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Sportman's Warehouse in Provo

Outsider

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Okay, so today for Memorial Day we went to the Utah Hogle Zoo (see my post in The Zoo for that information) and then went to see if we could see Indiana Jones IV with the couple we were with. Checked three different movie theaters and they were all sold out. Anyways, we decided that since we were by Provo Towne Center my buddy and I would goto Sportman's Warehouse and the girls were going to Deseret Book. My buddy wants to open-carry (yes, thx, your brother) and we decided to look for a holster for him. Well, didn't find a holster but we were talking to an employee named Matt in the Gun Department at SW. We got on the subject of open-carry in the state of Utah and he told my buddy the COMPLETE OPPOSITE of what we've talked about here and what is the law is, that you have to be 21 and no younger to even have a handgun with you in OC long as it was unloaded like my XD was (I was open-carrying). I disagreed with him and told him and told him at 17 you can OC with parental permission. He continued to disagree and basically told me I was wrong. So instead of pulling out ScottyT's pamphlet I decided not to pursue because he was starting to act like a jerk. But I had given my buddy the ScottyT pamphlet and he had read it on the way to the zoo and understands that the guy was pretty wrong. So yeah, a gun seller telling the complete opposite of the law... go figure...

But just down from Sportman's Warehouse there was Mickey Mouse and I got a picture with him!

mickey-and-me.jpg
 

Kevin Jensen

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You didn't get the memo? Everyone that works behind a gun counter is a subject matter expert. :p

This does not surprise me. I can't count the times that I've heard a gun salesman spout off some of this idiocy.
 

UTOC-45-44

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Well,gunstore clerks as well as cops "knows" the law because they "work" with it every day:quirky.

Just remember that a person under the age of 18 CANNOT carry in Public, a handgun.

Long rifle/"Assault rifle"/Shot gun can be caried either with a Guardian/Parent (Remember it does NOT say LEGAL guardian) or with a permission slip.



[align=left][size=-1]UTAH STATE LEGISLATURE[/size]
[size=-1]Home | Site Map | Calendar | Code/Constitution | House | Senate | Search[/size]
76-10-509. Possession of dangerous weapon by minor.
(1) A minor under 18 years of age may not possess a dangerous weapon unless he:
(a) has the permission of his parent or guardian to have the weapon; or
(b) is accompanied by a parent or guardian while he has the weapon in his possession.
(2) Any minor under 14 years of age in possession of a dangerous weapon shall be accompanied by a responsible adult.
(3) Any person who violates this section is guilty of:
(a) a class B misdemeanor upon the first offense; and
(b) a class A misdemeanor for each subsequent offense.
[/align]
Amended by Chapter 10, 1993 Special Session 2
Download Code Section Zipped WordPerfect 76_10_050900.ZIP 1,767 Bytes


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Last revised: Thursday, May 01, 2008


[align=left][size=-1]UTAH STATE LEGISLATURE[/size]
[size=-1]Home | Site Map | Calendar | Code/Constitution | House | Senate | Search[/size]
76-10-509.4. Prohibition of possession of certain weapons by minors.
(1) A minor under 18 years of age may not possess a handgun.
(2) Except as provided by federal law, a minor under 18 years of age may not possess the following:
(a) a sawed-off rifle or sawed-off shotgun; or
(b) a fully automatic weapon.
(3) Any person who violates Subsection (1) is guilty of:
(a) a class B misdemeanor upon the first offense; and
(b) a class A misdemeanor for each subsequent offense.
(4) Any person who violates Subsection (2) is guilty of a third degree felony.
[/align]
Amended by Chapter 80, 1995 General Session
Download Code Section Zipped WordPerfect 76_10_050904.ZIP 1,809 Bytes


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Last revised: Thursday, May 01, 2008
76-10-509.5. Penalties for providing certain weapons to a minor.
(1) Any person who provides a handgun to a minor when the possession of the handgun by the minor is a violation of Section 76-10-509.4 is guilty of:
(a) a class B misdemeanor upon the first offense; and
(b) a class A misdemeanor for each subsequent offense.
(2) Any person who transfers in violation of applicable state or federal law a sawed-off rifle, sawed-off shotgun, or fully automatic weapon to a minor is guilty of a third degree felony.


Amended by Chapter 94, 1994 General Session
Download Code Section Zipped WordPerfect 76_10_050905.ZIP 1,815 Bytes


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Last revised: Thursday, May 01, 2008


TJ
 

Outsider

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Okay, I'm confused. You say a minor under 18 may not possess a handgun but the law you stated right after that said one could with parental permission. Please clarify.
 

swillden

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Outsider wrote:
Okay, I'm confused. You say a minor under 18 may not possess a handgun but the law you stated right after that said one could with parental permission. Please clarify.
TJ quoted two sections of the law. The first says that minors can't posses a "dangerous weapon" except with parental permission. The second says that minors can't possess a handgun. Period. The parental exception isn't in 76-10-509.4.
 

Outsider

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Ah, okay. I missed that. I thought a minor under 17 could. I mis-read and didn't quite understand that second code listed. Thanks. :D
 

swillden

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Outsider wrote:
Ah, okay. I missed that. I thought a minor under 17 could. I mis-read and didn't quite understand that second code listed. Thanks. :D
I did the same thing the first time I read those statutes :)

I still wonder exactly what 'possession' means. Depending on how you define it, my kids 'possess' a handgun from time to time. I'm supposing that when we're out shooting and I load the gun up, hand it to them, let them blast some pop cans with it, and then get it back that because I'm in control of the whole process, I'm still "possessing" the guns, not them.
 

Outsider

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Interesting. I've started my own little campaign against "know-it-alls" like people at Sportman's that think they know the law. Send a little letter to them with some other information. Waiting for ScottyT to get back to me about the use of his pamphlet.
 

b1ack5mith

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i think its fun that people think they know the law, when theyre actually mumbling fools, like the ones at gun shops hahahaha
 

thx997303

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I had a similar experience at Gunnie's in Orem. I have already started assuming that you mean my brother anytime you are talking about OC and your buddy. :D I'm glad that he got a decent understanding from that pamphlet. That's something about the guys behind the gun counters, they will not be persuaded that they are wrong. They are usually older then me, so they like to think that because I am young I'm stupid. Simply not something that can be applied in every case.

Oh, don't tell me you didn't speak with a manager at least about his customer service skills. I always speak to a manager when confronted with those sort of situations.
 

ScottyT

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Outsider wrote:
Interesting. I've started my own little campaign against "know-it-alls" like people at Sportman's that think they know the law. Send a little letter to them with some other information. Waiting for ScottyT to get back to me about the use of his pamphlet.

Did you send me a PM about this over at UCC? I know I have messages, but I can't see them here at work.

You can use my pamphlet for whatever purposes you like, short of selling them. Spread the word!
 

Outsider

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ScottyT wrote:
Outsider wrote:
Interesting. I've started my own little campaign against "know-it-alls" like people at Sportman's that think they know the law. Send a little letter to them with some other information. Waiting for ScottyT to get back to me about the use of his pamphlet.

Did you send me a PM about this over at UCC? I know I have messages, but I can't see them here at work.

You can use my pamphlet for whatever purposes you like, short of selling them. Spread the word!

You should have two messages from me at UCC: 1) your Voice Recorders from UCC Classifieds and 2) the pamphlets.

Thanks on permission to use the pamphlets, I have some "plans" for them, all legal and good intended nature.
 

Outsider

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thx997303 wrote:
I had a similar experience at Gunnie's in Orem. I have already started assuming that you mean my brother anytime you are talking about OC and your buddy. :D I'm glad that he got a decent understanding from that pamphlet. That's something about the guys behind the gun counters, they will not be persuaded that they are wrong. They are usually older then me, so they like to think that because I am young I'm stupid. Simply not something that can be applied in every case.

Oh, don't tell me you didn't speak with a manager at least about his customer service skills. I always speak to a manager when confronted with those sort of situations.

Nah, I just told your brother "he's an idiot and completely wrong" as we walked away. I don't think he heard me or anything.
 

Outsider

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I found the manager's e-mail address on their website and just sent him an e-mail, but I'll follow up with a letter as well.


EDIT:
This is the reply I got from Sportman's Manger:

Mr. Hall,
I appreciate you taking the time to give us some feedback. Sorry that Matt gave you a hard time on the subject you described below. Believe it or not, that was actually his first day on the job! Not a very good first day. I’ve shared your email with my Manager of the Hunting Dept. and we will share it with Matt, not to get him in trouble, but simply to use as a training tool. I appreciate your research and sharing the web sites with us. Let me know if I can ever help you with anything.

Eric Livingston
Store Manager
Sportsman's Warehouse

Provo, UT
 

Outsider

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I'm trying to do follow-ups with all places I've sent letters and e-mail to regarding open carry and I sent this to Sportman's Warehouse in Provo:


Hello Eric. I’m doing a follow-up on places I’ve reported about employees of a company and about gun-owners carrying firearms. I was wondering how your talk with Matt went and the training you may have (I hope) provided on the subject discussed. A follow-up reply would most grateful.

Respectfully,
Charles Anthony Hall, "Tony"
http://www.charlesahall.com

Then I go this reply today from the Manager:


Mr. Hall,
I was able to talk to my Hunting Dept. Managers about the issue and they in turn did some additional research and have talked to everyone working in the Hunting Dept. to help make sure we are all on the same page. There was also recently an article in the paper on the same issue and we laminated a copy to keep on the gun counter and asked all the people working down there to read it and be familiar with it.
Thanks,
Eric Livingston
Sportsman's Warehouse
Provo, UT

I think that is progress! NICE! Now we need to get Gunnies on the same page.
 

GeneticsDave

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Great... they're using the newspaper to teach their employees the laws? :shock: :banghead:

Perhaps we should sent over some of our pamplets for them to laminate and display :celebrate
 
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