving in to the animal just because it's where they live and I deserve to die. I don't buy into that "logic"..

    I have just as much right to travel, enjoy places,and survive as anyone or anything and I don't put an animals life above mine.. Sorry, I just don't..I feel that we should be able to carry tools for protection in any environment regardless of the weather, ecosystem, etc.

    What types of toolscan the good folks of OCDO come up with that might give someone that frequents a maritime environmentsome ideas that later on may save a life?

    http://www.local6.com/news/16036282/detail.html



    Sharks Bite 3 Swimmers In 3 Days
    Number Of Bites Ahead Of Record 'Year Of Shark' Totals

    POSTED: 2:57 pm EDT April 28, 2008
    UPDATED: 9:23 am EDT April 29, 2008


    NEW SMYRNA BEACH, Fla. -- [/b]Swimmers were again cleared from a New Smyrna Beach Monday after a third swimmer in three days was bitten by a shark and treated at a hospital.
    [line]



    The latest victim was the ninth recorded shark bite of the year in Volusia County, putting the number of bites ahead of the record breaking "Year Of The Shark" in 2001, according to beach records. Monday's bite happened when an 18-year-old was trying to get back on a surfboard near the Ponce De Leon Inlet's south jetty.

    The victim received stitches at a Central Florida hospital.

    Several shark sightings in the water prompted lifeguards to clear the water Monday, Local 6 reported.

    Meanwhile, over the weekend two different swimmers were treated at hospitals after being bitten by sharks.

    A 24-year-old man stepped off of his surfboard in chest-deep water near a jetty in New Smyrna Beach Sunday and was bitten on his right calf.

    He was taken to Bert Fish Medical Center and treated.

    On Saturday, a 21-year-old man was treated at a hospital after a shark bit his foot while he was surfing in the same area Saturday.

    Officials said Mark Pattison of Lake Mary was injured Saturday after he got of his surfboard near a jetty in New Smyrna Beach.

    Capt. Jack Driskell of the Volusia County Beach Patrol said the man's injuries were not life-threatening.

    He underwent minor surgery Saturday.

    In 2001, there were some 22 recorded bites -- the most ever in Volusia County.

    By the end of April 2001, there had only been eight bites in the area, one less than this year, beach records said.

    Watch Local 6 News for more on this story.





    Peace through superior firepower

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    "When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are undisturbed.

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    Well, if the shark is at the surface, I can't help but think a half dozen Buffalo Bore .44 mag +p+ rounds would neutralize it. I don't know for sure. And I think you'd also need a good amount of cleaning supplies to clean out that gun you're OCing in salt water...

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    Aren't Glocks supposed to fire under water? Or was that just a Tommy Lee Jones thing?

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    Remington Marine Magnum Stainless Steel 870

    Interesting coincidence this thread and 'piracy' under 'General Discussion.'

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    Regular Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    imperialism2024 wrote:
    And I think you'd also need a good amount of cleaning supplies to clean out that gun you're OCing in salt water...
    I saw a shark boat captain last yearshoot a 450 pound Salmon Shark with a .38 special and harpoon it twice. It started chewing the ropes and flailing all over (tried the pull the buoy under)and could have easily killed a human if it wanted to, even after all of that trauma.

    When we used to go out to catch monster halibut, we would shoot the big ones with a .410 Snake Charmer with a fifth ounce slug and it put a nice hole right in the head and ended things quickly. That might be an option as it is small and can be carried and is cheap so even if it rusts up, it wouldn't be a big deal. Not sure how effective it would be though.

    However,for firearms in maritime enviorments in general, it is really difficult to maintain them even with tender loving care afterwards. I have seen guns on boats that never touched the water rust and corrode to nothing in a short period of time. Even with HK maritime finish on MK 23's, I would assume that it won't last terribly long.

    That is why I was wondering what other options there might be besides spearguns or dive knives...
    Peace through superior firepower

    Luke 11:21
    "When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are undisturbed.

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    I have had my H&K carry gun for many years, too many to remember all of the reports that I read selecting it. IIRC H&K kept one in hot SW for a long time and it functioned perfectly.

    My personal H&K was drenched in sweat every day for ten-ish years to the point that liquid sweat would run out of all areas of it. It was only wiped dry daily after my 50Km bike ride and thoroughly cleaned annually. It still looks and works fine.

    H&K did replace the slide lock without question when I reported that it developed a spot of corrosion.

    I used to test reactor plant components for 'free iron' by leaving the part wrapped in a sea water (SW) soaked cloth for twenty-four hours, with a red smear indicating that there was un-bound iron on the surface. H&K passes.

    The MM 870 used to show a red spot here and there but they have all been polished away and I've not seen a spot.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler...ch_USP#Testing

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    Flintlock wrote:
    That is why I was wondering what other options there might be besides spearguns or dive knives...
    Maybe get one of those "plastic guns" we hear so much about...

    Or there's also the option of using a thermonuclear weapon. But RCBS doesn't reload those.



  8. #8
    Regular Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    Thanks for the informationDoug, that is a great link. I am also an HK owner and I was aware of some of the testing but that opened my eyes to a few new things that I did not know...
    Peace through superior firepower

    Luke 11:21
    "When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are undisturbed.

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    Regular Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    imperialism2024 wrote:
    Maybe get one of those "plastic guns" we hear so much about...


    Well, you heard the Solicitor General... Those wouldn't be constitutional in the eyes of the Justice Department.

    Wish I knew what those even look like...
    Peace through superior firepower

    Luke 11:21
    "When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are undisturbed.

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    Mitch Leary used one in his assasination attempt portrayed in 'In the Line of Fire.' He was frustrated by Clint Eastwood as Frank Horrigan.

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    Doug Huffman wrote:
    Remington Marine Magnum Stainless Steel 870

    Interesting coincidence this thread and 'piracy' under 'General Discussion.'*
    Sounds good to me.

    Doesn't Mossberg have a marine version of their 500 series special purpose?


    I just checked and they do, both in stainless;

    The 500 Mariner 6 shot and the 590 Mariner 9 shot.

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    imperialism2024 wrote:
    Well, if the shark is at the surface, I can't help but think a half dozen Buffalo Bore .44 mag +p+ rounds would neutralize it. I don't know for sure. And I think you'd also need a good amount of cleaning supplies to clean out that gun you're OCing in salt water...
    Possibly. The problem is water works about as well as sand at stopping bullets. The Mythbusters tested it and went up to a 50cal without getting more than 4-5 feet into the water before the bullet either disinigrated or just ranout of steam. They found out that if you are being shot at at a 30 degree angle, you only need to dive about 3 feet to be safe from just about anything.

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    FogRider wrote:
    imperialism2024 wrote:
    Well, if the shark is at the surface, I can't help but think a half dozen Buffalo Bore .44 mag +p+ rounds would neutralize it. I don't know for sure. And I think you'd also need a good amount of cleaning supplies to clean out that gun you're OCing in salt water...
    Possibly. The problem is water works about as well as sand at stopping bullets. The Mythbusters tested it and went up to a 50cal without getting more than 4-5 feet into the water before the bullet either disinigrated or just ranout of steam. They found out that if you are being shot at at a 30 degree angle, you only need to dive about 3 feet to be safe from just about anything.
    Yeah, below water I think you'd be screwed at hitting anything with a powerful weapon. Except for those thermonuclear weapons...

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    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    Speargun.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    imperialism2024 wrote:
    Yeah, below water I think you'd be screwed at hitting anything with a powerful weapon. Except for those thermonuclear weapons...
    Water is fine shielding for gammas and neutrons fast and thermal.

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    Doug Huffman wrote:
    imperialism2024 wrote:
    Yeah, below water I think you'd be screwed at hitting anything with a powerful weapon. Except for those thermonuclear weapons...
    Water is fine shielding for gammas and neutrons fast and thermal.
    Hmpf, I forgot about that.


    It would look cool, though.

  17. #17
    Regular Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    Doug Huffman wrote:
    Mitch Leary used one in his assasination attempt portrayed in 'In the Line of Fire.' He was frustrated by Clint Eastwood as Frank Horrigan.
    Must be this one..


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  18. #18
    Regular Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    Here is another terrible incident to add to the discussion... Looks like it's going to be a tough year in the water...

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24377174



    U.S. surfer dies in shark attack in Mexico
    San Francisco man, 24, bled to death after bite to thigh in Pacific



    ACAPULCO, Mexico - A U.S. surfer was killed in a shark attack off Mexico's southern Pacific coast, officials said Tuesday.

    The San Francisco man bled to death on Monday after a gray shark bit his right thigh, leaving a 15-inch wound, the Guerrero state Public Safety Department said in a statement.

    The U.S. Embassy in Mexico could not immediately confirm the man's name, but local authorities identified him as a 24-year-old who was surfing with a fellow American. The other man was not injured. The attack occurred at the Troncones beach, about 45 minutes west by car from the beach resort of Ixtapa.

    The statement said the victim suffered wounds "that reached from the hip to the knee, exposing the femur."



    The victim was still alive when he was brought back to the beach. It took so long for the ambulance to reach the relatively isolated, undeveloped beach that a bystander took the victim to a local hospital in his car.

    The man died a few minutes after reaching the hospital from loss of blood, according to the statement.

    Shark attacks are relatively rare in Mexico. In 2006, the International Shark Attack File at the Florida Museum of Natural History reported only one attack in Mexico, which was not fatal.

    Peace through superior firepower

    Luke 11:21
    "When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are undisturbed.

  19. #19
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    The best revenge for 'man-eating sharks' is to eat 'em. Only one fatality in 2006 in Mexico is likely a selection, reporting error.

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    Doug Huffman wrote:
    The best revenge for 'man-eating sharks' is to eat 'em.* Only one fatality in 2006 in Mexico is likely a selection, reporting error.
    Good idea.

    We can also wear them. I had some shark skin boots once.

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    deepdiver wrote:
    Speargun.
    How 'bout a stun stick? For that matter, I wonder what how well a stun gun would work. (Don't ask me to pick up all the stupid little flags after either!)

  22. #22
    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    Well, being that every one of these stories involves a SURFER being bitten by a shark, I'm thinking the best way to keep from getting bitten is to not surf where there are sharks. Sharks going after surfers and boogie boarders is not a new phenomena and there are several theories as to why, mostly dealing with the surfers appearing, from the shark's perspective looking up from under water to be a prey animal.

    So really, this is not like wearing normal hiking gear and running into a mountain lion or bear. This is like dressing up kinda like a deer or big salmon and running into a mountain lion or bear during their peak hunting season. If someone here dressed up kinda like a deer, was walking around an open field in an area known for mountain lions along the woodline, and making sounds like a deer and then got attacked by a mountain lion, we would say, "why the hell were you trying to act like a prey animal in a known predator area?" And "it is fun" wouldn't cut it for a good reason. We would still think it is stupid.

    Scuba divers are around sharks all the time and very, very rarely get bitten, but then we don't look like a prey animal. Scuba divers approach sharks very much like a hiker walking into the woods and encountering a predator. We are in their environment doing our thing and cautiously leaving them alone and they tend to leave us alone.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    its called a bang stick or power head . it can be put on a speargun or carried . i have worked underwater and spearfished sence 1982. they were very common years ago but laws are even getting bad in the deep blue . can't use them in many places now . its just a zip gun on a steel rod. i have a .357 on a speargun shaft. i have seen .44 .45 12ga. the biggest thing you need to do , "even if your going todo the movie glock thing " is keep your powder dry!!!!!!!!! we used finger nail polish to water proof shells. it is not the lead that does the damage , but the shock wave causing massive tissue damage .

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    Shhhh! Don't say 'lead' and 'water', we have lurkers just looking for an opportunity to sic LEO the man on us.

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    What about carrying a bigger shark?

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