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Thread: Wegmans = OC Only

  1. #1
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    Looks like the best grocer in the area now serves alcohol (at least the one in Fairfax)!

    They have 2 mini-"bar" areas now where they serve wine and beer - so, beware if you generally CC

    And I will add, it is also annoying because no ABC notices are posted and the "bar" areas are in the back. If you don't know they serve alcohol - you have committed a crime! Just another reason the ban is stupid.

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    This brings up a question I hadn't thought of....

    Total Wine has a sampling area, so I guess that means OC only?

  3. #3
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    soloban wrote:
    This brings up a question I hadn't thought of....

    Total Wine has a sampling area, so I guess that means OC only?
    Good point, for that matter - most grocers who sell wine seem to do tastings. I know Balducci's does frequently.

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    hsmith wrote:
    Looks like the best grocer in the area now serves alcohol (at least the one in Fairfax)!

    They have 2 mini-"bar" areas now where they serve wine and beer - so, beware if you generally CC

    And I will add, it is also annoying because no ABC notices are posted and the "bar" areas are in the back. If you don't know they serve alcohol - you have committed a crime! Just another reason the ban is stupid.
    That really doesn't seem to fit the "code of Virginia" for the definition of a restaurant.. After all, you can CC at a baseball game.. even though the concession stands serve alcohol because.. suprise.. a concession stand does not meet the criteria required.

  5. #5
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    right, OC req only applies to restaurants and clubs.

  6. #6
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    Since wegmans has a restaurant license OC does apply.
    http://www.abc.virginia.gov/licensee...;license=35598


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    Wegmans is a problem as they like to give up the cash for the gun "buy back's" in the western New York areas. I wouldn't waste my time with them at all.

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    AsI read it, those places should be OK to cc.

    §18.2-308 (J.3.): No person shall carry a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in § 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia, nothing herein shall prohibit any sworn law-enforcement officer from carrying a concealed handgun on the premises of such restaurant or club or any owner or event sponsor or his employees from carrying a concealed handgun while on duty at such restaurant or club if such person has a concealed handgun permit.

    "Club" means any private nonprofit corporation or association which is the owner, lessee, or occupant of an establishment operated solely for a national, social, patriotic, political, athletic, or other like purpose, but not for pecuniary gain, the advantages of which belong to all of the members. It also means the establishment so operated. A corporation or association shall not lose its status as a club because of the conduct of charitable gaming conducted pursuant to Article 1.1:1 (§ 18.2-340.15 et seq.) of Chapter 8 of Title 18.2 in which nonmembers participate frequently or in large numbers, provided that no alcoholic beverages are served or consumed in the room where such charitable gaming is being conducted while such gaming is being conducted and that no alcoholic beverages are made available upon the premises to any person who is neither a member nor a bona fide guest of a member.

    Any such corporation or association which has been declared exempt from federal and state income taxes as one which is not organized and operated for pecuniary gain or profit shall be deemed a nonprofit corporation or association.

    "Restaurant" means, for a beer, or wine and beer license or a limited mixed beverage restaurant license, any establishment provided with special space and accommodation, where, in consideration of payment, meals or other foods prepared on the premises are regularly sold.

    "Restaurant" means, for a mixed beverage license other than a limited mixed beverage restaurant license, an established place of business (i) where meals with substantial entrees are regularly sold and (ii) which has adequate facilities and sufficient employees for cooking, preparing, and serving such meals for consumption at tables in dining areas on the premises, and includes establishments specializing in full course meals with a single substantial entree.

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    It is so pointless for this law to exist as it clearly disarms people in the dumbest of situations.

    It is a grocery store for crying out loud!! People are not there to go get drunk. Going there is not with the purpose to drink and the primary reason to go is to buy food.

  10. #10
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    By doing a search on just Wegmans you get the following from their 5 locations:



    29477 Wegmans Food Markets Inc Gourmet Shop VoluntarySurrender
    29411 Wegmans Food Markets Inc Restaurant Active
    35598 Wegmans Food Markets Inc Restaurant Active
    53000 Wegmans Food Markets Inc Restaurant Pending
    35599 Wegmans Food Markets Inc Restaurant Withdrawn

    This highlights that 18.2-308 Violates the right to due process. It is not possible to know if a license is active, pending or withdrawn. Does the establishment have a restaurant license or a Gourmet license? The only way to know is to walk in the store and by so doing you have broken the law if it turns out their license is a restaurant license and it's active.

    "In general, due process requires that individuals have notice of those acts which may lead to a loss of liberty." Holden v. Commonwealth, 27 Va. App. 38, 45, 497 S.E.2d 492, 495 (1998)

  11. #11
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    Glock27Bill wrote:
    AsI read it, those places should be OK to cc.

    §18.2-308 (J.3.): No person shall carry a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in § 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia, nothing herein shall prohibit any sworn law-enforcement officer from carrying a concealed handgun on the premises of such restaurant or club or any owner or event sponsor or his employees from carrying a concealed handgun while on duty at such restaurant or club if such person has a concealed handgun permit.

    "Club" means any private nonprofit corporation or association which is the owner, lessee, or occupant of an establishment operated solely for a national, social, patriotic, political, athletic, or other like purpose, but not for pecuniary gain, the advantages of which belong to all of the members. It also means the establishment so operated. A corporation or association shall not lose its status as a club because of the conduct of charitable gaming conducted pursuant to Article 1.1:1 (§ 18.2-340.15 et seq.) of Chapter 8 of Title 18.2 in which nonmembers participate frequently or in large numbers, provided that no alcoholic beverages are served or consumed in the room where such charitable gaming is being conducted while such gaming is being conducted and that no alcoholic beverages are made available upon the premises to any person who is neither a member nor a bona fide guest of a member.

    Any such corporation or association which has been declared exempt from federal and state income taxes as one which is not organized and operated for pecuniary gain or profit shall be deemed a nonprofit corporation or association.

    "Restaurant" means, for a beer, or wine and beer license or a limited mixed beverage restaurant license, any establishment provided with special space and accommodation, where, in consideration of payment, meals or other foods prepared on the premises are regularly sold.

    "Restaurant" means, for a mixed beverage license other than a limited mixed beverage restaurant license, an established place of business (i) where meals with substantial entrees are regularly sold and (ii) which has adequate facilities and sufficient employees for cooking, preparing, and serving such meals for consumption at tables in dining areas on the premises, and includes establishments specializing in full course meals with a single substantial entree.
    Your conclusion is wrong, Wegmans fits every definition defined by law. They serve food, they have a restaurant license to serve issued by the Va ABC. It may not quack like a duck but it by legal definition is.

  12. #12
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    I OC at Wegmans (Sterling/Dulles location).

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    longwatch wrote:
    Glock27Bill wrote:
    AsI read it, those places should be OK to cc.

    §18.2-308 (J.3.): No person shall carry a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in § 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia, nothing herein shall prohibit any sworn law-enforcement officer from carrying a concealed handgun on the premises of such restaurant or club or any owner or event sponsor or his employees from carrying a concealed handgun while on duty at such restaurant or club if such person has a concealed handgun permit.

    "Club" means any private nonprofit corporation or association which is the owner, lessee, or occupant of an establishment operated solely for a national, social, patriotic, political, athletic, or other like purpose, but not for pecuniary gain, the advantages of which belong to all of the members. It also means the establishment so operated. A corporation or association shall not lose its status as a club because of the conduct of charitable gaming conducted pursuant to Article 1.1:1 (§ 18.2-340.15 et seq.) of Chapter 8 of Title 18.2 in which nonmembers participate frequently or in large numbers, provided that no alcoholic beverages are served or consumed in the room where such charitable gaming is being conducted while such gaming is being conducted and that no alcoholic beverages are made available upon the premises to any person who is neither a member nor a bona fide guest of a member.

    Any such corporation or association which has been declared exempt from federal and state income taxes as one which is not organized and operated for pecuniary gain or profit shall be deemed a nonprofit corporation or association.

    "Restaurant" means, for a beer, or wine and beer license or a limited mixed beverage restaurant license, any establishment provided with special space and accommodation, where, in consideration of payment, meals or other foods prepared on the premises are regularly sold.

    "Restaurant" means, for a mixed beverage license other than a limited mixed beverage restaurant license, an established place of business (i) where meals with substantial entrees are regularly sold and (ii) which has adequate facilities and sufficient employees for cooking, preparing, and serving such meals for consumption at tables in dining areas on the premises, and includes establishments specializing in full course meals with a single substantial entree.
    Your conclusion is wrong, Wegmans fits every definition defined by law. They serve food, they have a restaurant license to serve issued by the Va ABC. It may not quack like a duck but it by legal definition is.
    Yup. I've never been in a Weigmann's, I didn't know that you could eat there. Just had dinner with a friend who clued me in. Sorry, didn't mean to post bad data.

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    LEO 229 wrote:
    It is so pointless for this law to exist as it clearly disarms people in the dumbest of situations.

    It is a grocery store for crying out loud!! People are not there to go get drunk. Going there is not with the purpose to drink and the primary reason to go is to buy food.
    Not even that it disarms, it makes people criminals who don't even know they are doing anything wrong!

    I mean, you are shopping for food, how do you know you are in a restaurant that is license to serve alcohol!

    If you are CC'ing, shopping, a LEO notices, instant criminal! just pathetic on the part of Kaine.

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    hsmith wrote:
    LEO 229 wrote:
    It is so pointless for this law to exist as it clearly disarms people in the dumbest of situations.

    It is a grocery store for crying out loud!! People are not there to go get drunk. Going there is not with the purpose to drink and the primary reason to go is to buy food.
    Not even that it disarms, it makes people criminals who don't even know they are doing anything wrong!

    I mean, you are shopping for food, how do you know you are in a restaurant that is license to serve alcohol!

    If you are CC'ing, shopping, a LEO notices, instant criminal! just pathetic on the part of Kaine.
    This is true....

    But I can tell you this.... LEOs do not hang out there waiting to catch people CCing there. Now if a citizen calls to report seeing your gun and the LEO finds you.... he would also have to know that the place serves alcohol and make the connection.

    For me.... unless you are there drinking... I could care less.


  16. #16
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    LEO 229 wrote:
    hsmith wrote:
    LEO 229 wrote:
    It is so pointless for this law to exist as it clearly disarms people in the dumbest of situations.

    It is a grocery store for crying out loud!! People are not there to go get drunk. Going there is not with the purpose to drink and the primary reason to go is to buy food.
    Not even that it disarms, it makes people criminals who don't even know they are doing anything wrong!

    I mean, you are shopping for food, how do you know you are in a restaurant that is license to serve alcohol!

    If you are CC'ing, shopping, a LEO notices, instant criminal! just pathetic on the part of Kaine.
    This is true....

    But I can tell you this.... LEOs do not hang out there waiting to catch people CCing there. Now if a citizen calls to report seeing your gun and the LEO finds you.... he would also have to know that the place serves alcohol and make the connection.

    For me.... unless you are there drinking... I could care less.
    That would be great if you were the Sheriff of Fairfax. Can I say LEO229 said it was OK?:P



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    Glock27Bill wrote:
    Yup. I've never been in a Weigmann's, I didn't know that you could eat there. Just had dinner with a friend who clued me in. Sorry, didn't mean to post bad data.
    And a nice dinner it was. Glad you could make it.. we should have a MONTHY Loudoun Open Carry :-)
    Carry On.

    Ed

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  18. #18
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    ed wrote:
    Glock27Bill wrote:
    Yup. I've never been in a Weigmann's, I didn't know that you could eat there. Just had dinner with a friend who clued me in. Sorry, didn't mean to post bad data.
    And a nice dinner it was. Glad you could make it.. we should have a MONTHY Loudoun Open Carry :-)
    I'm in.

    Food, guns and friends, ain't nothing more American than that!

  19. #19
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    ed wrote:
    And a nice dinner it was. Glad you could make it.. we should have a MONTHY Loudoun Open Carry :-)
    OK with me. Just pick a date that I can make it, next time!

  20. #20
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    nemo wrote:
    ed wrote:
    And a nice dinner it was. Glad you could make it.. we should have a MONTHY Loudoun Open Carry :-)
    OK with me. Just pick a date that I can make it, next time!
    YOU pick the date then


    Carry On.

    Ed

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    LEO 229 wrote:
    This is true....

    But I can tell you this.... LEOs do not hang out there waiting to catch people CCing there. Now if a citizen calls to report seeing your gun and the LEO finds you.... he would also have to know that the place serves alcohol and make the connection.

    For me.... unless you are there drinking... I could NOT care less.


  22. #22
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    We go to the one inFairfax (Monument Drive)all the time. They have a section that fits my daughter's special diet.

    We will be going to the one in Woodbridge.

    I have always OC'ed because I didn't know if the entire store counted, or just if the restaurant section which is separate, required OC.

    I have never had a problem.


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    I've OC'ed at the Whole-Foods at Fairlakes and Alexandria without incident. I know it's notta club, but has restaurants and an on premise ABC licence(Fairlakes, Old Town location gettin' one soon). The Fairlakes location has got some good BBQ.

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    longwatch wrote:
    That would be great if you were the Sheriff of Fairfax. Can I say LEO229 said it was OK?:P
    I am not up for an election right now.... You can pass my name along but they are not going to know who I am so it will not do you much good.

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    OH LEO, you're a shoe-in.

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