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Thread: Company Policy - No Threatening Behavior

  1. #1
    State Researcher Bill Starks's Avatar
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    Background: I've been at this company 9.5 years. On a scale of 1-5 for reviews I have scored 4 - 4.5 every year. Recently I submitted documents to make changes to our company policy of Threatening behavior and how to upgrade our security measures. I've met with the head of Security & a HR manager who supported my idea changes. I was to meet with a board of VP's which has yet to happen.

    I was called into the office of my HR director today because of my empty holster I've been wearing it in support of the "Empty Holster Protest" at the University of Washington. I had to explain about the protest as he was not aware of it. I asked how is it that employees show all kinds of support for other causes and do not have a problem but this issue gets me called on the carpet.

    This guy is new having only been here 6 weeks. I asked him about my proposed changes to the company policy I submitted. Although he had not seen them I now have to send anther copy his way for review and go through the process again.
    What it came down to, I was asked not to wear a holster to work as it was being construed as Threatening Behavior. I had him explain it to me as how a piece of plastic (Blackhawk Serpa) could be construed that way. I was told if I wore it again I would be written up and very possibly terminated as this would be my second offence for threatening behavior (4 years ago I hung pistol targets of my last visit to the range in my office and someone complained).

    So for now I will comply but I’m not giving up.



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    Geez...

    I wore my old Don Hume leather for my old Taurus once because I didn't feel like taking it off while at work.

    The next day was my day off and I get a IM from "the man" asking (more like telling me) not to wear it again, as it made other people feel "uncomfortable".

    I asked him how does an empty piece of cow ass make someone feel "uncomfortable".

    Never got a response back. However this was about January 06.

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    M1Gunr wrote:
    Background: I've been at this company 9.5 years. On a scale of 1-5 for reviews I have scored 4 - 4.5 every year. Recently I submitted documents to make changes to our company policy of Threatening behavior and how to upgrade our security measures. I've met with the head of Security & a HR manager who supported my idea changes. I was to meet with a board of VP's which has yet to happen.

    I was called into the office of my HR director today because of my empty holster I've been wearing it in support of the "Empty Holster Protest" at the University of Washington. I had to explain about the protest as he was not aware of it. I asked how is it that employees show all kinds of support for other causes and do not have a problem but this issue gets me called on the carpet.

    This guy is new having only been here 6 weeks. I asked him about my proposed changes to the company policy I submitted. Although he had not seen them I now have to send anther copy his way for review and go through the process again.
    What it came down to, I was asked not to wear a holster to work as it was being construed as Threatening Behavior. I had him explain it to me as how a piece of plastic (Blackhawk Serpa) could be construed that way. I was told if I wore it again I would be written up and very possibly terminated as this would be my second offence for threatening behavior (4 years ago I hung pistol targets of my last visit to the range in my office and someone complained).

    So for now I will comply but I’m not giving up.

    You are now going to be viewed as the office gun nut, who needs to be watched. If you're lucky, they won't find some excuse to terminate you before you decide to have your shooting spree.

    You're up against a corporate HR mindset, which is geared towards maximum protection against lawsuits. Proclaiming your pro-gun activism will not sit well with these types, who will hang you out to dry in a heartbeat if they think you may somehow cost the company money or embarass it. I think you will not change the minds of these people. Especially the new guy; he has never heard of you and his first impression now screams "gun nut" inside his head as you walked out of his office.

    I don't talk about my politics much at work, at least not anymore. Some who have known me for a while know what I'm about, but I toned it down a few years back since it was getting in the way of my job. My manager knows, but he and I were college buddies and worked together for years before he got promoted. None of the other managers know, and I have managed to keep a low profile even among many of my friends at work. If somebody asks me about it, I offer to discuss it after work over a beer or something. I just find it more prudent to do business that way.

    Good luck with your resistance, and good luck with your career.

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    While it's absolutely ridiculous what gets considered "threatening" these days, this seems like a fight that's not worth fighting in the given conditions. As TH said, they'll be looking for any excuse to terminate you. At which point you may be blacklisted from future employment for being a "crazy gun nut".


    Maybe time to transfer to a job that doesn't reduce your year's performance to a number from 1-5.

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    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    I also fear that you may be messing with the bear as they say on a professional level. If putting up a used target got you a reprimand for threatening behaviour I am not sure how you expected that wearing any kind of obvious holster would not lead to problems.

    I very much appreciate your enthusiasm and diligence on the issue. However, I fear that you could cause yourself irreparable harm by continuing that line at your current employer.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    I have to preface this by saying that I am planning on leaving my current job in the next 6 months (an I have onle been here about a year and a half), so my attitude and decision making process is much different.

    I would find a nice leather holster that fits your cell phone or PDA pretty well...:P

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    Depends on your ability to get a new job...

    Personally, I could find something new in a week at this point in time. I'd tell MY manager the problem and if some new cock of the walk wants you gone over a piece of leather ciao...

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    M1Gunr wrote:
    .....I was told if I wore it again I would be written up and very possibly terminated as this would be my second offence for threatening behavior (4 years ago I hung pistol targets of my last visit to the range in my office and someone complained).....

    That is really Chicken..... on their part.



    I get a lot of looks as people pass my office (cubical).

    My hat is hanging from a set of steer horns, I have a lifelike Cobra coiled in striking position on my monitor and I have two targets mounted on my wall.

    One of the targets is to large to scan, but one of them is not.

    I will post it at the bottom of this message.

    I am glad I don't work for your company.



    Hang in there.

    PS I took a picture of my daughter's old boyfriend and made his face into a target.

    This one I shot with my 1911 A1 at about 30feet. I was in the zone that day, practicing my double taps. I shot the eye and the mouth for good measure.



    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    Nice shootin' SA45Auto!!
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    State Researcher Bill Starks's Avatar
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    Finding that new job is not as easy as one would think. If I was your basic computer admin it would be easy enough but its not. I am in a very specialized field with a non-compete clause. These jobs just don't show up in the daily classifieds.
    I had a talk with my manager and director this morning upon arrival, neither knew about the meeting and for once they are both on my side on this issue. So for now I will continue to do my job until I find something elsewhere.
    SA45Auto I like your idea. The pic below has been in my office for a year now without issue, yet. Its a combination of things, a pic of my tank platoon, rolled up pistol targets, a 120mm SABOT training round and a video series on "How To Overcome Negativity In The Workplace." I thought the combination went well together.

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    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    M1Gunr wrote:
    Finding that new job is not as easy as one would think. If I was your basic computer admin it would be easy enough but its not. I am in a very specialized field with a non-compete clause. These jobs just don't show up in the daily classifieds.
    I had a talk with my manager and director this morning upon arrival, neither knew about the meeting and for once they are both on my side on this issue. So for now I will continue to do my job until I find something elsewhere.
    SA45Auto I like your idea. The pic below has been in my office for a year now without issue, yet. Its a combination of things, a pic of my tank platoon, rolled up pistol targets, a 120mm SABOT training round and a video series on "How To Overcome Negativity In The Workplace." I thought the combination went well together.
    Glad to hear that your manager and director are on your side. That may make things easier. Perhaps your new HR person is just a hippy with a haircut (not a Vermont gun toting hippy but rather a Berkeley hate America hippy).

    I'm surprised that an empty holster or some shot up targets make people feel threatened but rolled up/shot up targets and a SABOT round doesn't phase them. It makes absolutely no sense. Oh wait, afraid of guns, feel threatened, irrational thought processes, Washington state ... you work with a bunch of liberals, don't you!
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    deepdiver wrote:
    I'm surprised that an empty holster or some shot up targets make people feel threatened
    Remember the guy who was kicked off a British Airways flight for having a Magazine with a Gun Picture in it?

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    Funny, I had a similar thing happen to me recently... I was told by a trusted friend that some folks in my office were "afraid" of me because I'm an "ex-Green Beret" and openly discuss 2A issues at the office.

    The really funny thing is that I've spent my entire life in service to either my country or community and my job is to TRAIN SOLDIERS! Friggen weird ain't it?
    Bitka Sve Reava!
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    Eagleeye wrote:
    deepdiver wrote:
    I'm surprised that an empty holster or some shot up targets make people feel threatened
    Remember the guy who was kicked off a British Airways flight for having a Magazine with a Gun Picture in it?
    I don't remember ever hearing about it. But being BRITISH Airways I am not surprised int he least to hear that happened.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    There's no way to predict irrationality. I once got a talking-to at work because I was discussing a videogame called Grand Theft Auto with the other guy in my cubicle, and a crazy woman a few cubes away overheard me and was offended by the game. I wasn't even swearing. Rediculous. In this over-sensitive, sue-happy, PC world, any moron can make endless mischief and harm to others' careers.

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    Tomahawk wrote:
    There's no way to predict irrationality....
    You got that right.

    I have taken people shooting who said it scared them because I shoot at a target with a mans head on it. They insisted on using one of my bulls eye targets instead.

    I like the lifesize head target as part of my mindset training, and told them so. They said they thought I was sick.

    It makes perfect sense to me.

    There is a neighbor kid about 14, who loves to shoot. I have been shooting with him and other neighbors many times (.22's and shotguns).

    I have let him and some of the other neighbor boys, (with permission of their parents) shoot my .45 ACP and my .357 Mag. snubby.

    One day he and another boy came by my house to pickup something and I answered the door opencarrying my .357 Mag. It really freaked him out.

    We have talked about it since and he is still working on it.

    For him, out shooting is one thing, but in my house is something quite different.

    You just can't predict.

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    Sa45auto wrote:
    Tomahawk wrote:
    There's no way to predict irrationality....
    You got that right.

    I have taken people shooting who said it scared them because I shoot at a target with a mans head on it. They insisted on using one of my bulls eye targets instead.

    I like the lifesize head target as part of my mindset training, and told them so. They said they thought I was sick.

    It makes perfect sense to me.
    Makes sense to me...




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    Regular Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    Tomahawk wrote:
    In this over-sensitive, sue-happy, PC world, any moron can make endless mischief and harm to others' careers.
    Excellent point.

    In my opinion, it's been the ongoing downfall of our society for well overtwo decades. Any chance normalcy may reclaim some of that lost ground?
    Peace through superior firepower

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    "When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are undisturbed.

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    So any update on the battle? I still find it odd that participation in a non violent protest advocating the rights of others not even related to your work place constitutes harassment. Does that mean all the free Tibet posters in my workplace can now be construed as inciting a riot? Or that some of the Chinese nationals that come to our office for training on our product now have the right to say they are being harassed?

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    ravensmiles13 wrote:
    Does that mean all the free Tibet posters in my workplace can now be construed as inciting a riot? Or that some of the Chinese nationals that come to our office for training on our product now have the right to say they are being harassed?
    Probably ... and if any branch of gov't is involved more than likely.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    deepdiver wrote:
    ravensmiles13 wrote:
    Does that mean all the free Tibet posters in my workplace can now be construed as inciting a riot? Or that some of the Chinese nationals that come to our office for training on our product now have the right to say they are being harassed?
    Probably ... and if any branch of gov't is involved more than likely.
    Well, your country is owned by China and your company probably is, too. I'd watch it with those "Free Tibet" posters...

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    Tomahawk wrote:
    There's no way to predict irrationality. I once got a talking-to at work because I was discussing a videogame called Grand Theft Auto with the other guy in my cubicle, and a crazy woman a few cubes away overheard me and was offended by the game. I wasn't even swearing. Rediculous. In this over-sensitive, sue-happy, PC world, any moron can make endless mischief and harm to others' careers.
    Luckily my manager and many others all went out and picked up GTA the day it came out, so if anyone complains about us talking about it, they will have a hard time getting any support.

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