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Shoulder holster?

Rogue9er

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Loneviking wrote:
Rogue9er wrote:
For myself, I'm considering open carry with a shoulder holster, as it seems the most out of the way of moving parts, and I definitely prefer cross-draw. Anyone have any comments, experiences or reasons why not?


For years I carried my Colt Peacekeeper with a 6" barrel in a Bianchi x15 rig. Just recently I tried an Uncle Mikes sidekick shoulder holster, also a vertical holster, and bought it. The Uncle Mikes, and other rigs that have a tie down on the side opposite of the gun, are much more comfortable and secure. You can also use that tie down to mount spare mags or speedloaders. With the tie downs, the shoulder rigs are the most comfortable carry rigs going IMHO. The Uncle Mikes rig is almost infinitely adjustable---even the retention strap is adjustable for a tight fit. The snap buttons are the type where you have to put the snap on the button, twist and push to lock it on which adds security.

As for retention, the only way that someone is going to get the gun is to come at you from the front. They can't rip the holster off of you with the tie downs. The gun butt faces forward so there's no way someone can get ahold of the gun from the rear. The gun is tucked in close to your body and from the side, someone has to go through your arm to get the gun. It's as secure a carry as you're going to find.

I will say that one thing that you will also want is a good gunbelt. Don't buy cheap, go and get a Galco or a Wilderness nylon belt as these heavy belts provide a good foundation to anchor the ties too.

I would strongly discourage carrying revolvers in a horizontal holster as if the revolver is accidentallycocked, there is no additional safety (unlike a semi-auto) and the gun will be pointing up. I also dislike the horizontal holsters as anytime you're behind someone with these, their gun barrel is pointing at you!!
Good advice, thanks. I'll be carrying with a shoulder in fall/winter for sure. I'm not sure whether under a loose and open jacket is OC or CC, but I'll have the CCW so it doesn't matter, I guess. I might in the summer, but that might look a little out of place on a skinny guy in a band shirt and cargo shorts.
 

UTOC-45-44

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Rogue9er wrote:
Loneviking wrote:
Rogue9er wrote:
For myself, I'm considering open carry with a shoulder holster, as it seems the most out of the way of moving parts, and I definitely prefer cross-draw. Anyone have any comments, experiences or reasons why not?


For years I carried my Colt Peacekeeper with a 6" barrel in a Bianchi x15 rig. Just recently I tried an Uncle Mikes sidekick shoulder holster, also a vertical holster, and bought it. The Uncle Mikes, and other rigs that have a tie down on the side opposite of the gun, are much more comfortable and secure. You can also use that tie down to mount spare mags or speedloaders. With the tie downs, the shoulder rigs are the most comfortable carry rigs going IMHO. The Uncle Mikes rig is almost infinitely adjustable---even the retention strap is adjustable for a tight fit. The snap buttons are the type where you have to put the snap on the button, twist and push to lock it on which adds security.

As for retention, the only way that someone is going to get the gun is to come at you from the front. They can't rip the holster off of you with the tie downs. The gun butt faces forward so there's no way someone can get ahold of the gun from the rear. The gun is tucked in close to your body and from the side, someone has to go through your arm to get the gun. It's as secure a carry as you're going to find.

I will say that one thing that you will also want is a good gunbelt. Don't buy cheap, go and get a Galco or a Wilderness nylon belt as these heavy belts provide a good foundation to anchor the ties too.

I would strongly discourage carrying revolvers in a horizontal holster as if the revolver is accidentallycocked, there is no additional safety (unlike a semi-auto) and the gun will be pointing up. I also dislike the horizontal holsters as anytime you're behind someone with these, their gun barrel is pointing at you!!
Good advice, thanks. I'll be carrying with a shoulder in fall/winter for sure. I'm not sure whether under a loose and open jacket is OC or CC, but I'll have the CCW so it doesn't matter, I guess. I might in the summer, but that might look a little out of place on a skinny guy in a band shirt and cargo shorts.

I carry shoulder holster in shirt/T-shirt/etc and shorts.

TJ
 

tarzan1888

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Thanks UTOC, but when it comes to fire power...you need to look no farther than the mirror.



Tarzan
 

Ford Truck

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I've got 3 of Uncle Mike's el cheapo vertical shoulder holsters and I like them. I wear Smith & Wesson revolvers. I usually open carry with an Uncle Mike's paddle holster rigged for crossdraw, but open carry with the shoulder rigs as well. It works for me.
 

ODA 226

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I advise against any shoulder rig unless you are driving and doing PSD for a few (good) reasons:

1. Longer draw time.

2. The sweeping action required to draw will force you to cover parts of your body with the muzzlealong with other people you may not intend to engage. This can cause "misunderstandings, along with a self-inflicted wound if you fire prematurely.

3. All a BG has to do to prevent you from drawing is to rush you and crowd your body with his. Try drawing when your arm is trapped between your body and his. It ain't gonna happen.
 

Loneviking

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ODA 226 wrote:
I advise against any shoulder rig unless you are driving and doing PSD for a few (good) reasons:

1. Longer draw time.

2. The sweeping action required to draw will force you to cover parts of your body with the muzzlealong with other people you may not intend to engage. This can cause "misunderstandings, along with a self-inflicted wound if you fire prematurely.

3. All a BG has to do to prevent you from drawing is to rush you and crowd your body with his. Try drawing when your arm is trapped between your body and his. It ain't gonna happen.

Some comments:

1. Yes, a bit longer draw time, but it's not any worse than trying to drag it out of a smart carry holster, or a belly band holster.

2. The second objection is one I just don't agree with at least for revolvers. The arc you cover the muzzle with is very small, and at least with a vertical holster, you aren't exposing any more of your body than you are with a side draw rig. Further, with a revolver, unless you're doing something really stupid, you aren't going to have an accidental discharge. Heck, with the Uncle Mike rig my gun is snuggled in so far that I can't even put my finger on the trigger until the gun is about a third of the way out.

3. I'm calling BS on this one. Let him rush me as I've got a combat folding knife. I 'blade' turning my right side to him and holding him off with the knife. That allows the left hand to draw and he would be lined up just as I cleared the holster. Drop the right hand and fire. I've done it in drills and it works.
 

casullshooter

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I use a WWII USMC Officers shoulder rig to carry a full size 1911. It keeps the 1911 under and to the front of the left arm with the barrel facing down. Much more convenient for driving and movement. The large frame SS Para does get a few:what:from time to time, but most approve around PW County here.

Can be found at the Sportsmansguide.com
 

tarzan1888

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ODA 226 wrote:
I advise against any shoulder rig unless you are driving and doing PSD for a few (good) reasons:

1. Longer draw time.

2. The sweeping action required to draw will force you to cover parts of your body with the muzzle along with other people you may not intend to engage. This can cause "misunderstandings, along with a self-inflicted wound if you fire prematurely.

3. All a BG has to do to prevent you from drawing is to rush you and crowd your body with his. Try drawing when your arm is trapped between your body and his. It ain't gonna happen.



1. Maybe, but no slowwer than any cross-draw, and better than a fannypack.

2. Not true. As with any cross draw, you cover none of your body.

Have you ever worn a shoulder rig?

3. Nope. Have you ever played football?

All it takes is a straight arm, with your left arm.

Tarzan
 

Rogue9er

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tarzan1888 wrote:
ODA 226 wrote:
I advise against any shoulder rig unless you are driving and doing PSD for a few (good) reasons:

1. Longer draw time.

2. The sweeping action required to draw will force you to cover parts of your body with the muzzlealong with other people you may not intend to engage. This can cause "misunderstandings, along with a self-inflicted wound if you fire prematurely.

3. All a BG has to do to prevent you from drawing is to rush you and crowd your body with his. Try drawing when your arm is trapped between your body and his. It ain't gonna happen.



1. Maybe, but no slowwer than any cross-draw, and better than a fannypack.

2. Not true. As with any cross draw, you cover none of your body.

Have you ever worn a shoulder rig?

3. Nope. Have you ever played football?

All it takes is a straight arm, with your left arm.

Tarzan

Good points, Tarz. I might go with the Bencao over a stiff-arm.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=gBr-sAy-tu0
 

tarzan1888

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Ford Truck wrote:
I've got 3 of Uncle Mike's el cheapo vertical shoulder holsters and I like them.  I wear Smith & Wesson revolvers.  I usually open carry with an Uncle Mike's paddle holster rigged for crossdraw, but open carry with the shoulder rigs as well.  It works for me.

I have 2 Uncle Mikes shoulder rigs. One vertical and 1 horizontal.

They are OK, but the fabric is not near as comfortable, for me, as leather.

If you plan on using it a lot, think leather, as the fabric and velcro won't last like leather.

If Uncle Mikes works for you, that's OK by me.

Tarzan
 

deepdiver

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Loneviking wrote:
ODA 226 wrote:
Some comments:

3. I'm calling BS on this one. Let him rush me as I've got a combat folding knife. I 'blade' turning my right side to him and holding him off with the knife. That allows the left hand to draw and he would be lined up just as I cleared the holster. Drop the right hand and fire. I've done it in drills and it works.
Yeah, um, yeah. I'm not saying it won't work for anyone under any circumstances, or for you as I have no idea as to your combat training and background, but I will say that for 99% of the population it isn't going to happen. Ever. You certainly aren't going to be "holding off" the BG with a pocket knife if he rushes you.

Unless someone is rushing you from a goodly distance (in which case it is a charge rather than a rush), once the rush starts it is committed. In other words, from 8-12 feet, if he rushes you, his tunnel vision and momentum are unlikely to enable him to stop regardless if you blade and draw a knife, assuming the attacker even sees the knife. If the attacker has a knife, he is going to be doing a prison yard rush on you, which for those not highly, highly trained in knife fighting is virtually impossible to defend against once contact is made. You may not die, but if he gets to you, you are getting stabbed more than once. Frankly, in that scenario, the hell with drawing the knife. Diverts your focus. Focus on only one thing -- getting out your pistol and making it go bang at the BG until he stops aggressing.

I'm not saying don't carry in a shoulder holster. Heck, I plan to purchase one for myself. And I doubt that for most people that the one time he needs his pistol in a life or death situation it is going to be a "rushed by a BG" scenario. But I can think of think it almost zero chance that a rush, in progress, in a scenario justifying lethal force is going to be stopped by drawing a knife. A charge might be, but not a rush.

Edit: correction to clarify what I meant.
 

Rogue9er

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deepdiver wrote:
Loneviking wrote:
ODA 226 wrote:
Some comments:

3. I'm calling BS on this one. Let him rush me as I've got a combat folding knife. I 'blade' turning my right side to him and holding him off with the knife. That allows the left hand to draw and he would be lined up just as I cleared the holster. Drop the right hand and fire. I've done it in drills and it works.
Yeah, um, yeah. I'm not saying it won't work for anyone under any circumstances, or for you as I have no idea as to your combat training and background, but I will say that for 99% of the population it isn't going to happen. Ever. You certainly aren't going to be "holding off" the BG with a pocket knife if he rushes you.

Unless someone is rushing you from a goodly distance (in which case it is a charge rather than a rush), once the rush starts it is committed. In other words, from 8-12 feet, if he rushes you, his tunnel vision and momentum are unlikely to enable him to stop regardless if you blade and draw a knife, assuming the attacker even sees the knife. If the attacker has a knife, he is going to be doing a prison yard rush on you, which for those not highly, highly trained in knife fighting is virtually impossible to defend against once contact is made. You may not die, but if he gets to you, you are getting stabbed more than once. Frankly, in that scenario, the hell with drawing the knife. Diverts your focus. Focus on only one thing -- getting out your pistol and making it go bang at the BG until he stops aggressing.

I'm not saying don't carry in a shoulder holster. Heck, I plan to purchase one for myself. And I doubt that for most people that the one time he needs his pistol in a life or death situation it is going to be a "rushed by a BG" scenario. But I can think of think it almost zero chance that a rush, in progress, in a scenario justifying lethal force is going to be stopped by drawing a knife. A charge might be, but not a rush.

Edit: correction to clarify what I meant.
Like I said, a solid and distance-giving kick to the chest or face would be the best slowdown, if not an outright dead stopper. Then again, I've spent way more time with h2h than with pistols.
 

Weak 9mm

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My Wado Ryu instructor always made the point of telling us about his street encounters.


One guy spit on him when he was in his 20's (This was in the 70's), and it escalated to the point that my instructor backfisted the guy in the face. Considering the power this man can develop, it was probably a severe impact. He trained in Japan under the man who created Wado Ryu (Ōtsuka). He was awarded the rank of Shodan by the All-Japan Karate-Do Federation in 1979. His dojo is in his home, and he only teaches people who have proven beyond any doubt that they are committed to it. He does not operate a belt mill, that's for sure, as very few people have ever received a black belt from him. Anyway, it blew a few of this guy's teeth out and cut his cheek open from what I recall. The guy simply got angry; as Swayze says in Roadhouse, "pain don't hurt," lol. It did not even seem to bother him. He hit my instructor squarely in the jaw, knocking him out for a number of seconds at the very least. When he got up, the guy was already in his car driving away.

He always said, "If you want defense, buy a gun." I believe he could defend himself at this point, but it's taken him a lifetime of dedication, and even then he's fully aware that there are people that can take pretty much anything you can dish out, and must be incapacitated to be stopped. Not sure why your post reminded me of that, but it's an interesting story.
 

tarzan1888

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Weak 9mm wrote:
My Wado Ryu instructor always made the point of telling us about his street encounters.


One guy spit on him when he was in his 20's (This was in the 70's), and it escalated to the point that my instructor backfisted the guy in the face. Considering the power this man can develop, it was probably a severe impact. He trained in Japan under the man who created Wado Ryu (Ōtsuka). He was awarded the rank of Shodan by the All-Japan Karate-Do Federation in 1979. His dojo is in his home, and he only teaches people who have proven beyond any doubt that they are committed to it. He does not operate a belt mill, that's for sure, as very few people have ever received a black belt from him. Anyway, it blew a few of this guy's teeth out and cut his cheek open from what I recall. The guy simply got angry; as Swayze says in Roadhouse, "pain don't hurt," lol. It did not even seem to bother him. He hit my instructor squarely in the jaw, knocking him out for a number of seconds at the very least. When he got up, the guy was already in his car driving away.

He always said, "If you want defense, buy a gun." I believe he could defend himself at this point, but it's taken him a lifetime of dedication, and even then he's fully aware that there are people that can take pretty much anything you can dish out, and must be incapacitated to be stopped. Not sure why your post reminded me of that, but it's an interesting story.

Good story.

The point you make is well shown in Raiders of the Lost Ark, wnen Indy runs into that huge Arab with the big sword, but rather than fight him, Indy just pulls out his gun and shoots hin.


Tarzan
 

streetdoc

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Mine just got delivered by UPS today, can't wait to try iy out on the motorcycle. I went with High Noon Holsters since there are not very many makers of holsters for the CZ 40B. Usually I have totry out the holsters madefor a Sig 226 to see if it will work.
 

streetdoc

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The shoulder holster works great on the motorcycle, secure, comfortable and wore it all day on a ride. Its not my first choice for a everyday holster but it will be what I use while riding.
 

FogRider

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I've been wearing mine for a week now, and have been very happy with it. It's better than a hip holster in my truck, and seems to work out alright on my motorcycle.
 

tarzan1888

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FogRider wrote:
I've been wearing mine for a week now, and have been very happy with it. It's better than a hip holster in my truck, and seems to work out alright on my motorcycle.

Don't be afraid to do some fine tuning on the fit. I have found that it takes awhile till you get it just right. I am glad you like it. :)



Tarzan
 

ODA 226

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Loneviking wrote:
ODA 226 wrote:
I advise against any shoulder rig unless you are driving and doing PSD for a few (good) reasons:

1. Longer draw time.

2. The sweeping action required to draw will force you to cover parts of your body with the muzzlealong with other people you may not intend to engage. This can cause "misunderstandings, along with a self-inflicted wound if you fire prematurely.

3. All a BG has to do to prevent you from drawing is to rush you and crowd your body with his. Try drawing when your arm is trapped between your body and his. It ain't gonna happen.
Some comments:

1. Yes, a bit longer draw time, but it's not any worse than trying to drag it out of a smart carry holster, or a belly band holster.
Draw time is longer than strong-side, but a smart carry holster isn't so "smart" and a belly band holster is only good for deep concealment and only when you have time to react and draw at your leasure.

2. The second objection is one I just don't agree with at least for revolvers. The arc you cover the muzzle with is very small, and at least with a vertical holster, you aren't exposing any more of your body than you are with a side draw rig. Further, with a revolver, unless you're doing something really stupid, you aren't going to have an accidental discharge. Heck, with the Uncle Mike rig my gun is snuggled in so far that I can't even put my finger on the trigger until the gun is about a third of the way out.
Again, a side or cross draw holster is only preferable for times when you are driving a vehicle and you need easy access to your primary weapon.

3. I'm calling BS on this one. Let him rush me as I've got a combat folding knife. I 'blade' turning my right side to him and holding him off with the knife. That allows the left hand to draw and he would be lined up just as I cleared the holster. Drop the right hand and fire. I've done it in drills and it works.
You can call BS, however any LEO here that has taken any Officer Survival Training will tell you that this is one of the demonstrated techniques for weapon take aways and this is one reason that you very seldom (if ever) see plainclothes officers carrying crossdraw or with shoulder rigs.
Everyone has their preferences for carry. This is simply not one for me UNLESS I'm the driver for a PSD.
 
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