Pizza delivery man shot to death in Portsmouth

utbagpiper · Jul 18, 2016

Ashley9812 said:
I was the person who ordered the pizza and it still haunts me today knowing that there were thugs just hanging around.

Welcome to OCDO.

Your perspective on this story is both heartbreaking and enlightening. It reminds me that the victims of criminal violence are often far more numerous than just those directly injured.

Thank you.

Charles

Wolf_shadow · Jul 18, 2016

solus said:
and the point of your post 8 years after the fact?

firemen are trained not to go into burning buildings ~ yet they do.

nice LEs are trained to not endanger themselves in rescue situations ~ yet they do.

EMTs are trained to save those citizen's injured, your agency's policies prohibit you from responding, not a legal standing ~ ...
that you have guilt for not responding is something you must and need to reconcile either through counseling
that you have guilt in your belief you set the death into motion by ordering a pizza is also something you need to reconcile either through counselling or ...

Bad Guys were caught, tried, and sentenced by a jury of their peers...sorry you do not like the outcome of their sentence.

please see my first sentence.

ipse

The point of your post is? I have been a fireman and EMT for forty years, I was also an instructor. Firefighters and EMTs are trained scene safety first. You are no help if you become part of the problem. Police are trained to run toward gun fire, not Firefighters or EMTs.
Your comments were unnecessary and uncalled for!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

Wolf_shadow · Jul 18, 2016

Ashley9812 said:
I was the person who ordered the pizza and it still haunts me today knowing that there were thugs just hanging around. I heard 4 gunshots and called 911. I am an emt and my first instinct was to run to see if someone was hurt, but I am trained to wait until the scene is safe. The two guys who shot him were in a gang that was nearby. The detective on the case told us about them and how one of them said he was happy that he killed him. I am still so pissed and upset about this man lost his life and those piece of **** guys only got 25 years. He worked for Papa Johns and from what I read a wonderful man. I feel so truly sorry I couldn't have saved this man and that I ordered the pizza. I think EVERY person who does delivery should open carry. The risk is so high for this line of work and also for convenience store employees. My mom lost a best friend who worked at 7-11 in a robbery. My mother herself did payroll and one night a man had broken into her car and when she got in he held her at knife point trying to get money he thought she was going to make a deposit after work. She jumped out while the car was moving and the guy ran after the car ran into other parked cars. Please stay safe everyone.

The outcome is not your fault! You did the right thing, running in before the scene was safe and possibly getting injured or worse wouldn't have helped.
I agree 25 years for murder is not enough.

Welcome to OCDO.

Infidel · Jul 18, 2016

Ashley9812 said:
I was the person who ordered the pizza and it still haunts me today knowing that there were thugs just hanging around. I heard 4 gunshots and called 911. I am an emt and my first instinct was to run to see if someone was hurt, but I am trained to wait until the scene is safe. The two guys who shot him were in a gang that was nearby. The detective on the case told us about them and how one of them said he was happy that he killed him. I am still so pissed and upset about this man lost his life and those piece of **** guys only got 25 years. He worked for Papa Johns and from what I read a wonderful man. I feel so truly sorry I couldn't have saved this man and that I ordered the pizza. I think EVERY person who does delivery should open carry. The risk is so high for this line of work and also for convenience store employees. My mom lost a best friend who worked at 7-11 in a robbery. My mother herself did payroll and one night a man had broken into her car and when she got in he held her at knife point trying to get money he thought she was going to make a deposit after work. She jumped out while the car was moving and the guy ran after the car ran into other parked cars. Please stay safe everyone.

Ashley sorry you have to live with that though, your order, could have saved him. It is a deep regret to think and dwell on something, I've been there. You live to get past it, stay safe.
I hope you CC/OC, glad to have you on the forum.

solus · Jul 18, 2016

solus said:
and the point of your post 8 years after the fact?

firemen are trained not to go into burning buildings ~ yet they do.

nice LEs are trained to not endanger themselves in rescue situations ~ yet they do.

EMTs are trained to save those citizen's injured, your agency's policies prohibit you from responding, not a legal standing ~ ...
that you have guilt for not responding is something you must and need to reconcile either through counseling
that you have guilt in your belief you set the death into motion by ordering a pizza is also something you need to reconcile either through counselling or ...

Bad Guys were caught, tried, and sentenced by a jury of their peers...sorry you do not like the outcome of their sentence.

please see my first sentence.

ipse

Wolf_shadow said:
The point of your post is? I have been a fireman and EMT for forty years, I was also an instructor. Firefighters and EMTs are trained scene safety first. You are no help if you become part of the problem. Police are trained to run toward gun fire, not Firefighters or EMTs.
Your comments were unnecessary and uncalled for!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

nowhere did i contradict your statement regarding agency's 'scene safety' POLICY!

your comment about police are trained to run towards gunfire....really...if memory serves, the highest court has stated the nice LEs do not have to respond to citizens emergencies where would the opportunity manifest itself to run towards gunfire.

since the OP claims (unverifiable after this amount of time) they ordered the pizza, i do not see any fire stations at 5600 Craneybrook Ln which means apparently the OP wasn't on duty so is now considered JQPublic functioning as a 'medically trained' good Samaritan role, which has no restrictions whatsoever on responding to those needing assistance~they didn't.

now, my commentary regarding getting counseling to overcome their guilt is unnecessary? since it is not an anniversary of the event, apparently this event is causing some type of distress in the OP's life. therefore, the only way to overcome real or perceived guilt is to find professional assistance.

sorry, might be blunt, but for this individual to move forward, they are going to have to come to grips with their action/lack therein to mitigate the ghosts who they believe are haunting them.

ipse

Wolf_shadow · Jul 18, 2016

solus said:
nowhere did i contradict your statement regarding agency's 'scene safety' POLICY!

your comment about police are trained to run towards gunfire....really...if memory serves, the highest court has stated the nice LEs do not have to respond to citizens emergencies where would the opportunity manifest itself to run towards gunfire.

since the OP claims (unverifiable after this amount of time) they ordered the pizza, i do not see any fire stations at 5600 Craneybrook Ln which means apparently the OP wasn't on duty so is now considered JQPublic functioning as a 'medically trained' good Samaritan role, which has no restrictions whatsoever on responding to those needing assistance~they didn't.

now, my commentary regarding getting counseling to overcome their guilt is unnecessary? since it is not an anniversary of the event, apparently this event is causing some type of distress in the OP's life. therefore, the only way to overcome real or perceived guilt is to find professional assistance.

sorry, might be blunt, but for this individual to move forward, they are going to have to come to grips with their action/lack therein to mitigate the ghosts who they believe are haunting them.

ipse

I still say your comments were uncalled for the way you jumped in and stated them. Way to make a new member welcome! There are many things in life I at times think about and wonder what if. Doesn't mean I or the op need counseling. So the op just joined and saw the thread and added information as their first post.
As for on or off duty, Firefighters and EMT's, They fall back on training, first scene safety, then respond! Medically trained or not you cannot help if you also become a victim and cause a bigger problem! Also do you know the op had the needed equipment on hand? As a volunteer I have been on an accident scene/medical call where I didn't have the needed equipment, because the scene was between my house and the station. Not much you can do.
If you want to run into an unstable situation without knowing all the risks have at it! I personally will never condemn someone for making the decision of caution! Be a good witness, and do not contribute to the problem!

solus · Jul 18, 2016

Wolf_shadow said:
I still say your comments were uncalled for the way you jumped in and stated them. Way to make a new member welcome! There are many things in life I at times think about and wonder what if. Doesn't mean I or the op need counseling. So the op just joined and saw the thread and added information as their first post.
As for on or off duty, Firefighters and EMT's, They fall back on training, first scene safety, then respond! Medically trained or not you cannot help if you also become a victim and cause a bigger problem! Also do you know the op had the needed equipment on hand? As a volunteer I have been on an accident scene/medical call where I didn't have the needed equipment, because the scene was between my house and the station. Not much you can do.
If you want to run into an unstable situation without knowing all the risks have at it! I personally will never condemn someone for making the decision of caution! Be a good witness, and do not contribute to the problem!

then the question still stands, why did they post eight years after the event and claim a unverifiable contribution to the event?

as for running into unstable situations...go back to your ARC advance first aid training, you will remember, it was the mandated prerequisite before anybody could be EMT trained and then nationally registered...minimal equipment to work the A, B, C issues equipment was a bonus.

if you were on duty and on a 'medical' call then i question your lack of equipment. if however, you were in a good Samaritan citizen status, who happens to be trained, and did nothing...you must unfortunately live with that!!

however, VA, as the gold standard for EMTs, used to mandate volunteers carry their agency supplied equipment with them in their POVs so if they can render assistance as necessary. perhaps the cheap bureaucrats have had a change of heart.

and please contemplate critical thinking on why the OP posted on a necropost which didn't have much activity nor substance 8 years ago instead of emotionally jumping up and down saying poor thing w/o a shred of objective evidence.

ipse

solus · Jul 18, 2016

17 Dec 09 quote: Kiesewetter was making a delivery in the Edgefield Apartments in Churchland that night. It was one of three delivery jobs he held. After he was shot, he managed to drive away to a nearby fire station.

David Tuggle, one of the firefighters who came to his aid, testified that he stayed with the victim as others rushed to get medical equipment.

In September 2008, Jamal Minggia, now 20, pleaded guilty to first-degree murder, robbery and two weapons charges. He was sentenced to 44 years in prison. unquote

http://pilotonline.com/news/local/c...cle_cfcb53fd-f7a5-5e96-9a8c-9cc00d5f9b6f.html

ipse

MAC702 · Jul 18, 2016

solus said:
then the question still stands, why did they post eight years after the event and claim a unverifiable contribution to the event?

My guess is they found the forum on a search about an incident with which they were involved, and didn't think it was all that critical to post proof when it was just a "Oh crap, I was there" introductory post. EVEN IF it is BS, does it change anything? The reminders were sound.

I'm content to treat it at face value, and as unverified, but not criticize it for what it is lacking.

wrearick · Jul 19, 2016

Ashley9812 said:
I was the person who ordered the pizza and it still haunts me today knowing that there were thugs just hanging around. I heard 4 gunshots and called 911. I am an emt and my first instinct was to run to see if someone was hurt, but I am trained to wait until the scene is safe. The two guys who shot him were in a gang that was nearby. The detective on the case told us about them and how one of them said he was happy that he killed him. I am still so pissed and upset about this man lost his life and those piece of **** guys only got 25 years. He worked for Papa Johns and from what I read a wonderful man. I feel so truly sorry I couldn't have saved this man and that I ordered the pizza. I think EVERY person who does delivery should open carry. The risk is so high for this line of work and also for convenience store employees. My mom lost a best friend who worked at 7-11 in a robbery. My mother herself did payroll and one night a man had broken into her car and when she got in he held her at knife point trying to get money he thought she was going to make a deposit after work. She jumped out while the car was moving and the guy ran after the car ran into other parked cars. Please stay safe everyone.

Welcome Ashley and thank you for sharing your story. I am sorry you had to experience that and some of the insensitive responses from "members" here. Some things will stay fresh in your memory for the rest of your life, learn from it, benefit from it, but don't blame yourself for it.

So, how did you find out about OpenCarry.org? How has the experience that day changed your life and in what way?

Stay safe,

TFred · Jul 19, 2016

solus said:
and the point of your post 8 years after the fact?

Don't be a jerk. If that's not a rule, it should be.

If you took a second to look at the post, you would see that the author just joined OCDO, so as others have speculated, I would also suppose they just found the forum, and realized they had a unique and valuable perspective to add. The information provided is a significant contribution to the forum. What value does yours add?

Don't be a jerk. It's really not that hard.

TFred

utbagpiper · Jul 19, 2016

Wolf_shadow said:
I still say your comments were uncalled for the way you jumped in and stated them. Way to make a new member welcome!

It is most unfortunate that our semi - literate house troll so often feels compelled to launch into new members the way he does. I suspect he can drive away ten new members faster than most of us can invite one newbie to join us and get active in the open carry community.

Having solus as the solitary member of my ignore list has dramatically improved my experience here. I only see his sanctimonious jack wagonery when someone else quotes him. TFred is correct about the jerkiness. Newbies who find themselves assailed by the house troll should put him on their ignore list before giving up on the forum.

My apologies to Ashley for the reprehensible behavior of our lone member.

Charles

Marco · Jul 19, 2016

MAC702 said:
My guess is they found the forum on a search about an incident with which they were involved, and didn't think it was all that critical to post proof when it was just a "Oh crap, I was there" introductory post. EVEN IF it is BS, does it change anything? The reminders were sound.

I'm content to treat it at face value, and as unverified, but not criticize it for what it is lacking.

Emphasis mine. 1+

On a side note, I know David Tuggle the EMT/Firefighter.

davidmcbeth · Jul 19, 2016

TFred said:
Don't be a jerk. If that's not a rule, it should be.

If you took a second to look at the post, you would see that the author just joined OCDO, so as others have speculated, I would also suppose they just found the forum, and realized they had a unique and valuable perspective to add. The information provided is a significant contribution to the forum. What value does yours add?

Don't be a jerk. It's really not that hard.

TFred

I noted that it was a necro-post .. but a first time poster that had some personal attachment to the thread? Not unreasonable post IMO.

I welcome the new member and hope he continues being an active participant on the forum; it seems as if he may have much to offer all of us.

solus · Jul 19, 2016

MAC702 said:
My guess is they found the forum on a search about an incident with which they were involved, and didn't think it was all that critical to post proof when it was just a "Oh crap, I was there" introductory post. EVEN IF it is BS, does it change anything? The reminders were sound.

I'm content to treat it at face value, and as unverified, but not criticize it for what it is lacking.

what reminders...
the economy still is horrible so someone needs to work three jobs to make ends meet?
don't deliver pizza in bad parts of town?
don't work for an organization who won't let you carry? (see second statement?)

uh, Mac, what reminders? please tell me what the point of their eight year olde necropost was for, save for, to elicit sympathy for unsubstantiated claims and misinformation (the shooter is serving 44 years & the driver drove themselves to the fire station) and to regale other tragic event(s) in their environment.

ipse

solus · Jul 19, 2016

utbagpiper said:
It is most unfortunate that our semi - literate house troll so often feels compelled to launch into new members the way he does. I suspect he can drive away ten new members faster than most of us can invite one newbie to join us and get active in the open carry community.

Having solus as the solitary member of my ignore list has dramatically improved my experience here. I only see his sanctimonious jack wagonery when someone else quotes him. TFred is correct about the jerkiness. Newbies who find themselves assailed by the house troll should put him on their ignore list before giving up on the forum.

My apologies to Ashley for the reprehensible behavior of our lone member.

Charles

mate, so the as usual, personal insults continue...fortunately, allegedly being on your ignore list affords me the opportunity to lambaste your character if i so desired w/o your knowledge...

thank goodness i am above such elementary play ground antics...

sneaking up on you isn't mate...gather your support group tightly around you...you'll need them shortly..

ipse

WalkingWolf · Jul 19, 2016

It is not unusual for newbies to be asked for substantiation of their claims. I don't always do it, but I have no problem with others. It should be simple for someone new to explain what the intent of their post is. Especially for a thread dead eight years. Even our own Mod has asked for substantiation at times.

WalkingWolf · Jul 19, 2016

WalkingWolf said:
It is not unusual for newbies to be asked for substantiation of their claims. I don't always do it, but I have no problem with others. It should be simple for someone new to explain what the intent of their post is. Especially for a thread dead eight years. Even our own Mod has asked for substantiation at times.

OTOH I do have a problem with blatant, and chronic name calling.

solus · Jul 19, 2016

TFred said:
Don't be a jerk. If that's not a rule, it should be.

If you took a second to look at the post, you would see that the author just joined OCDO, so as others have speculated, I would also suppose they just found the forum, and realized they had a unique and valuable perspective to add. The information provided is a significant contribution to the forum. What value does yours add?

Don't be a jerk. It's really not that hard.

TFred

ok, tfred, pls advise your perception of the purpose of the OPs necropost as well as what signifcant contibution to the auspices of open carry or even the conceal carry of citizen's firearm rights...

please advise where my advice to the OP to seek counseling for their real/perceived angiush expressed over the unsubstatiated claims they believe they put into place.

i await your response.

best regards

ipse

davidmcbeth · Jul 20, 2016

New member ran away?

Pizza delivery man shot to death in Portsmouth

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