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Thread: PA state rep for Dickson City supports open carry rights! Lacawanna refuses to release 911 tapes!

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    http://www.thetimes-tribune.com/site...5898&rfi=6

    Staback: Respect gun law

    BY CHARLES SCHILLINGER
    STAFF WRITER

    05/17/2008

    One of Pennsylvania’s most staunch supporters of gun rights is also the longtime state representative for Dickson City, where a community recently sparred with gun-rights advocates who were openly carrying guns in a restaurant.

    And while Rep. Ed Sta-back, D-Olyphant, said he could understand residents’ concerns about people being openly armed in public, the law permits it and he supports it.

    “It’s the law today. ... And it’s been that way forever in the state and has not been a problem to date,” Mr. Staback said. “But I think if it was me personally, and I needed to carry a gun, I think I would apply for a concealed-weapon permit.”

    There is no permit requirement to openly carry a firearm in Pennsylvania.

    Two Dickson City police officers responded to Old Country Buffet on May 9 after calls from patrons concerned about several customers who were openly armed. The openly carrying customers, along with other gun-rights advocates, later attended a Dickson City Borough Council meeting alleging they were harassed, and one inappropriately detained, by police.

    Facts surrounding the incident are still unclear, and a Dickson City police incident report will not be available until next week. Lackawanna County officials have declined to release the 911 tapes that led to the incident.

    Mr. Staback said he doesn’t blame customers for calling the police.

    “Here in this area, where you don’t see (people openly carrying), I could well understand people’s anxiety. Sitting there, I probably would take a double look myself,” he said. “But I am comfortable knowing an individual carrying (openly) is not a criminal. Because if he was, he certainly wouldn’t be advertising the fact.”

    Mr. Staback, chairman of the Game and Fisheries Committee, has been credited for playing key roles in gun legislation and, last fall, for working to resolve the Pennsylvania Instant Check System shutdown during dove season. He also was named Legislator of the Year by the National Association of Firearms Retailers, the first Pennsylvanian to gain that recognition.

    He said there is no need to change the law.

    “They have every right to carry a weapon, a handgun, and I will defend that right to do that,” Mr. Staback said. “And I think the support wouldn’t be in General Assembly, where that change would need to be made. ... I think it would be extremely, extremely difficult.”

    Police Chief William Stadnitski, who defends his officers’ handling of the situation, said he believed the gun-rights advocates were trying to raise public awareness about gun rights by meeting together and openly carrying at restaurants. Similar meetings at restaurants have been reported in Virginia as well, according to The Associated Press.

    If that is the case, Mr. Staback said he doesn’t agree with it.

    “Sometimes, it’s better you let a sleeping dog lie,” he said. “I don’t know what point you prove by conducting such meetings, and you could end up putting a focus on an issue that isn’t being focused on.”

    Contact the writer: cschillinger@timesshamrock.com

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    Regular Member Flintlock's Avatar
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    Mike wrote:
    Facts surrounding the incident are still unclear, and a Dickson City police incident report will not be available until next week. Lackawanna County officials have declined to release the 911 tapes that led to the incident.

    Is it legal for them not to release them?
    Peace through superior firepower

    Luke 11:21
    "When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are undisturbed.

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    How can they refuse to release 911 tapes? Aren't they covered by the FOIA? If they are just saying they won't voluntarily release them, I guess someone will have to file a FOIA request. Danbus has done that here on a number of occasions. There was some foot-draggin, but he always got the recordings. If I recall correctly, he told me he was open-carrying each time he went to the police stations to get the paperwork.



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    I do so tire of these thugs and petty bureaucratic tyrants who refuse to obey the law. They do need to pay a penalty for such actions. If it costs them nothing to oppress us, then they will do it for as long as they care to without fear.

    One day tyrants like those will learn the folly of that oppression, and reap the true wages of their actions.



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    The problem here is that, at least in the 2 911 tapes that I FOIAed in VA, you uncover obvious gun bigots calling in not because they think there is an emergency, but because they want to get somebody in trouble, and in one case, Tony's Pizza, the caller is like a little pyromaniac, sticking around to watch the conflagration.



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    Skeptic wrote:
    I do so tire of these thugs and petty bureaucratic tyrants who refuse to obey the law. They do need to pay a penalty for such actions. If it costs them nothing to oppress us, then they will do it for as long as they care to without fear.

    One day tyrants like those will learn the folly of that oppression, and reap the true wages of their actions.
    Not only does it not cost them anything to opress us, but they confiscate the wealth with which to opress us from the citizens at the point of a gun. It is like being forced to pay your own executioner.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    Skeptic wrote:
    I do so tire of these thugs and petty bureaucratic tyrants who refuse to obey the law. They do need to pay a penalty for such actions. If it costs them nothing to oppress us, then they will do it for as long as they care to without fear.

    One day tyrants like those will learn the folly of that oppression, and reap the true wages of their actions.

    ....................:celebrate

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    I'd say that Staback is taking a pretty big stand. He has taken an unpopular position among his constituency, and unless he wanted to commit political suicide, I'd tend to think he's serious about his feelings on the issue.

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    Quote:

    “They have every right to carry a weapon, a handgun, and I will defend that right to do that,” Mr. Staback said. “And I think the support wouldn’t be in General Assembly, where that change would need to be made. ... I think it would be extremely, extremely difficult.”

    Police Chief William Stadnitski, who defends his officers’ handling of the situation, said he believed the gun-rights advocates were trying to raise public awareness about gun rights by meeting together and openly carrying at restaurants. Similar meetings at restaurants have been reported in Virginia as well, according to The Associated Press.

    If that is the case, Mr. Staback said he doesn’t agree with it.

    “Sometimes, it’s better you let a sleeping dog lie,” he said. “I don’t know what point you prove by conducting such meetings, and you could end up putting a focus on an issue that isn’t being focused on.”


    :endQuote



    Hmm. While I certainly appreciate Rep. Stabacks support of the Second Amend., I really don't like him implying that we should only exercise one right at a time...


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    Mike wrote:
    http://www.thetimes-tribune.com/site...5898&rfi=6

    He said there is no need to change the law.

    “They have every right to carry a weapon, a handgun, and I will defend that right to do that,” Mr. Staback said. “And I think the support wouldn’t be in General Assembly, where that change would need to be made. ... I think it would be extremely, extremely difficult.”

    Police Chief William Stadnitski, who defends his officers’ handling of the situation, said he believed the gun-rights advocates were trying to raise public awareness about gun rights by meeting together and openly carrying at restaurants. Similar meetings at restaurants have been reported in Virginia as well, according to The Associated Press.

    If that is the case, Mr. Staback said he doesn’t agree with it.

    “Sometimes, it’s better you let a sleeping dog lie,” he said. “I don’t know what point you prove by conducting such meetings, and you could end up putting a focus on an issue that isn’t being focused on.”

    Contact the writer: cschillinger@timesshamrock.com
    Excuse my ignorance but if that is pro 2a advocate I'm confused.

    Open carry is the RIGHT to bear arms. Concealed carry is the states permission to hide a gun.

    There is no law against it because IT is a fundemental right.

    He doesn't agree with it?

    Sleeping dog lie?

    No focus on the 2A?



    It's legal! People meeting for dinner exercising thier 2A RIGHT. And he sees it as an issue.


    Make no mistake about it. Open carry is the ONLY way to exercise your RIGHT to BEAR ARMS.


    Carrying concealed is exercising your permission to carry concealed. You may be bearing arms but not your rights. Looking out for number one but never an exercise of your 2A rights. 'Shall issue' is permission from the state because you have to ask.

    If you need a hunting license to hunt you need the states permission. If you can hunt without NEEDING a license you are exercising your rights.

    What seems to be everybodies problem understanding this?
    Don't exercise your right or I may lose my permission?

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    stephpd wrote:
    SNIP Excuse my ignorance but...
    +1
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Make no mistake about it. Open carry is the ONLY way to exercise your RIGHT to BEAR ARMS.


    Carrying concealed is exercising your permission to carry concealed. You may be bearing arms but not your rights. Looking out for number one but never an exercise of your 2A rights. 'Shall issue' is permission from the state because you have to ask.

    If you need a hunting license to hunt you need the states permission. If you can hunt without NEEDING a license you are exercising your rights.

    What seems to be everybodies problem understanding this?
    Don't exercise your right or I may lose my permission?
    Now that is the best description as to why we should open carry I've seen in months!

    +1000!

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    Mike wrote:
    http://www.thetimes-tribune.com/site...5898&rfi=6

    Staback: Respect gun law

    BY CHARLES SCHILLINGER
    STAFF WRITER

    05/17/2008

    One of Pennsylvania’s most staunch supporters of gun rights is also the longtime state representative for Dickson City, where a community recently sparred with gun-rights advocates who were openly carrying guns in a restaurant.

    And while Rep. Ed Sta-back, D-Olyphant, said he could understand residents’ concerns about people being openly armed in public, the law permits it and he supports it.

    “It’s the law today. ... And it’s been that way forever in the state and has not been a problem to date,” Mr. Staback said. “But I think if it was me personally, and I needed to carry a gun, I think I would apply for a concealed-weapon permit.”

    There is no permit requirement to openly carry a firearm in Pennsylvania.

    Two Dickson City police officers responded to Old Country Buffet on May 9 after calls from patrons concerned about several customers who were openly armed. The openly carrying customers, along with other gun-rights advocates, later attended a Dickson City Borough Council meeting alleging they were harassed, and one inappropriately detained, by police.

    Facts surrounding the incident are still unclear, and a Dickson City police incident report will not be available until next week. Lackawanna County officials have declined to release the 911 tapes that led to the incident.

    Mr. Staback said he doesn’t blame customers for calling the police.

    “Here in this area, where you don’t see (people openly carrying), I could well understand people’s anxiety. Sitting there, I probably would take a double look myself,” he said. “But I am comfortable knowing an individual carrying (openly) is not a criminal. Because if he was, he certainly wouldn’t be advertising the fact.”

    Mr. Staback, chairman of the Game and Fisheries Committee, has been credited for playing key roles in gun legislation and, last fall, for working to resolve the Pennsylvania Instant Check System shutdown during dove season. He also was named Legislator of the Year by the National Association of Firearms Retailers, the first Pennsylvanian to gain that recognition.

    He said there is no need to change the law.

    “They have every right to carry a weapon, a handgun, and I will defend that right to do that,” Mr. Staback said. “And I think the support wouldn’t be in General Assembly, where that change would need to be made. ... I think it would be extremely, extremely difficult.”

    Police Chief William Stadnitski, who defends his officers’ handling of the situation, said he believed the gun-rights advocates were trying to raise public awareness about gun rights by meeting together and openly carrying at restaurants. Similar meetings at restaurants have been reported in Virginia as well, according to The Associated Press.

    If that is the case, Mr. Staback said he doesn’t agree with it.

    “Sometimes, it’s better you let a sleeping dog lie,” he said. “I don’t know what point you prove by conducting such meetings, and you could end up putting a focus on an issue that isn’t being focused on.”

    Contact the writer: cschillinger@timesshamrock.com
    Typical democrap: talks out of both sides of his mouth.
    "For any man who sheds his blood with me this day shall be my brother...And gentlemen now abed shall think themselves accursed, they were not here, and hold their manhoods cheap whilst any speaks who fought with us on Crispin's day." Henry V

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    Gunslinger wrote:
    Mike wrote:
    http://www.thetimes-tribune.com/site...5898&rfi=6

    Staback: Respect gun law

    BY CHARLES SCHILLINGER
    STAFF WRITER

    05/17/2008

    One of Pennsylvania’s most staunch supporters of gun rights is also the longtime state representative for Dickson City, where a community recently sparred with gun-rights advocates who were openly carrying guns in a restaurant.

    And while Rep. Ed Sta-back, D-Olyphant, said he could understand residents’ concerns about people being openly armed in public, the law permits it and he supports it.

    “It’s the law today. ... And it’s been that way forever in the state and has not been a problem to date,” Mr. Staback said. “But I think if it was me personally, and I needed to carry a gun, I think I would apply for a concealed-weapon permit.”

    There is no permit requirement to openly carry a firearm in Pennsylvania.

    Two Dickson City police officers responded to Old Country Buffet on May 9 after calls from patrons concerned about several customers who were openly armed. The openly carrying customers, along with other gun-rights advocates, later attended a Dickson City Borough Council meeting alleging they were harassed, and one inappropriately detained, by police.

    Facts surrounding the incident are still unclear, and a Dickson City police incident report will not be available until next week. Lackawanna County officials have declined to release the 911 tapes that led to the incident.

    Mr. Staback said he doesn’t blame customers for calling the police.

    “Here in this area, where you don’t see (people openly carrying), I could well understand people’s anxiety. Sitting there, I probably would take a double look myself,” he said. “But I am comfortable knowing an individual carrying (openly) is not a criminal. Because if he was, he certainly wouldn’t be advertising the fact.”

    Mr. Staback, chairman of the Game and Fisheries Committee, has been credited for playing key roles in gun legislation and, last fall, for working to resolve the Pennsylvania Instant Check System shutdown during dove season. He also was named Legislator of the Year by the National Association of Firearms Retailers, the first Pennsylvanian to gain that recognition.

    He said there is no need to change the law.

    “They have every right to carry a weapon, a handgun, and I will defend that right to do that,” Mr. Staback said. “And I think the support wouldn’t be in General Assembly, where that change would need to be made. ... I think it would be extremely, extremely difficult.”

    Police Chief William Stadnitski, who defends his officers’ handling of the situation, said he believed the gun-rights advocates were trying to raise public awareness about gun rights by meeting together and openly carrying at restaurants. Similar meetings at restaurants have been reported in Virginia as well, according to The Associated Press.

    If that is the case, Mr. Staback said he doesn’t agree with it.

    “Sometimes, it’s better you let a sleeping dog lie,” he said. “I don’t know what point you prove by conducting such meetings, and you could end up putting a focus on an issue that isn’t being focused on.”

    Contact the writer: cschillinger@timesshamrock.com
    Typical democrap: talks out of both sides of his mouth.
    Isn't that where Hillary Clinton learned to shoot a gun? Around Scarton isn't it?
    Strong Clinton support there!

    Coming to a theater near you.
    "GUN BAN"

    "We support the Second Amendment! As long as only the police and military have them."

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    Well, we may never hear the 911 tapes, but the police report at http://scrantontimestribune.com/proj...licereport.pdf states that the 911 caller called to report "males" openly wearing handguns while eating food with their families and "were not doing anything wrong."

    See also "Report shows confusion on gun dispute with police report" at http://www.thetimes-tribune.com/site...0572&rfi=8

    PA really needs to fix their Right to Know law to cover 911 calls.

    Here are 2 example of successful Virginia FOIA requests for 911 tape records - not in both cases the police overreacted to a caller who admitted that they saw no crime committed and had no "emergency"

    http://www.vcdl.org/Tonys/Tonys_911.mp3 - Manassas, VA - Tony's Pizza 7 incident in 2007

    http://www.vcdl.org/new/Champs911CallTranscript.pdf - Champps restaurant, Fairfax County, VA 911 call transcript in 2004

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