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Thread: Don't talk to the police?

  1. #1
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    I was reading my emails that have piled up and found a link to this video sent from the VCDL alert. I wanted to see if anyone else had seen it and what their thoughts were, especially related to OC.

    For example, if police respond to a "man with a gun" call, should we completely refuse to say anything?

    [media=320,256]http://media.regent.edu/lawPreview/031408_DontTalktoPolice.wmv[/media]

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    Regular Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    Thanks for the link, I did a search but didn't come up with anything.

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    Having lived in Virginia for 12 years, and as a practicing lawyer who listened to the lecture you attached to your OP, I have the following observations:

    1. Virginia police should generally be aware that OC is legal in VA, with some exceptions. Hopefully, that will minimize the BS that local police try to lay on you if you are OC'ing in VA.

    2. If you are detained by local police, you should ask on what basis you are being detained. If you are aware of the law, you should explain why you are not violating the law. Whether you want to give your name is up to you, I see no real downside in giving your name, although I have seen a recounting of someone who refused even to give their name.

    3. If you are informed that you are violating a local ordinance or statute, and are being detained on that ground, that changes the calculation. At that point, I would not continue to speak with law enforcement, except to perhaps ask whether you will be arrested, and your gun seized, based on your ALLEGED violation of a local ordinance.

    4. If you are detained, and/or arrested, for an ALLEGED violation of a local ordinance or statute, you should ABSOLUTELY NOT speak with law enforcement, based on concepts contained in the attached lecture. Speaking with law enforcement will likely NOT help your situation, but could harm your situation. Hopefully, you have the name of a good lawyer.

    Best of luck to you in the Commonwealth of Virginia! Things here in California are whacked out!

  5. #5
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Opus109 wrote:
    Having lived in Virginia for 12 years, and as a practicing lawyer who listened to the lecture you attached to your OP, I have the following observations:

    1. Virginia police should generally be aware that OC is legal in VA, with some exceptions. Hopefully, that will minimize the BS that local police try to lay on you if you are OC'ing in VA.

    2. If you are detained by local police, you should ask on what basis you are being detained. If you are aware of the law, you should explain why you are not violating the law. Whether you want to give your name is up to you, I see no real downside in giving your name, although I have seen a recounting of someone who refused even to give their name.

    3. If you are informed that you are violating a local ordinance or statute, and are being detained on that ground, that changes the calculation. At that point, I would not continue to speak with law enforcement, except to perhaps ask whether you will be arrested, and your gun seized, based on your ALLEGED violation of a local ordinance.

    4. If you are detained, and/or arrested, for an ALLEGED violation of a local ordinance or statute, you should ABSOLUTELY NOT speak with law enforcement, based on concepts contained in the attached lecture. Speaking with law enforcement will likely NOT help your situation, but could harm your situation. Hopefully, you have the name of a good lawyer.

    Best of luck to you in the Commonwealth of Virginia! Things here in California are whacked out!
    Fortunately, here in Virginia we have state pre-emption of local gun laws. (OK, some issues, like what caliber you can use for hunting, shooting within city limits, etc. still are local law.)

    As far as being stopped for OC - the best advice is to ask if you are being detained. If the answer is "No" then you may or may not want to say "So long" to the cop as you depart.

    If the answer is "Yes" you probably will want to ask if you are being arrested. If the answer to that is "Yes" then you should **** except for giving your name andsaying that you refuse to answer any other questions until you have a lawyer present to advise you.

    If you are merely being detained, you will probably want to ask for an explanation of why - in other words, whatis the "reasonable,articulatable basis" for being detained - the "reasonable suspicion" the cop has that you have committed, are committing, or about to commit a crime. After that, you should **** except for giving your name andsaying that you refuse to answer any other questions until you have a lawyer present to advise you.

    The odds are very small that you will spend any significant time detained, or worse incarcerated, for "merely OC-ing". However, the best advice I ever paid a lawyer for was that issues are best argued in a courtroom and not with the cop on the street.

    And with the increasing frequency that cops in all parts of Virginia are encountering lawfull OC-ing, the chances of being hassled are going down. Much of the credit for that should go to VCDL for their efforts to educate local law enforcement and local government on the laws.

    Which makes this a good time to plug VCDL's appearance at the Boones Mill Town Council meeting on the 13th. http://www2.vcdl.org/webapps/vcdl/va...?RECID=3261153 Boones Mill is SE of Roanoke and may be within the sphere of influence o the eeeevvilllll Roanoke Times newspaper.

    stay safe.

    skidmark
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  6. #6
    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    Opus109 wrote:
    Having lived in Virginia for 12 years, and as a practicing lawyer ...

    Things here in California are whacked out!
    Welcome to OCDO! I'm always happy to see an atty on the forum!

    Hopefully you are in a position to at least do some little things about the craziness of the laws in CA.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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