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Thread: Almost Died Tonight

  1. #1
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator Gray Peterson's Avatar
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    I came back from Colorado (Denver) on a vacation to visit friends of mine down there. Because of a recent change (2007) in Colorado law, I had no guarantee that I wouldn't run afoul of some stupid ass local city ordinance or being accused of concealed carrying (as non-resident licenses were no longer valid, and WA/CO has no reciprocity agreement), so I went without my personal firearm. I'll get to the depth of my anger at that situation later.

    One of my friends flaked on picking me up from the airport (as I didn't want to pay over $100 for parking near it for 5 days), so I had to call my partner up and tell him about the situation. Luckily, his manager heard about what happened and she offered to pick me up.

    Fast forward to around 11:30PM (about 4 hours ago). I get picked up by the manager and her husband. Her husband was driving. Nice people. So we're going north on I-5. We started noticing a car weaving through the lanes. Granted, I'm not the type to stool pidgeon, but the car was swerving to the point where the car was endangering other people's lives. So I got the license plate and called 911. Approximately 1 to 2 minutes later was when the **** really hit the fan.

    Basically the "drunk driver" started "targeting" us. Either it was a random target, or might have seen my cell phone's screen light up to call her in. Basically came really close to the S-10 Blazer I was riding in (I was backseat passenger) and then SLAMMED into the drivers side of the car I was riding. The drunk driver did this FOUR times total, and chased us for 5 miles. The driver in the car I was riding in, thank the gods, was a former race car driver and had delt with similar stuff and knew exactly what to do to keep us from having a rollover accident (which almost happened) I was on the phone with 911 the entire time, and to be perfectly

    They caught the drunk driver in Mountlake Terrace and we had also stopped there there. My driver did follow the drunk/road rage car (I didn't want him to do that because I felt like if the driver is willing to slam into us 4 times, the driver would be willing to continue the assaults further and possibly take it to a higher level, ie start shooting at us). We then saw the drunk/road rage driver crash their car into a garbage can and a PUD Power Transformer (Public Utility District up here in Snohomish County), when we saw this we turned around and headed into a cul-du-sac, waiting for the cops.

    The cops did catch the driver. 21 years old, drunk and high as a kite, saying "She didn't do it", suspended license and due to that, possibly no insurance. The S-10 is totaled (though drivable). The drunk driver also clipped another vehicle on I-5 (a Mercedes). They pretty much laundry listed the charges, D.U.I, driving on a suspended license, attempted vehicular homicide x3, hit and run, reckless endangerment, etc etc etc.

    A few points:

    When you're a passenger, not in control of the car, and you start having someone start hitting the car you're riding in with your own, you WILL panic, and you will scream like a little girl. There's no ifs ands or buts about it. I honestly felt like the bitch was trying to KILL us all in the Blazer.

    I would have been within my rights to use deadly force to stop the vehicular attack, except one thing, read the first paragraph.


  2. #2
    Regular Member Mainsail's Avatar
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    All I can say is, "WOW!"

  3. #3
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    Holy Cow! Glad you are still here with us...

    Didn't realize the Colorado changes in law since it has been years since I was there. So Denver pushed crap through to make sure they have their own way eh...

    Dang, dang, dang that was close.... :what:

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    Holy crap, Lonnie. :what:Glad you're still with us to tell us about this. (And I agree with you 100% on the monumental stupidity of the Colorado Legislature. )

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    sv_libertarian wrote:
    Holy Cow! Glad you are still here with us...

    Didn't realize the Colorado changes in law since it has been years since I was there. So Denver pushed crap through to make sure they have their own way eh...

    Dang, dang, dang that was close.... :what:
    Basically, Denver sued the State for an injunction to bar the enforcement of the pre-emption law, and won. So, Denver can draw its own firearms law. The rest of the state except for the CUcampus honors state pre-emption.

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator Gray Peterson's Avatar
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    Even after the court decision in 06 I could have still concealed carry in Denver on my Florida license until the Colorado legislature changed their law. What's funny is that I actually emailed the Senator who introduced the bill and told him that it would have personally effected me. The reason he told me was to prevent Colorado residents from "bypassing" the state law by getting an out of state license. I told him that Washington wrote it's reciprocity law so that Washington residents are required to get an in state license, but it didn't effect non-residents who may be adversely effected.

    It didn't work, and now, it almost got me killed.

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    Regular Member IanB's Avatar
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    Lonnie,

    Sorry to hear about your experience,I'm glad you and the other two made it out in one piece.

    NSL

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    Founder's Club Member Jim675's Avatar
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    WOW! That's more excitement than I get per month! Glad everyone's OK.
    [img]chrome://piclens/content/launch.png[/img]

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    My goodness. Glad you're OK.

    Obviously you would have been justified to shoot.

    But I wonder if you'd have had a tougher time with the law? They might get it in their heads you were living out some kind of movie scene rolling gunfight fantasy. Obviously that wasn't the case, but I wonder if circumstances like that would be harder for the victim who had to use deadly force. Just thinking out loud.

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    Lonnie Wilson wrote:
    When you're a passenger, not in control of the car, and you start having someone start hitting the car you're riding in with your own, you WILL panic, and you will scream like a little girl. There's no ifs ands or buts about it.
    So very, very true and the main reason I really hate to ride with others. I know my capabilities and know they are several steps up from most.

    As to Colorado, the place has become over run with Liberal morons that don't have enough sense to make it so they can save their own lives or those oftheir loved ones. My brother lives there and whines about it every time I talk to him. He can't wait to retire and run for the freakdom as he calls it.

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    Wow, that is indeed a scary situation. Glad you made it out OK.

    I've never had occasion to travel to Colorado so I did not know until now how up there laws are. Why should a city law ever trump state laws? Completely asinine.
    DISCLAIMER: This post may contain libertarian ideas and language that are consistent with the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution, including a belief in liberty, rule of law, and natural rights. It may also contain opinions critical of government and the tyrannies being committed by such. If you are an authoritarian, statist, or other freedom hater, side effects of reading this post may include high blood pressure, loose stool, severe genital itching, and diarrhea of the mouth.

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    kenshin wrote:
    Wow, that is indeed a scary situation. Glad you made it out OK.

    I've never had occasion to travel to Colorado so I did not know until now how up there laws are. Why should a city law ever trump state laws? Completely asinine.
    Colorado is turning into the Kalifornia of the Rockies.

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    Bear 45/70 wrote:
    kenshin wrote:
    Wow, that is indeed a scary situation. Glad you made it out OK.

    I've never had occasion to travel to Colorado so I did not know until now how up there laws are. Why should a city law ever trump state laws? Completely asinine.
    Colorado is turning into the Kalifornia of the Rockies.

    This is the Colorado Reciprocity list,

    http://cbi.state.co.us/ccw/reciprocity.asp

    Pursuant to Colorado law (CRS 18-12-213), the State of Colorado will recognize a valid permit issued in another state IF the permit was issued to a resident of the state issuing the permit, and the permittee is 21 yrs of age or older, AND the other state recognizes Colorado permits as valid in their state. Hence, a "yes" in the following table also indicates that a valid Colorado permit is recognized in that state, subject to their laws. When traveling with a Colorado permit, it is advisable to contact the state you are visiting to confirm reciprocity and to review that state's firearms laws.

    The state of Colorado no longer recognizes the validity of any permit issued by any state to a nonresident of that state (see CRS 18-12-213 amended 2007).

    This information is also available to Colorado law enforcement through the CCIC.











    STATE
    PERMIT VALID IN COLORADO

    ALABAMA
    YES

    ALASKA
    YES

    ARIZONA
    YES

    ARKANSAS
    YES

    CALIFORNIA
    NO

    CONNECTICUT
    NO

    DELAWARE
    YES

    DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA
    NO

    FLORIDA
    YES

    GEORGIA
    YES

    HAWAII
    NO

    IDAHO
    YES

    ILLINOIS
    NO

    INDIANA
    YES

    IOWA
    NO

    KANSAS
    YES

    KENTUCKY
    YES

    LOUISIANA
    YES

    MAINE
    NO

    MARYLAND
    NO

    MASSACHUSETTS
    NO

    MICHIGAN
    YES

    MINNESOTA
    NO

    MISSISSIPPI
    YES

    MISSOURI
    YES
    *No permit required in State of Vermont to carry a concealed weapon.





    STATE
    PERMIT VALID IN COLORADO

    MONTANA
    YES

    NEBRASKA
    NO

    NEVADA
    NO

    NEW HAMPSHIRE
    YES

    NEW JERSEY
    NO

    NEW MEXICO
    YES

    NEW YORK
    NO

    NORTH CAROLINA
    YES

    NORTH DAKOTA
    YES

    OHIO
    NO

    OKLAHOMA
    YES

    OREGON
    NO

    PENNSYLVANIA
    YES

    RHODE ISLAND
    NO

    SOUTH CAROLINA
    NO

    SOUTH DAKOTA
    YES

    TENNESSEE
    YES

    TEXAS
    YES

    UTAH
    YES

    *VERMONT
    NO

    VIRGINIA
    NO

    WASHINGTON
    NO

    WEST VIRGINIA
    NO

    WISCONSIN
    NO

    WYOMING
    YES




    I'm so sorry for this VERY scary experience. If a State will NOT recognize my permit...simple...I will NOT go the under any circumstances.

    TJ

  14. #14
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator Gray Peterson's Avatar
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    Would I have been justified? I had two witnesses inside of the vehicle who could testify to the drunk driver hitting us multiple times trying to chase us and kill us. *sigh* Besides it's a moot point now.

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    Why must each state pick and choose who's permits the recognize? Federal law say the states are suppose to recognize each other state's permits and licenses as is done with drivers licenses. So why are CPLs singled out for exemption for a the Federal law that doesn't say they are not covered by that law?

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    UTOC-45-44 wrote:
    I'm so sorry for this VERY scary experience. If a State will NOT recognize my permit...simple...I will NOT go the under any circumstances.

    TJ
    I pass also on states that don't recognize my 2A rights.

  17. #17
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    seems from thier reciprocity law that Wa and Co should have reciprocity as it reads almost the same as ours does.
    "A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity."

    "though I walk through the valley in the shadow of death, I fear no evil, for I know that you are by my side" Glock 23:40

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    UTOC-45-44 wrote:
    This is the Colorado Reciprocity list,

    http://cbi.state.co.us/ccw/reciprocity.asp

    Pursuant to Colorado law (CRS 18-12-213), the State of Colorado will recognize a valid permit issued in another state IF the permit was issued to a resident of the state issuing the permit, and the permittee is 21 yrs of age or older, AND the other state recognizes Colorado permits as valid in their state. Hence, a "yes" in the following table also indicates that a valid Colorado permit is recognized in that state, subject to their laws. When traveling with a Colorado permit, it is advisable to contact the state you are visiting to confirm reciprocity and to review that state's firearms laws.

    The state of Colorado no longer recognizes the validity of any permit issued by any state to a nonresident of that state (see CRS 18-12-213 amended 2007).

    This information is also available to Colorado law enforcement through the CCIC.











    STATE
    PERMIT VALID IN COLORADO

    ALABAMA
    YES

    ALASKA
    YES

    [snip]
    How do they go about recognizing a permit from Alaska? I thought Alaska was one of only two states that fully recognize the second amendment.

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    Liko81 wrote:
    sv_libertarian wrote:
    Holy Cow! Glad you are still here with us...

    Didn't realize the Colorado changes in law since it has been years since I was there. So Denver pushed crap through to make sure they have their own way eh...

    Dang, dang, dang that was close.... :what:
    Basically, Denver sued the State for an injunction to bar the enforcement of the pre-emption law, and won. So, Denver can draw its own firearms law. The rest of the state except for the CUcampus honors state pre-emption.
    Can anyone point me to the decision? I'm really curious to read about this. What was the logic behind the decision? Was there something in Denver's Article's of Incorporation that allowed it to trump state law?

  20. #20
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    asforme wrote:
    UTOC-45-44 wrote:
    This is the Colorado Reciprocity list,

    http://cbi.state.co.us/ccw/reciprocity.asp


    Pursuant to Colorado law (CRS 18-12-213), the State of Colorado will recognize a valid permit issued in another state IF the permit was issued to a resident of the state issuing the permit, and the permittee is 21 yrs of age or older, AND the other state recognizes Colorado permits as valid in their state. Hence, a "yes" in the following table also indicates that a valid Colorado permit is recognized in that state, subject to their laws. When traveling with a Colorado permit, it is advisable to contact the state you are visiting to confirm reciprocity and to review that state's firearms laws.

    The state of Colorado no longer recognizes the validity of any permit issued by any state to a nonresident of that state (see CRS 18-12-213 amended 2007).

    This information is also available to Colorado law enforcement through the CCIC.











    STATE
    PERMIT VALID IN COLORADO

    ALABAMA
    YES

    ALASKA
    YES

    [snip]
    How do they go about recognizing a permit from Alaska? I thought Alaska was one of only two states that fully recognize the second amendment.
    Alaska issues permits for the sole purpose of giving people access to reciprocity. It's not required to carry.

    IIRC, Alaska doesn't fully recognize 2A either, as there are restrictions on place, but it's a lot better than most states!

  21. #21
    Regular Member John Hardin's Avatar
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    joeroket wrote:
    seems from thier reciprocity law that Wa and Co should have reciprocity as it reads almost the same as ours does.
    It looks to me like CO does require a fingerprint-based background check including mental health history.

    http://www.atg.wa.gov/page.aspx?ID=2334

    http://cbi.state.co.us/ccw/Statutes/18-12-203.asp
    http://cbi.state.co.us/ccw/Statutes/18-12-205.asp


  22. #22
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    Denver has "home-rule" status (something which may not even exist in WA state law) and this has been interpreted as meaning that state preemption doesn't apply to them. I don't know why the voters of CO don't just amend their constitution to get rid of this; they've had other consitutional amendments pass recently. Just do it quick before any more CA refugees show up!

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    Lonnie Wilson wrote:
    Would I have been justified? I had two witnesses inside of the vehicle who could testify to the drunk driver hitting us multiple times trying to chase us and kill us. *sigh* Besides it's a moot point now.
    Yikes! I'm glad you made it out okay, Lonnie. :shock:

    I'm glad they caught the moron who did it. I know drunk drivers are dangerous, but I don't think I've ever heard of one doing this before!

  24. #24
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    glad your okay! Even if Denver is being ignorant, at least it isn't the fed gov't getting involved.

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    and here i was thinking my road rage incident (or better known as "it'd be nice to know i had a pistol on my side incident... but school and work says no") yesterday was frightening.

    glad it worked itself out.

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